Training Preseason 22-23

[Testekill]

at the size of this mans legs. Surely he is not getting shifted off the ball at boundary throw ins.

Injury free 2023 and he becomes the best ruckman in the league.

He's growing into his frame which is a big deal, once he stops letting himself be bullied and he stays healthy he'll be the best ruck in the league.

 

[weltschmerz]

I didn’t think they could wear jewellery on the ground due to risk of injury. He can wear what he likes off field, many players do.

During the covid break Baz pierced his own ear with a sewing needle, which shouldn't surprise anyone.

 

[weltschmerz]

IIRC the two knocks on Garcia were his field kicking and being injury prone, and from the sounds of it, he's done a lot of work on the first one. I hope his body stays right. He's not a big fella but he's a terrier and could be part of our future midfield.

 

[hatescaptcha]

Clarke has some swagger about him. Going to be a real pest on field. We’ll love him. Can’t wait to get him into the side.


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[weltschmerz]

Been watching this because it has so much of what I want us to be doing this year. English putting Gawn on the ground, Baz hitting a target by foot at speed, Garcia backing himself in for the goal.

 

[Hoges64]

Daniel in particular rarely delivers ‘at speed’ even Dale is more outside receiver delivering from half back methodically rather than breaking lines. They’re just not comparable players and anyway again you’re using two of probably the best kicks in the league as a benchmark, it’s just not realistic. He’s more in line with other good midfielders who play a similar style but butcher the footy a little bit like Treloar, danger, Petracca etc (not saying he’s on that level as a player) none of these guys will ever dispose of the footy at the level of Dale & Daniel.

I’m not saying he doesn’t need to improve, he absolutely does but let’s be realistic here. More than anything he needs to cut out the real Clanger kicks he’s prone to making more often than he should, I’d say that’s more concentration & composure based than skills as technically he’s fine. JJ is a good example of someone whose done just that.

You want to use selective stats to paint a poor picture, that’s fine so can I. Out of all midfielders this year Baz ranked Elite for disposals, effective disposals, effective kicks, Meters gained, goal assists and above avg for contested possessions, clearances, tackles, pressure acts, score involvements

If you can’t see the difference between that and a technically rubbish ball butcherer who can’t kick 30m & still hasn’t mastered the art of a drop punt at the ripe old age of 26 and want to compare them based on the all telling DE% stat well I can’t help ya mate

FFS.

As I said, I'm not using them as a comparison, I'm saying that running fast and kicking a football well at the same time can be done. Running fast is not an excuse for poor disposal, as has been happily used by a few here. And those guys deliver balls at pace plenty to prove it.

You're also proving my point by saying "he needs to cut out the real Clanger kicks he’s prone to making more often than he should". This is exactly what I'm saying. At no point have I said it's technique, I'm saying disposal, which "concentration and composure" are components of.

As for all these "disposals, effective disposals, effective kicks, Meters gained, goal assists and above avg for contested possessions, clearances, tackles, pressure acts, score involvements", I should ****ing hope he's "elite" in the majority of those categories getting 21 uncontested touches a game predominantly from wing and forward. I'm not questioning effort to get out into space to receive the ball etc, I'm saying his disposal is poor for someone who gets as much uncontested ball as he does. Simple as that. Danger and Petracca also get a lot more contested ball and are a hell of a lot more inside at this stage than Smith is. And interestingly, if anything, it's Treloars disposal woes that are overblown.

Meanwhile getting 8 contested possessions a game is above average?

 

[Testekill]

Clarke has some swagger about him. Going to be a real pest on field. We’ll love him. Can’t wait to get him into the side.


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He and Cody are going to piss off a lot of defenders.

 

[Some Idiot]

FFS.

As I said, I'm not using them as a comparison, I'm saying that running fast and kicking a football well at the same time can be done. Running fast is not an excuse for poor disposal, as has been happily used by a few here. And those guys deliver balls at pace plenty to prove it.

You're also proving my point by saying "he needs to cut out the real Clanger kicks he’s prone to making more often than he should". This is exactly what I'm saying. At no point have I said it's technique, I'm saying disposal, which "concentration and composure" are components of.

