Analysis Whole of Club issue - not one single factor to the Crows demise

[Big Gazoongas]

Nicks is looking exactly like the type of coach that an unchanged regime would heartily embrace.

I hope not but an unchanged regime contributes to continually operating in the same way, making similar decisions across our business.

Whilst we have had change its been change driven from outside the AFC which is the most damning on the current leadership of Chapman and Roo who have been askeep at the wheel.
It takes a special kind of person not to vacate their position after this mess.

 

[craig crowing]

The only problem in Chapman going is his replacement will be Roo and he is probably more responsible for the Burton- coaching ,fitness disaster off the last few years.

 

[mcattack]

The only problem in Chapman going is his replacement will be Roo and he is probably more responsible for the Burton- coaching ,fitness disaster off the last few years.

Surely it wont be roo. Probably get ports ex ceo or something.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

We need to Hamish to start picking bigger bodied mids. Guys like Ronin O'Connor are a good start, a good mix of height and mobility, should be built like a brick shithouse in 2 or 3 years time. What annoys me is why we find ourselves with a dearth of big bodied mids in the first place. I think Hamish has a good eye for talent but there's no way you could argue he has the balance right atm.

 

[Mutineer]

We need to Hamish to start picking bigger bodied mids. Guys like Ronin O'Connor are a good start, a good mix of height and mobility, should be built like a brick shithouse in 2 or 3 years time. What annoys me is why we find ourselves with a dearth of big bodied mids in the first place. I think Hamish has a good eye for talent but there's no way you could argue he has the balance right atm.

It's easy to say that but unless you put size before actual football talent at the selection table it's bloody hard to deliver.

Worth noting the Powa's 3 early picks Rozee, Butters and Duursma that posters on here covet certainly don't fit that bill either.

Noah Anderson was gone before our pick even if we retained our original 1st pick and Tom Green was unavailable aligned to the GWS Academy.

The 1st big bodied mid we could have taken was Cooper Stephens who played 1 game before breaking his leg in his draft year. Brodie Kemp classed more as an Utility than a Midfielder at the time of the draft and then there was that little niggle called an ACL. Then there was Finn Maginnes tied to the Hawks father/son.
Trent Rivers perhaps though he'd played almost exclusively in defence with a few squirts in the midfield. Ronin O'Connor was about the only big mid left at that point and Lachie Gollant had played wing/half back mainly.

 

[1970crow]

We need to Hamish to start picking bigger bodied mids. Guys like Ronin O'Connor are a good start, a good mix of height and mobility, should be built like a brick shithouse in 2 or 3 years time. What annoys me is why we find ourselves with a dearth of big bodied mids in the first place. I think Hamish has a good eye for talent but there's no way you could argue he has the balance right atm.

I think the first round is still talent first, needs third.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

It's easy to say that but unless you put size before actual football talent at the selection table it's bloody hard to deliver.

Worth noting the Powa's 3 early picks Rozee, Butters and Duursma that posters on here covet certainly don't fit that bill either.

Noah Anderson was gone before our pick even if we retained our original 1st pick and Tom Green was unavailable aligned to the GWS Academy.

The 1st big bodied mid we could have taken was Cooper Stephens who played 1 game before breaking his leg in his draft year. Brodie Kemp classed more as an Utility than a Midfielder at the time of the draft and then there was that little niggle called an ACL. Then there was Finn Maginnes tied to the Hawks father/son.
Trent Rivers perhaps though he'd played almost exclusively in defence with a few squirts in the midfield. Ronin O'Connor was about the only big mid left at that point and Lachie Gollant had played wing/half back mainly.

This is informative but I wasn't complaining about the most recent draft. What I'm more interested in is how many big bodied mids we've drafted in the last 3 or 4 years. We've certainly spent the last few years obsessing over our outside stocks and our speed, all the while thinking we're well covered for inside mids, but that Sydney game has me concerned that we don't have that balance right at all. I'm also wondering if the club was blindsided by CEY and Greenwood leaving.

 

[GameofSloanes]

Nicks is looking exactly like the type of coach that an unchanged regime would heartily embrace.

Sadly this looks to be the case, I was very VERY disappointed with his performance.

 

[FR0GGY]

Looks like the whole world has changed except for the AFC?

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

Whole club issues are always traced back to a toxic board.

 

[Freomaniac]

Good post. You can’t pinpoint one area for our issues.

We seem to be in the same 3-4 year cycle where we don’t make finals for a couple of years, sack the coach, get a spike in performance for a couple of years then missing the finals for a couple of years, and back to where it all started.

As far as I can see the only real change we do is sack the coach and everyone else survives. When will the Board be held accountable?

The Board only ever has short term view, and that is to be competitive to make the top 8 and that will be good enough to keep our supporters turning up to games. We’ve heard it all before that we don’t rebuild. Well, we haven’t won a premiership in 21 years with our short term strategy. We’ve had a poor performance in finals over this time because our team hasn’t had enough class to get us over the line in big games. It’s time we tried something different and we might actually get a different result.

