Mega Thread Oh yeah ... did you know there are 17 other teams? - General AFL discussion #9 - Blues posters only

[passmark]

Its not possible that he did nothing wrong and this was blown up out of nothing?

Crazy talk.

 

[The_Wookie]

Funny how being a star sportsman in this country allows you to do things like snort coke, brawl outside nightclubs, and threaten to kill women, and all you are is a silly larrikin who is a good bloke, but has just had a bit too much to drink and needs to be 'educated'.

The AFL might as well cancel their Women's round. There's no way anybody will take it or them seriously now.

Its also funny how we automatically condemn people based on one woman - who wont give the police a statement, but will happily allow Martin to go through Trial by Panahi. Its also funny how we forget that in this country people are supposed to be presumed innocent unless proven guilty in a court of law, not a court of Bigfooty innuendo and suspicion. Its also funny how the Panahi article contains elements of the story taken as gospel - including apparent conspiracies by the AFL and Richmond - and yet the article that indicates he actually did nothing criminal - apparently backed by CCTV and witness interviews - isnt viewed the same way.

Im not a Richmond supporter or admirer, I abhor violence against women, and I dont particularly like Dustin Martin either, but this has been a crap shoot from the start.

 

[thylacine60]

Did he threaten to kill her?

 

[The_Wookie]

Did he threaten to kill her?

Threatening to kill someone else is a criminal offence. The police say there wasnt a crime. This isnt rocket surgery.

“After reviewing CCTV footage and speaking to all parties involved, including numerous independent witnesses at the restaurant on the night, investigators determined that no criminal offence took place.

 

[thylacine60]

All good then. Great work, Wook.

 

[The_Wookie]

All good then. Great work, Wook.

Im more than happy to hang people out to dry when they deserve it, provided there is conclusive proof or a preponderance of evidence in that direction. This hasnt cut it yet.

 

[mediumsizered]

Threatening to kill someone else is a criminal offence. The police say there wasnt a crime. This isnt rocket surgery.

He may not have threatened to kill her, but can you categorically say he didn't threaten her with violence? Can you categorically say he didn't belt his hand into the wall near her head? Have you also noted the woman in question did not make a statement to the police? Is it just a coincidence that the Richmond FC & the AFL met with this woman prior to the police becoming involved? Does this event have striking similarities to an event which allegedly took place in the female toilets at Crown Casino one Brownlow Medal night?

I know someone who is very much like Dirtbag Martin. This person verbally threatens women, but always ensures he stays just on the right side of the liaw. The women he has threatened have included his mother, his ex-wife, his grandmother & his child. He has never been charged with a criminal offence however all of these people have been emotionally/psychologically scarred for life.

I am sick to death of the Dirtbag Martins of this world getting away with intimidating women & then hiding behind the law. They are dirty, filthy cowards, who aren't even worth spitting on.

 

[The_Wookie]

He may not have threatened to kill her, but can you categorically say he didn't threaten her with violence? Can you categorically say he didn't belt his hand into the wall near her head? Have you also noted the woman in question did not make a statement to the police? Is it just a coincidence that the Richmond FC & the AFL met with this woman prior to the police becoming involved? Does this event have striking similarities to an event which allegedly took place in the female toilets at Crown Casino one Brownlow Medal night?

Threats of serious bodily harm are a crime. Period. The police statement was definitive that no crime had been committed. The woman may not have made a statement, but according to the first article she went to the AFL and Richmond first, not the other way around. And the article itself said that the AFL was referring the matter to the police.

And sorry, I dont know about the incident you're talking about. I could not give a crap about rumours.

I know someone who is very much like Dirtbag Martin. This person verbally threatens women, but always ensures he stays just on the right side of the liaw. The women he has threatened have included his mother, his ex-wife, his grandmother & his child. He has never been charged with a criminal offence however all of these people have been emotionally/psychologically scarred for life.

Not everyone deserves to be served with the same brush because of your experience. My job requires me to interact with domestic violence victims, and their partners. I dont automatically assume they are all the same.

I am sick to death of the Dirtbag Martins of this world getting away with intimidating women & then hiding behind the law. They are dirty, filthy cowards, who aren't even worth spitting on.

That too many get away with it is true, absolutely true, no question. That Dustin Martin is one, Im not sold on.

Im sick of people being condemenned based on rumours and agendas being pursued in the press. Im sick of Bigfooty taking players to task with no evidentiary basis whatsover. Im sick of journalists being treated like the goddamn messiah when they right something we agree with, but demonised when we dont. Im sick of a lot of things.

 

[Azul]

Trial by Panahi.

you know Rita Panahi, Sharri Markson and Andrew Bolt are all cut from the same cloth... Divisive rabble-rousing trolls with faux outrage.