As for all these "disposals, effective disposals, effective kicks, Meters gained, goal assists and above avg for contested possessions, clearances, tackles, pressure acts, score involvements", I should ******* hope he's "elite" in the majority of those categories getting 21 uncontested touches a game predominantly from wing and forward. I'm not questioning effort to get out into space to receive the ball etc, I'm saying his disposal is poor for someone who gets as much uncontested ball as he does. Simple as that. Danger and Petracca also get a lot more contested ball and are a hell of a lot more inside at this stage than Smith is. And interestingly, if anything, it's Treloars disposal woes that are overblown.

Meanwhile getting 8 contested possessions a game is above average?

JJ was hit and miss with his disposal as a running half back, but he did improve as his career went on, Harbrow was similar. I also note that JJ was mostly fantastic in 2016 but turned it over a lot in the pressure of the grand final, but was still judged best afield for breaking lines and making the swans tire out having to run to defend.

I think Smith has a lot of room for improvement with his disposal but I also think it's overstated at times. Breaking the lines and putting the opposition on the back foot isn't always completely negated by turning the ball over.

 

[Brass Dog]

View attachment 1587521

He’s got an arm, like a leg …. A ladies leg!

 

[dogwatch]

He’s got an arm, like a leg …. A ladies leg!

But has he got a punch that'll sink a battleship?

 

[Flags_In_The_Bag]

Been watching this because it has so much of what I want us to be doing this year. English putting Gawn on the ground, Baz hitting a target by foot at speed, Garcia backing himself in for the goal.

I HAVE A REAL FEELING THIS KID IS GOING TO SHOW A LOT OF PEOPLE UP WITH THEM SAYING WHERE DID HE COME FROM.
have a real soft spot already for Garcia. was so wrapped for him when he kicked that goal against the Lions

 

[Brass Dog]

But has he got a punch that'll sink a battleship?

You betcha

 

[TiAn_]

He's growing into his frame which is a big deal, once he stops letting himself be bullied and he stays healthy he'll be the best ruck in the league.

The proposition with English is the size of the fight in the dog, not the size of the dog in the fight. He’s been big enough for a couple of years now. The mind needs to match the body.

 

[Hobdog]

They're paid to say that s**t mate. No one is gonna say that their current employer/colleagues aren't that great in public, are they?

I don't think we have culture issues or anything like that. Just saying that you shouldn't put too much weight in what is said to journalists.

I wasn’t referring to interviews Scrag, I was talking more about social media posts and interaction between the players. I’m not that naive mate!


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[Hobdog]

What influenced you to say that?

Just my observations from social media posts and players interactions.


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[Al dente]

The proposition with English is the size of the fight in the dog, not the size of the dog in the fight. He’s been big enough for a couple of years now. The mind needs to match the body.

here, here, its his passive nature, and lack of want to compete at times that has been the problem, his legs have been strong for a couple of years now.

getting bigger is going to help, and give him more confidence, but as you say, it isnt the primary cause, the primary cause is psychological/ temperament related.

The reason im so critical of him is that ruck is the one position where you definitely cant afford timidity. Its the first touch in many sequences in play, it sets the tone/ level of aggression and effort, and is massive with 6/6/6. Watch the Carlton game last year, for an example of what 10 minutes of 'Little Timmy' can do to the team and scoreboard. And its not just getting beaten, i can handle that, its like he morphs/ regresses to a little boy sometimes, and then morphs back. I do like the way he often responds afterwards though. I love 'Big Timmy', he's ok in the ruck, and fantastic around the ground, an elite ruck on the whole. But 5 minutes of 'Little Timmy' can undo a half of good football from 'Big Timmy'. 'Little Timmy' sometimes doesnt even contest boundary throw ins, just lets the opposition ruck have his way. I wish there was some way to stop 'Little Timmy' from appearing, i havent noticed any pattern to his appearance, it can happen anytime. You might argue he appears less these days?


id love nothing more than for him to prove me (and many others on here) wrong, but Leopards dont often change their spots, especially mid career, and (unforunately) i expect to see some more of 'Little Timmy' this year. Hopefully a little less than previous years though.

 

[doggies ftw]

here, here, its his passive nature, and lack of want to compete at times that has been the problem, his legs have been strong for a couple of years now.

getting bigger is going to help, and give him more confidence, but as you say, it isnt the primary cause, the primary cause is psychological/ temperament related.