For the rest of the year I want us to filter some kids into the team, rather than bring in more senior guys to try and sneak into the 8 this year. What will it achieve making the finals with one of the oldest teams, if not the oldest, that have failed time and time again on the big stage?

go ask yourself this question......

Would you rather have the Crows finals record from 2000-2019? And this isnt even including the 2017 finals series.

Or would you rather go through Richmonds era of 1983-2012 where they only Made finals in 1995 and 2001 and both those years were prelim finals and finishing 9th in 1994, 1996, 2000, 2006 and 2008?

 

[MRB37]

Looks like Paul Thomas is the first permanent causality from cutbacks.

 

[skam85]

go ask yourself this question......

Would you rather have the Crows finals record from 2000-2019? And this isnt even including the 2017 finals series.

Or would you rather go through Richmonds era of 1983-2012 where they only Made finals in 1995 and 2001 and both those years were prelim finals and finishing 9th in 1994, 1996, 2000, 2006 and 2008?

It's not relevant, each has exactly the same end result. No flag.

It's like asking would you rather die in a plane crash or a car accident.

 

[Freomaniac]

It's not relevant, each has exactly the same end result. No flag.

It's like asking would you rather die in a plane crash or a car accident.

Yeah it is relevant...... At least after the 1997-98 flags, at least your team was close a few times at a flag, Not to mention a few prelims from 2000 onwards. Compare that to Richmond from 1983-2012, tell me anytime they were close? You cant say 1995 when they made that prelim because they got smashed by an ageing geelong side in 1995. You cant say 2001 either as Essendon and Brisbane made the grand final that year. They lost to essendon in the QF, Beat carlton in the semi final then lost to Brisbane at the Gabba in the Prelim when Brisbane never lost a gome final at the Gabba and had a lot of players in their prime.


As for the crows prelims and other shots of winning the flag post 2000.

2002: Crows lost 13.13.91 to 9.9.63. I remembered this game, Josh Fraser kicked the 1st 2 goals. Jason Cloke was suspended for Striking Tyson Edwards in the nose in a marking contest. Cloke deserved to get suspended, he smacked Edwards in the nose. Why not punch the ball when it was between his hands? That was the closest chance they had under Gary Ayres stint of 2000-2004.

2005: Crows finished top by %. Lost to saints narrowly in the Qualifying final but had a couple key players out. Mark Riccuito was sick in that game too. Belted port in the semi final then lost Narrowly to the eagles in the Prelim in Perth. 90% certain crows would of won the 2005 grand final vs the swans had they made it.

2006: Crows finished 2nd. Crazy year in the AFL as no Victorian side made the top 4. Eagles top, Crows 2nd, Freo 3rd and Swans 4th. Crows beat my mob freo in the QF. Yes, I was there at the game. Crows lost Narrowly in the Prelim to the Eagles in Adelaide. Dead Certain had the crows won that prelim, they would of beaten the Swans in the Grand final at the MCG in a low scoring game.

2008: Crows didnt make the top 4 but were screwed out of it. Collingwood had the chance to secure 4th spot on the ladder. But Freo beat them 12.8.80 to 8.8 56. Crows beat the dogs at home by 9 points in Adelaide. The crows had to pray for the saints that they didnt beat essendon by 90 points. Eseendon essentially laid down and tanked and handed the saints 4th spot as they won 147-39. Crows finished 5th and lost to 8th plaved collingwod in the elim final. That was Neil craigs last decent shot in his 2004-2011 coachng era.

2012: Crows finished 2nd, Lost to the swans in the Qualifying final, Narrowly beats freo in the Semis and loses to the Hawks by under a goal in the prelim. Had the crows make it, they would of got a shot vs the swans in the Grand final. this was Sandersons only shot of the flag in 2012-14.

2016: Crows didnt make the top 4 in 2016 but were 2nd on % coming into the final round. Crows lost 100-71 in Adelaide vs West coast, had the crows won by 30 points at home, It would of changed the ladder as GWS would of got 5th instead of 4th and not made a prelim. Swans would of been top, Crows 2nd, Cats 3rd and Hawks 4th. Would of meant Crows would of faced the cats in Adelaide oval, got a home prelim vs the Swans or hawks then made the 2016 GF.

2017: Arguably the crows biggest chance of a flag post 1998: Crows finish top, they beat GWS in the QF, Beat the cats in the Prelim and lost to the tigers in the Grand final.




Essentially you cant say the crows havent had any golden chances for the flag. I just listed 7 years post 2000 when the crows were acutal contenders of winning the grand final or at least making it. Its just a combination of either losing players to injury, losing a narrow game or having a good side just spraying shots in key stages of a game to cost you a grand final spot or a top 4 spot.

Mind you your team wouldnt be the only one though.

 

[Thetrader15]

go ask yourself this question......

Would you rather have the Crows finals record from 2000-2019? And this isnt even including the 2017 finals series.

