Hawthorn FC worst nightmare the 2017 Draft

[Blue1980]

High draft pick with injuries? Yep, sounds like a hawthorn target

Just needs to be blessed with the hawthorn holy water, cos they fixed shoenmakers turning him from a pre injury spud to a post injury spud

 

[Blue1980]

Last week it was Bolton and Hardwick. Now not so much Hardwick.

Tonight worsfold if Essendon win, and much anger that they got a number 1 pick last year

 

[radiojake]

Get outta here.

Riewoldt and Hodge aside, McPharlin compares favourably to any #1 pick in history. He flew under the radar over here for much of his career, if he'd played for a high profile Vic club he'd be held in much higher esteem. Any club would be happy to get a player of that quality with the first pick.

fair enough you'd be a better judge on McPharlin no doubt but I guess I always felt the deal became lobsided when Croad high-tailed it back east

 

[Blue1980]

That's just your opinion.

I'm like Fox News, my opinion is fact (and always unbiased )

 

[HairyO]

Tonight worsfold if Essendon win, and much anger that they got a number 1 pick last year

Possibly. Though if the Swans win they will be flag favourites.

That said, anyone can win at the SCG. Easy ground to beat the Swans at. They are rubbish at playing there. Clearly the players would rather be back out at Olympic Park.

 

[MinerBoy]

Some do, some don't. McPharlin and Roger Hayden are two who didn't get the recognition they deserved.

I think McPharlin is/was fairly universally regarded across the AFL world as a gun.

 

[Blue1980]

fair enough you'd be a better judge on McPharlin no doubt but I guess I always felt the deal became lobsided when Croad high-tailed it back east

Croad and hodge for mcpharlin essentially is a hawthorn win.

Mcpharlin was a top defender tho

 

[Pessimistic]

Sam Mitchell and Luke Hodge were 130+ gamers in 2008, not kids. They were both B&F winners and Hodge was an AA.

If you don't replace the players you have with players as good, you won't be as good. That's how footy works. I'm not personally relegating you to years of wooden spoons, but I've seen first hand how hard it is to replace genuine stars of the comp.

Do you want Hawthorn to get back to being Hawthorn 2013-2015 or would you be happy being West Coast 2007-2017? We've never replaced Cousins, Judd and Kerr and have consequently never been as good. We've been lucky that Mackenzie and now McGovern have been almost as good as Glass, Kennedy has been a star and Naitanui while very different to Cox has given us a damaging ruckman but our midfield is still ordinary and we've been pretty average most of the last decade.

Tom Mitchell is a good footballer, but if he is your best player you won't be winning flags.

I'm not sure personally, I'll leave that to club strategists. but it has to be called out that replacing a once in a generation group of players at the same time is hard (as you agree in your post) and frankly the task shouldn't be that high as posters in this thread seem happy to imply

But that is the premise behind people suggesting that Gunston Bruest Rioli be traded. To rebuild to a 'threepeat' standard

Frankly its not needed to be what this 'refurbished' list could be. Its some experience, and some midfield quality which is required

17th has beaten 1st two weeks in a row, different teams

 

[Pessimistic]

Just needs to be blessed with the hawthorn holy water, cos they fixed shoenmakers turning him from a pre injury spud to a post injury spud

With Ryan we took a fairly good instinctive player and made him worse somehow. He only now seems to e getting back to that.

Hes depth who will be called on for structural tasks. Hes happy with that, why would the club complain?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

he's been a good player this year has he?

Wow, ok then. If you say so. Obviously Clarkson agrees. Maybe a few do games do make a good season?

From what I've seen he's generally looked cooked. He plays well in the rare occasions the team does, and plays poorly when the team does.

But more pertinently, it would just show that Clarkson believes the Hawks only need a bit of tinkering around the edges. And it would be spit in the eye for Mitchell and Lewis.

So by all means, play on Silk, play on

No it wouldn't. Not at all

It would just show that Clarkson rates his leadership and onfield ability to lift in big moments as something that he'd want the youngsters to play along side, for as long as possible. The guy is an absolute gun, and can still find his way through heavy traffic.

Also, Burgoyne is still able to break tackles and run away from players due to his pace, which is something Mitchell and Lewis aren't renowned for.

