Which list would you rather going forward - Hawthorn or Sydney?

[WWSD]

Meh, wouldn't call Burton a star. Had a promising first year, but I've liked what Scrimmers has done so far in 6 games. Scrimshaw will be just as good if not better imo.

Scrimshaw is basically Birchall MKII but a better contested marker. I’m really happy with that trade. Got him cheap.

 

[MrWoollie]

Do you even know how COLA worked?

Ummmm, yes. I also know how it was MEANT to work and how the Swans used/abused it.

It was called the Cost of Living Allowance (COLA), NOT the Recruit Big Name Players Allowance (RBNPA). There may be a clue in the name, something that appears to have bypassed the Swans. The AFL had previously determined that it was more expensive to live in Sydney and more difficult to retain players in a rugby heartland. So they came up with an allowance to counter the extra expense. This was calculated to work out as ~9.8%. For ease the AFL applied this to the salary cap, trusting that clubs in receipt of this allowance would use it as it was meant I.e. to pay everyone a bit extra to counter the COL, not to get big name players. The Swans however (as the AFL darlings) thought they were above the intent, and even after being warned by the AFL over the Tippett affair, went and Buddied anyway. So the AFL got pissed off and replaced it.

The COLA was therefore replaced with a rental allowance. This is paid to the lower 50% of Swans players and is paid directly by the AFL, thus bypassing the Swans and the salary cap. This is what should have happened from the start.

 

[brad cooper]

Ummmm, yes. I also know how it was MEANT to work and how the Swans used/abused it.

It was called the Cost of Living Allowance (COLA), NOT the Recruit Big Name Players Allowance (RBNPA). There may be a clue in the name, something that appears to have bypassed the Swans. The AFL had previously determined that it was more expensive to live in Sydney and more difficult to retain players in a rugby heartland. So they came up with an allowance to counter the extra expense. This was calculated to work out as ~9.8%. For ease the AFL applied this to the salary cap, trusting that clubs in receipt of this allowance would use it as it was meant I.e. to pay everyone a bit extra to counter the COL, not to get big name players. The Swans however (as the AFL darlings) thought they were above the intent, and even after being warned by the AFL over the Tippett affair, went and Buddied anyway. So the AFL got pissed off and replaced it.

The COLA was therefore replaced with a rental allowance. This is paid to the lower 50% of Swans players and is paid directly by the AFL, thus bypassing the Swans and the salary cap. This is what should have happened from the start.

It was written into every swans players contract but I have as much proof of this as you do of it being abused in the way you suggest.

 

[HairyO]

This is the angle Clarkson played I reckon. Shift Burton for Wingard but pick up the closest thing to Burton youth wise and that was a disillusioned Scrimshaw who had his knockers from Gold Coast.

Im positive this is exactly what happened. He knew Scrimshaw was coming and could replace Burton, so that made the trade for Wingard easier.

We picked up Scrimshaw and Scully for 2 dart board picks. That alone was a huge win. Getting Wingard comfortable is the key.

 

[HairyO]

It was written into every swans players contract but I have as much proof of this as you do of it being abused in the way you suggest.

Sure. But a player worth $300k wasnt getting $330k. They were getting $273k plus $27k.

Sydney banked the money to go for big targets. And it has cost them massively.

 

[Boxhead_31]

i think hawthorn have better ability to trade/recruit talent to fix their list

we need a big offseason

Getting Rowell at No1 would be a great start

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Heeney, Hayward, Florent, Ronke, McCartin, Blakey, Papley, Mills, Lloyd, Jones vs Omeara, Worpel, Wingard, Mitchell, Moore, Lewis, O'Brien, Cousins.

Hawthorn has the top end talent but the balance gives Sydney the nod, plus further academy picks in the years to come.

 

[MrWoollie]

It was written into every swans players contract but I have as much proof of this as you do of it being abused in the way you suggest.

The evidence is out there. You don't actually have to look too hard. One of which is an article by Swans fan and journalist Jake Niall, where he says...
'The combination of no COLA and the Tippett-Franklin deals (which prompted COLA’s removal) means the Swans can’t pick up many mid-range players from other clubs. '.

In other words even JN states that it was the purchase of big name players that got the COLA removed.

 

[Zoom]

Both lists have serious problems.

This

 

[HurleyHepsHird]

Hawthorn has a boom/bust list.

A mature top end with real injury risk.