Or would you rather go through Richmonds era of 1983-2012 where they only Made finals in 1995 and 2001 and both those years were prelim finals and finishing 9th in 1994, 1996, 2000, 2006 and 2008?

I'd rather have Richmond's record from 2000 to now than ours, that's for sure. They have 2 flags, we have none.

I know not everyone agrees, but I'd rather 2 flags from 2 finals appearances over 20 years than no flags from 20 finals appearances.

Maybe it's just me

 

[Thetrader15]

2017: Arguably the crows biggest chance of a flag post 1998: Crows finish top, they beat GWS in the QF, Beat the cats in the Prelim and lost to the tigers in the Grand final.

Did you have to remind me? I still can't stand The Killers

 

[Freomaniac]

I'd rather have Richmond's record from 2000 to now than ours, that's for sure. They have 2 flags, we have none.

I know not everyone agrees, but I'd rather 2 flags from 2 finals appearances over 20 years than no flags from 20 finals appearances.

Maybe it's just me

Ok I will give you 3 options......

If it was 2000-2019.

You get 3 choices....

Option A: 2 Flags from 2 finals appearences over 20 years.

Option B: 20 years of finals but No flags

Option C: Amix of option A and B. 1 flag in 20 years, 10 years of making finals or 10 years of not making finals.

If you Look at Port Adelaide from 1999-2018, Option C is them. Finals in 1999, then they had that finals run from 2001-5 in which they win the 2004 flag. A grand final in 2007, then finals in 2013-4 and 2017. On the other hand they didnt make finals in 2000, 2006, 2008-12, 2015-16, 2018. 1 flag, 10 years of finals, 10 years of no finals.

 

[Thetrader15]

Ok I will give you 3 options......

If it was 2000-2019.

You get 3 choices....

Option A: 2 Flags from 2 finals appearences over 20 years.

Option B: 20 years of finals but No flags

Option C: Amix of option A and B. 1 flag in 20 years, 10 years of making finals or 10 years of not making finals.

If you Look at Port Adelaide from 1999-2018, Option C is them. Finals in 1999, then they had that finals run from 2001-5 in which they win the 2004 flag. A grand final in 2007, then finals in 2013-4 and 2017. On the other hand they didnt make finals in 2000, 2006, 2008-12, 2015-16, 2018. 1 flag, 10 years of finals, 10 years of no finals.

A

 

[hey shorty]

A

Prior to 2017 that's pretty much what we had, I wasn't a fan.

 

[skam85]

A

i’m not really sure who would answer an option with fewer flags

 

[Capriati]

I watched the game last weekend and really hoped you guys would win that game and have a good season this year. It would be nice to see Adelaide back in the finals and one of the top teams in the comp again...

Get your s**t together, campaigners!

 

[Freomaniac]

Prior to 2017 that's pretty much what we had, I wasn't a fan.

No.... Prior to 2017 Actually from 1997-2016. You won flags in 1997-8. Made finals in 2001-2003, 2005-09, 2012, 2015-16. Missed finals in 1999-2000, 2004, 2010-11, 2013-14.

Not including the priemiership years, crows made finals 11 times out of 18 years. Making finals in 11 out of 20 years under the current system of a 20 team league in this current finals 8 system is very good.

Hence why I appreciated every final freo played under Ross Lyon from 2012-15, even the defeats.

 

[Freomaniac]

A

I woudl of taken B to be honest.

 

[Freomaniac]

Let's take the Jordan Gallucci pick...after him Jarrod Berry, Sam Powell-Pepper [just sneaks in height wise], Patrick Lipinski [we were keen but Doggies got in 1st], Willem Drew....that's about it. Like I said easy said but harder done.

In 2017 maybe Worpel [just sneaks in size wise] instead of McPherson?

2018 Maybe Hately over Jones but the emphasis that draft seemed to be on speed. Riley Collier-Dawkins or Ely Smith over Neddy who like Neddy are yet to debut?

your talking about hindsight.

Freo were copped flak for years for choosing a Skinny victorian flanker in Jayden Pitt over WA forward in Jack Darling in 2010.

Actually looking back, that 2010 draft wasnt too bad, Suns had 9 of the 1st 15 picks and but wasted most of them.

Then you look at what the Eagles got in that 2010 draft....

Pick 4: Andrew Gaff,

Pick 26: Jack Darling

Pick 29: Scott Lycett

Jeremy McGovern was a rookie pick.

All 4 players would be in Gold Coasts starting 18

 

[Elite Crow]

your talking about hindsight.

Freo were copped flak for years for choosing a Skinny victorian flanker in Jayden Pitt over WA forward in Jack Darling in 2010.

Actually looking back, that 2010 draft wasnt too bad, Suns had 9 of the 1st 15 picks and but wasted most of them.

Then you look at what the Eagles got in that 2010 draft....

Pick 4: Andrew Gaff,

Pick 26: Jack Darling

Pick 29: Scott Lycett

Jeremy McGovern was a rookie pick.

All 4 players would be in Gold Coasts starting 18

Would be there top 4 players