 

[Blue1980]

With Ryan we took a fairly good instinctive player and made him worse somehow. He only now seems to e getting back to that.

Hes depth who will be called on for structural tasks. Hes happy with that, why would the club complain?

Will you guys keep him?

 

[Blue1980]

Possibly. Though if the Swans win they will be flag favourites.

That said, anyone can win at the SCG. Easy ground to beat the Swans at. They are rubbish at playing there. Clearly the players would rather be back out at Olympic Park.

Flag favorites at 6-7?

If we win Sunday we are 6-7, are we then a top 4 chance?

 

[Pessimistic]

Who knows?

 

[Scotland]

I'm not sure personally, I'll leave that to club strategists. but it has to be called out that replacing a once in a generation group of players at the same time is hard (as you agree in your post) and frankly the task shouldn't be that high as posters in this thread seem happy to imply

But that is the premise behind people suggesting that Gunston Bruest Rioli be traded. To rebuild to a 'threepeat' standard

Frankly its not needed to be what this 'refurbished' list could be. Its some experience, and some midfield quality which is required

17th has beaten 1st two weeks in a row, different teams

This is a bit cyclical. People get stuck into Hawthorn fans because you've been telling us for years how great you are, how Clarkson and Wright have the magic formula etc. 2016 trade week was all part of the plan. You'd get Mitchell and O'Meara without giving up any players and bounce back sooner rather than later. All your senior players took pay cuts so you had all the cap space in the world.

Not being shit for years on end is a fair drop in expectations from being a regular Grand Finalist and premiership side. Luck plays a big role even for good sides. Hawthorn won 3 close PFs, lost one close GF and won one close GF. We split two GFs with Sydney. St Kilda lost a close GF then drew one and have doughnuts to show for it. Etc. If Clarkson and co simply have the formula for not being Brisbane/Melbourne then... yay? Goodo? Well done them?

Even ITT Hawthorn fans are claiming they can get back into the first round of the draft. How exactly? Because trading Mitchell and Lewis got you nothing, and offloading Schoenmakers and Langford isn't going to get it done. The ticket back into the draft is trading out the players you didn't want to trade last year. I wouldn't really call that a plan.

 

[HairyO]

This is a bit cyclical. People get stuck into Hawthorn fans because you've been telling us for years how great you are, how Clarkson and Wright have the magic formula etc. 2016 trade week was all part of the plan. You'd get Mitchell and O'Meara without giving up any players and bounce back sooner rather than later. All your senior players took pay cuts so you had all the cap space in the world.

Not being shit for years on end is a fair drop in expectations from being a regular Grand Finalist and premiership side. Luck plays a big role even for good sides. Hawthorn won 3 close PFs, lost one close GF and won one close GF. We split two GFs with Sydney. St Kilda lost a close GF then drew one and have doughnuts to show for it. Etc. If Clarkson and co simply have the formula for not being Brisbane/Melbourne then... yay? Goodo? Well done them?

Even ITT Hawthorn fans are claiming they can get back into the first round of the draft. How exactly? Because trading Mitchell and Lewis got you nothing, and offloading Schoenmakers and Langford isn't going to get it done. The ticket back into the draft is trading out the players you didn't want to trade last year. I wouldn't really call that a plan.

We get back in the draft by trading. But I dont know if Clarko wants that. And at the moment there is no talk of any jumping ship.

We still have next year's 1st round to trade and plenty of money. Even more if Gibbo and Hodge retire.

The idea that we are in a world of hurt because we traded out 1 first rounder is moronic. Plenty of clubs do it.

 

[SA HAWK]

We get back in the draft by trading. But I dont know if Clarko wants that. And at the moment there is no talk of any jumping ship.

We still have next year's 1st round to trade and plenty of money. Even more if Gibbo and Hodge retire.

The idea that we are in a world of hurt because we traded out 1 first rounder is moronic. Plenty of clubs do it.

If we are trading that it would want to be for someone young (no older than 22-23) , established & NOT injured.

 

[threesixpio]

Believe it or not this thread is not about all non-hawthorn supporters being head****ed and taking delight in, or hoping for, Hawthorn's demise. That sort of paranoia best belongs on the Hawthorn board where simpletons can, and do, read anti Hawthorn agendas into anything the media or BF utters about their team. The thread is about how bad the 2016 trade period was for Hawthorn and the implications it will likely have for the next few years, and as these things go it was an extraordinarily bad trade period. The thread would be pretty much the same whether it was Carlton, Essendon, Fremantle or any other team. And like many of these threads, their supporters would also flood in here, like you, blindly defending their team and end up rendering the thread unreadable.

