Opinion Recruiting and List Management Team: Hamish Ogilvie, Justin Reid & Co

[George Kramer]

The only positive, they are getting good value out of McAdam.

Apparently he’s back playing. Will be interesting when they do pick him how he goes, we are missing him up forward and I reckon he will do well for them.

 

[Pugsley]

Apparently he’s back playing. Will be interesting when they do pick him how he goes, we are missing him up forward and I reckon he will do well for them.

Better than Petty

 

[Harris1991]

We're not. No one is.

No one has any kind of genuine source on this.

It's Facebook chatter. It's completely ridiculous.

It's also impossible to believe that Melbourne wouldn't jump at the opportunity to trade Petty for two first round picks. That's a steal. Anything pick above 25ish is a huge win.

 

[George Kramer]

It's also impossible to believe that Melbourne wouldn't jump at the opportunity to trade Petty for two first round picks. That's a steal. Anything pick above 25ish is a huge win.

No it isn’t.

You’re talking about a premiership contender whose deficiency is their forward line. Petty has kicked a couple of bags late in the season and then they bombed out again in the finals.

Trade away Petty and there’s every chance they bomb out again in 2024. Their think is a premiership now not draft picks.

They even said the offer came too late to find a suitable replacement.

Knowing all that, what offer do you think we would have made to give us any real chance for them to release him 2 years early? A first rounder and McAdam? No chance was that going to be enough given they got him for a late second.

 

[skittlebrew]

Surely not. Please reassure me that we aren't this incompetent.

You really think that is beyond this list managment team?

 

[rabidcrow]

Sloane done


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[LoBu]

Any good prospects in the mid season draft around pick 7?

On SM-S928B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Eagleboy2011]

Any good prospects in the mid season draft around pick 7?

On SM-S928B using BigFooty.com mobile app

3 position available now. Hope Hamish is not asleep.

 

[George Kramer]

3 position available now. Hope Hamish is not asleep.

Or let’s hope he’s sick that day and someone takes over

 

[Eagleboy2011]

Is there a list of potential recruits? I hope we look at players nation wide not only SA.

 

[AFC979810]

3 position available now. Hope Hamish is not asleep.

We have 3 picks in the mid season draft? Thats easy.

1. Brett Turner
2. James Battersby
3. James Rowe.

 

[Eagleboy2011]

We have 3 picks in the mid season draft? Thats easy.

1. Brett Turner
2. James Battersby
3. James Rowe.

I shouldn't laugh but you never know.

 

[Bearded Clam]

Ideal offseason:

1) Completely shelve the trade offer for Petty. See how he plays in 2025 and grab him as a FA then if he lifts his game, otherwise, ignore him completely.

While I agree that he’s been very underwhelming this season, you have to note the fact that he’s much more likely to be utilised in defence for us than attack, with Welsh, Fog and Thilthorpe the “talls” in attack from 2026 onwards. Maybe we grab Petty as a FA in 2025 and use him up fwd temporarily while Welsh develops, but hopefully not.

Sure, we have have Murray, Keane, Curtin and Worrell in defence, but Curtin clearly projects as more as a flanker or wingman at AFL level longer term, and Worrell is your intercept Lever type who won’t ever be given a quality forward to take care of. Borlase will be delisted, and Butts is a depth player at best. Petty is a genuinely excellent AFL defender. Melbourne are probably the only club who would use him at the other end of the ground exclusively.

Bottom line, wasting trade capital on Petty in 2024, regardless of whether you’re planning to play him forward, back, or both, is ridiculous. Especially when you’ve recruited a black hole in the MIDFIELD, are going to finish in the bottom 6, and are entering a midfielder-heavy draft.



2) Secure Isaac Cumming as a FA. Not someone else who resembles Isaac Cumming. Isaac Cumming. Don’t care if it takes a 5 year, 850k offer (hopefully a bit less but honestly, that’s pretty standard these days). Our current options in his position (as either an attacking half back flanker /or wingman) are:

Smith (i can’t even believe he’s still in the AFL. A shell of an AFL player who is shot to bits mentally)
Milera (another long-term injury and no guarantee to ever recover)
Sholl (delist pile)
Jones (complete disappointment but I actually don’t mind him as a DEFENSIVE first player. So not in these roles at all)
Nankervis (promising, but if he’s the best option at the club in a role like this, thats actually not a good sign)
McHenry (sometimes spends time on a wing and is a disgrace)
Hinge (an ok option)
I’m not sure I can even count Parnell or Hamill. Worrell is more of a third tall. We don’t even know what Curtin is. Maybe Oscar Ryan becomes something but we don’t know that until he actually plays.

The point is, you won’t find a less inspiring list of players for those positions (who have actually played AFL football to this point) at any other club. This is a huge need for us, and Cumming is coming (lol) from an elite footy program. GWS quite simply can’t afford to go close to matching what we can offer with all the other talent they have, and with the likes of top 25 player in the comp Whitfield, plus the fast-improving Lachie Ash playing in those positions, Cumming is more expendable to the Giants than he would be to any other club. From Broken Hill. Mates with Tex. McCluggage is pie in the sky stuff. This is real, attainable, and makes perfect sense for both parties.