The reason im so critical of him is that ruck is the one position where you definitely cant afford timidity. Its the first touch in many sequences in play, it sets the tone/ level of aggression and effort, and is massive with 6/6/6. Watch the Carlton game last year, for an example of what 10 minutes of 'Little Timmy' can do to the team and scoreboard. And its not just getting beaten, i can handle that, its like he morphs/ regresses to a little boy sometimes, and then morphs back. I do like the way he often responds afterwards though. I love 'Big Timmy', he's ok in the ruck, and fantastic around the ground, an elite ruck on the whole. But 5 minutes of 'Little Timmy' can undo a half of good football from 'Big Timmy'. 'Little Timmy' sometimes doesnt even contest boundary throw ins, just lets the opposition ruck have his way. I wish there was some way to stop 'Little Timmy' from appearing, i havent noticed any pattern to his appearance, it can happen anytime. You might argue he appears less these days?


id love nothing more than for him to prove me (and many others on here) wrong, but Leopards dont often change their spots, especially mid career, and (unforunately) i expect to see some more of 'Little Timmy' this year. Hopefully a little less than previous years though.

Agree with everything you’ve said here, but I will say that whilst I agree most of the time players don’t usually transform substantially mid career when it comes to mindset, I’m not sure that’s entirely true for rucks.

I think we see time and time again that blokes can be completely and utterly out of their depth (which lends to them looking ‘uncompetitive’ or soft if they’re copping a hiding) and one day at 28yo it just clicks, they gain confidence in their ability and it all just comes together and they spend the next few years giving back some of the shit they copped to the next gen going through the same thing.

It’s such a physically demanding role, unlike any other on the field, and it’s probably so front and centre it’s noticed more - ie if a defender squibs a handful of contests it’s noticed but forgotten pretty quickly, for a ruckman they roll up and contest the next contest, again and again and again so there’s no where to hide. It’s just not a fun role for a young ruck finding their way I wouldn’t think.

 

[True Dog]

Training Report, Monday 16th January

Another slick and fast session at Skinner Reserve. Bevo and the coaches have the boys bouncing and energised, completing another two-hour hit-out in mild conditions.

Here are my notes:

1. The players were split into various sized groups (12 on 12, 7 on 7 and some smaller groups, plus revised and rehab programs). Drills included the following:

a) Condensed ground match play, with a focus on one team starting with control and running the ball out of defence to hit a target on the wing. If a turnover was achieved, the 'offensive' team's objective was to score. The pressure and intensity was electric, with some great pressure acts and intercepts from the forwards, matched only by the equally impressive kicks out of the backline and the workrate of players to find space to present a target.

b) I enjoyed an up-close look at players practicing the action of collecting the ball close to the boundary and then turning sharply to hit a target on both the preferred and then opposite foot. Rohan Smith was vocal about his expectations and eaves the troops in no doubt of what they need to do.

c) The third extended drill involved players releasing from deep in defence to a running target out wide at half back. That player then cut back on diagonals through the centre square to a target at the opposite point of the square at half forward. This was as sharp as I have seen, with Dale, Daniel, Bont, Macrae, JJ and Williams standing out.

2. Bontempelli continues to shine with his class and faultless use of the footy. He was striking the ball with such authority and precision, one 55-metre rocket out of defence to Dale was pure poetry. Surely its not possible to go up a level when you are The Bont?

3. Bedendo was at the front of the packs in sprint drills and he has clearly worked on his acceleration and speed, as he is moving like a jet. Considering his aerial ability, he is going to be incredibly difficult to match up on. He has a noticeable rise in confidence and it is paying dividends. He plays Round One.

4. English completed defensive marking drills post training and was the last to leave the track along with Libba and Caleb who worked together on low laser passes from ground ball receives, simulating fast movement and vision from a centre scrimmage. Some of Caleb's hits should be preserved to be viewed in wonderment at ACMI. He is a weapon.

5. Garcia is just so clean off the deck. He is firming as one of the big improvers over the summer. He is composed and field kicking has been impressive.

6. Arty Jones worked with Travis Varcoe on forward craft again. He strikes me as a kid willing to learn and his focus today was body work in the marking contest to protect the ball drop for a long ball over the back, which he could then run onto and mark or use his pace to then run to goal. Varcoe has a great rapport with him and Arty's development is obvious.

7. Our tall defenders continue to look in great shape. Keath has slimmed considerably and has shown his mobility and intercept ability is back to where it was in 2021. His partners in crime - Jones and Gardner - look strong and fit, while Bruce is plying his craft to push those three for selection. Tim O'Brien returned to training with the main group today and also worked hard.