Pretty darn happy about Tom Mitchell. Do you concede we nailed that one?

 

[tesla1962]

Pretty darn happy about Tom Mitchell. Do you concede we nailed that one?

This is an interesting question. I could take the approach of pretty much every hawk poster in here and say 'we can't judge yet, it's too early to tell'. But I won't - he's been a win for you guys.

 

[threesixpio]

What were the changes from r2 to r14?

In R2 - JOM, Rioli, Gibson, Frawley, Stratton all played who weren't in the team tonight.

The R2 team on paper looked better, (except for Vickery), yet tonight's team lacking the 'stars' controlled the game.

Which kids do you drop to bring back the stars?

Howe, Hardwick, Burton, Sicily, Hartung and even Schoey played their role.

You would be dropping guys like Breust, Gunston who again gave you squat...which is the biggest reason why the Hawks are in 16th...kids aren't letting you down, it is the senior blokes.

the same senior blokes who won three in a row, so can't drop em.

Dumb post. This was the first time a whole bunch of young defenders worked well together in the context of multiple injuries and you now choose to do a "told you so" post about how having a massively depleted backline for the last month hasn't really made a difference

Pathetic post

 

[Scotland]

We get back in the draft by trading. But I dont know if Clarko wants that. And at the moment there is no talk of any jumping ship.

We still have next year's 1st round to trade and plenty of money. Even more if Gibbo and Hodge retire.

The idea that we are in a world of hurt because we traded out 1 first rounder is moronic. Plenty of clubs do it.

Well if you don't get back in the draft then bringing in elite young talent is unlikely starting from pick 35.

You didn't trade out a first rounder. You traded out two of them, one of which will be a top 5 pick. And you traded picks 23 and 36, and effectively downgraded pick 23 to 35. That's a lot of eggs in the O'Meara/Mitchell basket.

Hawthorn can indeed trade their 2018 first rounder (2015 x 2, 2016 x 0, 2017 x 0, 2018 x 0 is two over a rolling 4 years) but then you are locked out of doing that for 2019 and 2020 until two in 4 years is satisfied again (unless you trade in another). Do you want to be trading away your first round pick for 2018 the way 2017 is going with Burgoyne, Hodge, Gibson still to retire?

 

[threesixpio]

This is an interesting question. I could take the approach of pretty much every hawk poster in here and say 'we can't judge yet, it's too early to tell'. But I reckon he's been a win.

Well Im assuming you have a very short term view due to saying the 2016 trade period has been a failure...

I'm trying to dumb down a bit.

 

[Scotland]

Pretty darn happy about Tom Mitchell. Do you concede we nailed that one?

Win. Has anyone said otherwise?

Pick 14 (16 in the the draft order) for Mitchell is good business.

Picks 23, 36, ~3 & ~21 for O'Meara and ~35 is the iffy one.

 

[threesixpio]

Win. Has anyone said otherwise?

Pick 14 (16 in the the draft order) for Mitchell is good business.

Picks 23, 36, ~3 & ~21 for O'Meara and ~35 is the iffy one.

I was responding to comments that the "whole trade period" was a monumental failure.

I think it's fair I bring balance to that discussion by talking about positive parts of the trade period or do you guys just want to, in an "unbiased" way, just talk about how shit Hawthorn was during the trade period

 

[SA HAWK]

Do you want to be trading away your first round pick for 2018 the way 2017 is going with Burgoyne, Hodge, Gibson still to retire?

Depends who you trade it for.

 

[tesla1962]

Well Im assuming you have a very short term view due to saying the 2016 trade period has been a failure...

I'm trying to dumb down a bit.

There is nothing short term about the view that effectively ruling yourself out of two consecutive drafts (at least the first few rounds) is likely to have long term implications for your club. There are also a host of other issues related to the trade period that are both short term and long term, but they have been outlined in here ad nauseum. Hey, but thanks for 'dumbing it down' for me. I assumed you were trying out some low level sophistry.