I'm not defending Dusty but don't take anything you read in Uncle Rupert's newspapers at face value.

 

[mediumsizered]

Threats of serious bodily harm are a crime. Period. The police statement was definitive that no crime had been committed. The woman may not have made a statement, but according to the first article she went to the AFL and Richmond first, not the other way around. And the article itself said that the AFL was referring the matter to the police.

And sorry, I dont know about the incident you're talking about. I could not give a crap about rumours.

So in other words you are saying the woman lied & Dirtbag Martin apologised to her just because he is such a compassionate bloke.

The other incident I am talking about definitley happened, it is not just rumour & much like this latest incident, the female victim did not make a statement to police after being spoken to by the club & the AFL.

The AFL bullshit about being serious about violence against women, but they don't follow through when push comes to shove. This is why you will never eradicate domestic violence because those who can do something about it go to water as soon as called upon to make a stance.

Martin has dodged a bullet, thanks to being an AFL player however one day his career will be over & then when he inevitably screws up, he will get his come uppance. Clearly in this case the sins of the father have been visited upon the son.

 

[The_Wookie]

So in other words you are saying the woman lied & Dirtbag Martin apologised to her just because he is such a compassionate bloke.

Not what I said at all. I said that no crime has been committed, and this instance, no evidence has been entered. Its one persons word against another, and frankly thats not enough - should NEVER be enough - to condemn a man (and is part of why rules exist in court concerning the admission of "hear say"). Ive also said just above this that he's still going to cop it from his club, if not the league for being an drunken fool - but that doesnt just the fact that the police found that no crime was committed either on the cctv or from a number of independent witnesses. This means no threats to kill or cause bodily harm were witnessed as both of those are a crime.

The other incident I am talking about definitley happened, it is not just rumour & much like this latest incident, the female victim did not make a statement to police after being spoken to by the club & the AFL.

And I still dont give a damn. Im judging this incident on its merits or lack thereof.

The AFL bullshit about being serious about violence against women, but they don't follow through when push comes to shove. This is why you will never eradicate domestic violence because those who can do something about it go to water as soon as called upon to make a stance.

Whats bullshit is making a sporting body respsonsible for social change.

Martin has dodged a bullet, thanks to being an AFL player however one day his career will be over & then when he inevitably screws up, he will get his come uppance. Clearly in this case the sins of the father have been visited upon the son.

Why not go out and form yourself a lynch mob then. Fact is your mind was made up well before the police investigation.

 

[Robbo's my hero]

Woman refused to make a statement.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Woman refused to make a statement.

Supposedly, she didn't make a statement because she didn't want to go through a court case, has a publically visible job and didn't want to jeopardise that. She approached Richmond because she wanted to make it clear she didn't appreciate the behaviour so wanted them to take steps to ensure it didn't happen again.

CCTV doesn't usually contain audio. We don't know exactly what the woman said Martin had said, and accounts from witnesses have varied. Some in the media have run with the most scandalous of accounts. The police might have run with some sort of happy medium.

There may have been threats, there may not have. The police were unable to substantiate it.

I am concerned that the whole thing seems to be blowing up on this woman and a false report, when her exact account is not known. He clearly approached her, she was clearly upset enough to approach Richmond. That done, she has consistently stated she didn't want anything to go further. She may very well be fearful of recriminations as this has blown up way too far. Sounds like she has a budding media career that any bad PR could affect.

For mine, Dusty probably acted like an idiot, she felt intimidated, she rightfully asked Richmond to have words to him. Hopefully they have done that behind the scenes at least.

 

[thylacine60]

She better get photos if she ever gets her face repeatedly smashed into a wall, Nick Stevens style. No-one will believe her broken teeth and black eyes and lacerations and concussion and cuts and bruises came at the hands of a bloke - not unless full sound cinematography is used.

 

[Neese]

Ugh, I hope you are not being serious Thy

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

There was a young woman (19 IIRC) recently who presented at the police station with a bruised face and photographic evidence of her face after her boyfriend gave her an horrific beating...and the police didn't want to pursue it as they felt it would be her word against his.

 

[GoBlues13]

Supposedly, she didn't make a statement because she didn't want to go through a court case, has a publically visible job and didn't want to jeopardise that. She approached Richmond because she wanted to make it clear she didn't appreciate the behaviour so wanted them to take steps to ensure it didn't happen again.

CCTV doesn't usually contain audio. We don't know exactly what the woman said Martin had said, and accounts from witnesses have varied. Some in the media have run with the most scandalous of accounts. The police might have run with some sort of happy medium.

There may have been threats, there may not have. The police were unable to substantiate it.