Sydney has the Buddy contract problem, but I feel like they have a very strong core group of midsize players that are either just worn out or are being under utilised.

 

[demondavey]

Getting Rowell at No1 would be a great start

Mate, WTF are you talking about? That’s just ludicrous.....











***Rowell will be a Demon***

 

[demondavey]

Neither think both list are in a massive amount of pain over the next few seasons

But the question is..... are the lions going to kick the winning score?

 

[CheapCharlie]

I like who the Hawks have managed to bring in from other clubs, in that 23-29 brigade.

I like some of our under 23 brigade, more so than the Hawks under 23 , as a whole

Given the teams right now, id prefer Sydney's squad come 2021

 

[brad cooper]

The evidence is out there. You don't actually have to look too hard. One of which is an article by Swans fan and journalist Jake Niall, where he says...
'The combination of no COLA and the Tippett-Franklin deals (which prompted COLA’s removal) means the Swans can’t pick up many mid-range players from other clubs. '.

In other words even JN states that it was the purchase of big name players that got the COLA removed.

So how does that show that is was being abused?

Anyway off topic there's at least 20 cola threads we could continue this conversation.

If Wingard and Scully return to their form of previous years and Mitchell makes a complete recovery Hawks have a better list at this stage moving forward.

 

[4THAWN]

This is the angle Clarkson played I reckon. Shift Burton for Wingard but pick up the closest thing to Burton youth wise and that was a disillusioned Scrimshaw who had his knockers from Gold Coast.

yeah i think he was quietly confident in scrimshaw to put it together for the hawks, obviously paying dividends

 

[4THAWN]

Well this is when I got sad.

A Hawthorn side with Burton (possibly playing forward since he was drafted as one), Scrimshaw down back and Duursma (taken with the pick we had) on a wing. All super young, great talents and could have been the real foundation of our side with the star power of Mitchell, Sicily and Jager at the top.
Instead we have Chad just adding a bit but not much and Scrimshaw doing what we hoped while Port are reaping the benefits of Burton and Duursma.

we dont get scrimshaw if we don't get rid of burton imo. Yes duursma looks a good player, but who knows if he'd even be playing in the 1s at hawthorn or playing as well as he is at port. I remember chad was pretty good in his first few years too yeah.

 

[blueiris]

But the question is..... are the lions going to kick the winning score?

They've kicked more winning scores than Melbourne have this season

 

[demondavey]

They've kicked more winning scores than Melbourne have this season

I was joking. No need to get upset.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

This is the angle Clarkson played I reckon. Shift Burton for Wingard but pick up the closest thing to Burton youth wise and that was a disillusioned Scrimshaw who had his knockers from Gold Coast.

Burton had composure issues under pressure. He had some swagger, but he also felt the heat in close. I believe this ceiling on his in-close ability was a major reason for his name being put on the table.

Scrimshaw so far is really putting his hand up as an interceptor in comparison and has had a great start to the year.

 

[Daka]

I feel like Sydney has the better list but Hawthorn has the better coach who definitely gets more out of his players.

Hawthorn needs go to the draft and pick up some young talent, Sydney have the young talent but their aging midfield is a concern would be addressing that in the upcoming trade/free/agency period.

 

[juss]

Ignoring factors like the coach, I reckon both lists need a fair bit if work to actually contend for a premiership, but I think Hawthorn are closer to finals.

 

[Jeremias]

Both are a fair way off genuinely contending.

Hawthorn have the better list to impact now but Sydney for mine have a far better collection of young talent.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Changed my mind in this, was Swans for long time, but I think now Hawthorn are getting their act together quicker and better than the Swans.

Longmire wasting the talents of Callum Mills being a prime example of this. Mitch Lewis looks like a terrific prospect for the Hawks.

 

[Procrastinator35]

O'Meara, Wingard, Mitchell, Sicily, Worpel, Impey, Lewis, Scrimshaw, Hardwick, O'Brien, Hanrahan, Nash.....Add in Cogs & Patton & that's an A-grade list of kids.


We're miles in front of the Swans.

 

[Jeremias]

O'Meara, Wingard, Mitchell, Sicily, Worpel, Impey, Lewis, Scrimshaw, Hardwick, O'Brien, Hanrahan, Nash.....Add in Cogs & Patton & that's an A-grade list of kids.


We're miles in front of the Swans.

Clearly you have a very loose definition of what a kid is.

Fancy listing 25 and 26 year olds as kids.