3) Draft the absolute BEST midfielder with the top 6 pick we end up with from this shitshow of a season. Do not get fancy and try to turn a forward or half back into a midfielder. Do not get tunnel vision and take the SA kid if a better player is available. Do not take a player who lacks speed or can’t create via foot. Do not focus on what kind of family they are from. Focus on skill level, desire and ability to impact games. If there’s a flight risk, take that into account, but it’s not everything. We need elite talent.


4) I really don’t see why we can’t or shouldn’t go after multiple free agents, so in addition to securing Cumming as priority 1A, have a crack at all of Oli Florent, Will Hayward, Brandon Parfitt and Elliott Yeo (in that order).

Cumming to replace Smith / Milera at half back, AND Florent to replace Jones / Sholl on a wing would be a huge boost for us. Cumming is definitely the higher priority as he is far more damaging by foot, but Florent is a very handy player. Let’s be honest though, Florent is almost definitely staying at the Swans or heading home to Vic.

Hayward replacing Murphy / McHenry at half forward is also a huge net win. It’s a complete indictment on our playing list that one or both of McHenry / Murphy get picked every week, and acquiring Hayward would go a long way to eliminating that need. It would also free Rankine up to play more midfield minutes, and might even get Rachele some more time up the ground too. Hayward being from SA, and Sydney needing to spend their big cash on Gulden and L McDonald means we are right in the mix here.

Failing a Hayward or Florent addition, grabbing one of Parfitt / Yeo to add to our inside mix would also be valuable, especially considering Laird is close to the end, Crouch is probably only going to decline in 2025 and beyond, and the combo of Berry / Pedlar look pretty unlikely to be AFL standard regulars moving into the future.

Yes, Yeo is pretty old, but I don’t mind him as a 3 year rental who costs nothing in trade capital and will play at a higher standard than whoever he replaces in our starting midfield, while other young mids we already have (mainly Dowling and Edwards, and perhaps we still count Schoenberg, Berry and Pedlar if anyone thinks they still have a shot at being best 18 players) PLUS others we draft in the next 2 drafts (most importantly the top 6 pick this year) continue to develop and build their AFL midfield time gradually. Yeo is absolutely killing it so far this year (among the league leaders in clearances and has been genuinely excellent in most games), and if he can stay fit for the rest of 2024 (big if), we should be at least considering trying to poach him at a bargain price.

Parfitt has looked really good for the Cats this season in a career resurgence that began late last year. He’s leading their club in tackles per game and is 2nd for them in clearances per game. Would you rather that as a starter at centre bounces than either of Laird or Berry? I would. Has SA ties too.



5) Completely ignore the high-end trade market this offseason. We need this year’s top 6 pick to grab a quality mid in the draft. We need our 2025 first rounder for either another quality mid, or to trade for a big name coming out of contract NEXT year. Now that Holmes and Gulden have re-signed, the best options for us this year are FREE AGENTS, which do NOT require trade capital. Do. Not. Trade. First. Round. Picks. This. Year. Trading a 3rd rounder for a ruckman with upside makes a lot of sense. Not much else does.



6) Be absolutely ruthless with list cuts. All of the following should clearly happen with our out of contract players:

McHenry > delist or trade for pick 55 odd if a club is stupid enough to offer it. He simply cannot be offered another contract here. It makes no sense.

Cook > the next 6 weeks decides his fate. I’m still open to delisting, trading, or a 1-2 year deal. He will show us what the right option is with his performances on the field between now and the bye. I sense he might stick around and I’m ok with that. The talent is there.

Hamill > delist or retain on rookie list as depth for 1 more year. Open to either. Never going to be best 22 when everyone is fit. Decent enough depth if we need it, and with Milera’s career in doubt, Smith on the way out and Parnell on the delist pile, maybe we do need him as depth.

Borlase > see Hamill. Again, maybe keep him around as depth in 2025. The return of Murray and the rise of Keane might make it less likely that Borlase gets another year than Hamill though.

Smith > delist / retire. He’s completely cooked. Why pretend anymore? Oscar Ryan, Dan Curtin, the essential acquisition of Isaac Cumming and even Chayce, Nank, Michalanney, Hinge and Worrell render his existence on the list absolutely pointless.

Himmelberg > delist, or if GwS want to donate pick 55 odd for Welsh points, be my guest. We simply can’t offer a senior contract here.

Bond > delist. Ronin O’Connor lite. No brainer.

Gollant > delist, or if another club wants to offer up pick 55ish for Welsh points, be my guest. Hugely disappointing as I thought he could really become something. Has already played his last game for us IMO.

Sholl > delist, or if another club wants to offer up pick 55ish for Welsh points, be my guest. Sure, he looked just great against North. It’s well established how he looks against real teams. Stop trying to polish this turd and quit wasting games on him. Keeping him around is madness.

Parnell > delist. No brainer even before the injury.

Sloane > he’ll be retired before this, but yeah, delist if he inexplicably is still soaking up a list spot.

Berry > re-sign for 1 year, or 2 years absolute maximum. Depth player only but a pretty damn solid one.