8. Lobb and English had outstanding sessions. Lobb's long kicking continues to be a feature and accuracy on set shots will bring supporters much joy, while Tim's ground coverage was exceptional. Sweet looked mobile around the ground and offers good back-up.

9. Weightman has bulked up and looks to have add strength to his frame. His energy was infectious and constantly encouraging his teammates. JJ was another who continues to be very instructional on the track off the ball and directing a lot of the positional set ups from our forwards when the opposition have the ball.
10. Bailey Smith ran lengths before leaving the track early (planned). He has been feeling sore but will be back in full action next week. Similarly, Charlie Clarke is a little tender with some lower back soreness and ran lengths and laps with West, who continues to build from knee soreness also. Treloar trained away from the main group and continues to have lingering soreness on his ankle that required surgery. Conditioning staff said it will not hinder his selection for the start of the season. Crozier was also on light duties, walking laps. He told me he was on "old man duties" and that this was the fastest he has moved all summer. Given the firmness of the surface, any tightness or tenderness has a no-risk policy. Busslinger participated in some ballwork, but was mainly operating separately with running exercises. Finally, Roarke Smith has had gastro and has "lost a couple of kegs", but seemed in good spirits and participating only in some limited running.

*Next training sessions this week are at 9:30 at Skinner Reserve, Braybrook. Wednesday will be a shorter session, Friday a big one. Players will head to Portsea for their camp in the first week of Feb.

Awesome recap as always ITK, I’m going to try and make Fridays session and will thank you in person.

 

[Al dente]

Agree with everything you’ve said here, but I will say that whilst I agree most of the time players don’t usually transform substantially mid career when it comes to mindset, I’m not sure that’s entirely true for rucks.

I think we see time and time again that blokes can be completely and utterly out of their depth (which lends to them looking ‘uncompetitive’ or soft if they’re copping a hiding) and one day at 28yo it just clicks, they gain confidence in their ability and it all just comes together and they spend the next few years giving back some of the s**t they copped to the next gen going through the same thing.

It’s such a physically demanding role, unlike any other on the field, and it’s probably so front and centre it’s noticed more - ie if a defender squibs a handful of contests it’s noticed but forgotten pretty quickly, for a ruckman they roll up and contest the next contest, again and again and again so there’s no where to hide. It’s just not a fun role for a young ruck finding their way I wouldn’t think.

yes the ruck position can be the exception to the rule. Fingers crossed English becomes the dominant ruck we know he can and should be

 

[Libbaaaa]

Re: Timmy I just don't want to see him getting absolutely abused by mid tier rucks in the contest anymore. Even if he breaks even against your Pittonet types that will be huge as he'll dominate them around the ground.

 

[True Dog]

Re: Timmy I just don't want to see him getting absolutely abused by mid tier rucks in the contest anymore. Even if he breaks even against your Pittonet types that will be huge as he'll dominate them around the ground.

Really no excuses anymore, he’s the right age, right size, has experience, has ruck support and will play as No1 ruck like he wanted. If he remains healthy this could be one hell of a season. Time for the Big Chill to bring the heat

 

[doggies ftw]

Re: Timmy I just don't want to see him getting absolutely abused by mid tier rucks in the contest anymore. Even if he breaks even against your Pittonet types that will be huge as he'll dominate them around the ground.

Yeah this. I think for him he’s usually played up to the level, he seems to set himself mentally for the tough match ups like Gawn etc and he doesn’t get embarrassed (Grundy aside who has ****ed him a few times) but then when he’s coming up against a mid tier maybe the same level of application isn’t there and he gets shown up when he absolutely should not be.

Needs to find that consistency to compete week in week out, to be fair injuries have hampered that for him but he’s just never had it so far in his career and we need that to change, and if it does he’s probably one of the best rucks in the league even without stepping up a level in the contest.

 

[adogsfan5]

If anyone has Instagram, get around the latest insta story from the dogs page.

Brucey spoil into Bont goal on the run…

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

If anyone has Instagram, get around the latest insta story from the dogs page.

Brucey spoil into Bont goal on the run…

 

[doggies ftw]

Bont with that iconic few long strides to the left long bomb from outside 50 is such a thing of beauty to watch. Looks exactly the same every time he executes it and it’s glorious.

Would love dead eye Bont to return this year, bloke couldn’t miss in his first few years and all of a sudden accuracy fell off the face of the planet - still usually kicks em when it matters but he’d be a 35+ goal midfielder if his accuracy returned