I am concerned that the whole thing seems to be blowing up on this woman and a false report, when her exact account is not known. He clearly approached her, she was clearly upset enough to approach Richmond. That done, she has consistently stated she didn't want anything to go further. She may very well be fearful of recriminations as this has blown up way too far. Sounds like she has a budding media career that any bad PR could affect.

For mine, Dusty probably acted like an idiot, she felt intimidated, she rightfully asked Richmond to have words to him. Hopefully they have done that behind the scenes at least.

Yeah. She probably doesn't want to get her name/identity and why happened with Dusty all over the news. She approached Richmond because she felt scared and unlike the police Richmond don't have the authority to send her to court to get interviewed or anything without checking. Yes, she wouldn't of liked the whole 'rape' experience so even though she didn't want to appear all over the news she obviously wanted to express how upset she was to at least someone!

 

[The_Wookie]

She better get photos if she ever gets her face repeatedly smashed into a wall, Nick Stevens style. No-one will believe her broken teeth and black eyes and lacerations and concussion and cuts and bruises came at the hands of a bloke - not unless full sound cinematography is used.

Dustin Martin isnt Nick Stevens. The incident with Martin is nowhere near the same level as Stevens. But hey who gives a shit about that when you can paint every picture with the same brush right? Every one deserves to have their case heard on its own merits and not judged by people who had him condemned three seconds after reading an article by one of the most discredited journalists of modern times.

 

[thylacine60]

No you're right, Wook. Well done again.

 

[mediumsizered]

For mine, Dusty probably acted like an idiot, she felt intimidated, she rightfully asked Richmond to have words to him. Hopefully they have done that behind the scenes at least.

This is most likely what happened, but it would seem the decision by the police not to lay charges is being seen as totally exonerating Martin of any poor behaviour.

Again I reiterate, there is a reason why the woman felt moved to contact the Richmond FC & the club were quick to make sure Martin apologised, yet now some want to turn it around & heap scorn on the victim.

The lesson from this & previous incidents is that the minority of scumbag AFL players who see mistreating females as acceptable behaviour, will continue to be protected by an organisation that is hell bent on protecting the 'brand' at the expense of those who dare to call into question such behaviour.

The one thing I do know for certain, Martin will get what's coming to him eventually, most likely from a cellmate in a Corrective Services facility.

 

[DaVillaBlues]

Bruce Matthews and Rod Nicholson are retiring, two of the Huns better journos, both strike me as pretty much decent salt of the earth types with no hidden agenda or bias in their reporting. I will miss reading their match reports, especially Matthews.

Hopefully Ron Reed (a good Carlton man) will still be around for a few more years, I really miss the elder statesmen reporters and journalists even Scot 'keep on punching' Palmer. Haven't gotten over Mal Waldon retiring from ten news yet, especially being replaced by Stephen Quarterbrain ..

 

[DangerousD]

Just wondering if anyone genuinely thinks that we wont finish last next season? If so which team/s do you think we will pass and why?

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Just wondering if anyone genuinely thinks that we wont finish last next season? If so which team/s do you think we will pass and why?

Essendon will be dead last. Regardless of infractions or not, although I think they'll be banned. Theyre still an awful side.

I can see North plummeting down the ladder as well, not to the bottom, but way down.

Saints will be low again, I dont rate them.

Melbourne, Brisbane and us will be around the mark.

If i'd guess the bottom six it would be North, Essendon, Brisbane, Carlton, St Kilda & Melbourne

Middle six would be Gold Coast, Port Adelaide, Geelong, Adelaide, GWS, Sydney

Top six would be Hawthorn, West Coast, WBD, Fremantle, Richmond, Collingwood

In no particular order.

 

[TheCoach16]

Dustin Martin isnt Nick Stevens. The incident with Martin is nowhere near the same level as Stevens. But hey who gives a shit about that when you can paint every picture with the same brush right? Every one deserves to have their case heard on its own merits and not judged by people who had him condemned three seconds after reading an article by one of the most discredited journalists of modern times.

Wook, you make a strong argument, and I agree with the points you've made. Obviously you're someone who prefers to deal in facts rather than innuendo, and I am much the same. That's why I'm reluctant to make a call on this issue, as I wasn't there, I don't know what happened, and I don't know any of the parties involved.
I would like to ask you however, in your mind, does the fact that the police have not brought charges, lead you to believe that there is absolutely no wrong doing here? Nothing to see?
There's a difference between a lack of evidence and innocence. Based on no legal action, do you believe we draw a line and conclude Martin did nothing wrong, the woman in question is "telling stories" and that this is basically a storm in a tea cup? The reason I ask is because in my field of work, I find smoke and fire, in most cases, come as a package.

 

[ShanDog]

I thought all the players we lost were shit?