Tex > re-sign for 1


Footywire says Burgess is out of contract too but I don’t believe that (they say every player acquired via trade in 2023 is out of contract in 2024). He’s depth only and is unlikely to still be on our list whenever the contract we offered him finishes though.


These list cuts free up at least 7 senior list spots (I’m not sure if Parnell is currently on the Senior or rookie list, it’s 8 vacancies if he’s now a senior listed player). Fill 2 of them with Cumming and another of the FAs mentioned. Fill another with a ruckman via trade or maybe we draft a mature one. Fill another with Welsh. Fill another with the best midfielder available at our first pick in the draft. That leaves 2 other spots for new national draftees - prioritise skill and talent over anything else with these picks.

I’d say a tackling, pressure goal savvy small forward should be a priority with one of these picks. McHenry and Murphy shouldn’t ever play again. Rankine should spend 60-75% of his time in the midfield. Rachele doesn’t lock the ball in. Hayward would be a nice addition, but i still think we lack another one of these types even if we do get Hayward.

I’m not grabbing Isaac cumming as a half back flanker.. although he’s good to have on the list for that..

I’m getting him to chuck him into the centre.

Reckon he has class mid in him.. just doesnt get the opportunity at GWS due to them having 3 of the comps best mids..

 

[Harris1991]

No it isn’t.

You’re talking about a premiership contender whose deficiency is their forward line. Petty has kicked a couple of bags late in the season and then they bombed out again in the finals.

Trade away Petty and there’s every chance they bomb out again in 2024. Their think is a premiership now not draft picks.

They even said the offer came too late to find a suitable replacement.

Knowing all that, what offer do you think we would have made to give us any real chance for them to release him 2 years early? A first rounder and McAdam? No chance was that going to be enough given they got him for a late second.

If your football dept thinks Harrison Petty is the difference between bombing out or not then maybe ours isn't the worst in show.

If the AFC traded away McAdam and a pick in the mid 20's I would be happy. No way in hell is Petty worth a top 10 pick.

 

[George Kramer]

If your football dept thinks Harrison Petty is the difference between bombing out or not then maybe ours isn't the worst in show.

Forgot what you’re seeing this year, he’s been a quality player and finished the year strongly up forward before being injured. Melbourne are desperate for forwards.

You haven’t answered the question though, what do you think we would have offered for them to release him 2 years early.

 

[MrBarry]

Have to seriously question the sanity of whoever thought it was a good idea for Sloane to go again this year. Eye injury aside it was clear he was cooked last year.

 

[Jirkago75]

Spot on,

Think of Ben Davis, Rowe, Hately etc etc... All list cloggers we wasted games on or kept on the list far too long.

I’d argue about Rowe, he was limited and average at best but I’d prefer him to Murphy or McHenry. At least Rowe offered a goal threat and was a decent kick. Murphy and McHenry are poor and if you were the defender on them. You’d pay them zero respect and run off them all day.


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[marty36]

I’d argue about Rowe, he was limited and average at best but I’d prefer him to Murphy or McHenry. At least Rowe offered a goal threat and was a decent kick. Murphy and McHenry are poor and if you were the defender on them. You’d pay them zero respect and run off them all day.


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Probably agree with you but that’s shows how sad our list really is


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[Kane McGoodwin]

I really just hope we don't do something stupid with our first pick this year in supposedly a stacked quality midfield draft.

Especially if we have a top ~6 pick, we absolutely must get best available mid. Not a flanker or a 'hybrid'... BEST available MIDFIELDER.

Imagine our midfield now if we had Serong and Butters.

Our 1st is only up for trade for a gun midfielder.

 

[Bearded Clam]

Have to seriously question the sanity of whoever thought it was a good idea for Sloane to go again this year. Eye injury aside it was clear he was cooked last year.

More pointless and wasteful list management from a club run by morons..

 

[Harris1991]

Forgot what you’re seeing this year, he’s been a quality player and finished the year strongly up forward before being injured. Melbourne are desperate for forwards.

You haven’t answered the question though, what do you think we would have offered for them to release him 2 years early.

Have you checked his record as a tall forward since 2019 - ordinary at best. So if we considered him a defender, and given we are in a deep rebuild, trading a 1st round pick for anyone other than an A-grader is madness.

I would have offered them MacAdam and a pick in the 20's and when they knocked it back, no worries, move onto the next deal.

 

[Harris1991]

3 position available now. Hope Hamish is not asleep.

You will have to wake him up to find out.

It's criminal this hack is allowed to be involved in any further drafting given his horrendous record.

 

[George Kramer]

Have you checked his record as a tall forward since 2019 - ordinary at best. So if we considered him a defender, and given we are in a deep rebuild, trading a 1st round pick for anyone other than an A-grader is madness.

I would have offered them a pick in the 20's and when they knocked it back, no worries, move onto the next deal.

Agree about defender.

But now think about the clubs position not what you would do. Given the club rate him to give him a big contract and tried to entice Melbourne with late notice to release him with 2 years on his contract, what do you think they would have to offer to make it happen?

 

[FullyBigKPro]

Our 1st is only up for trade for a gun midfielder.

Having thought about it more - these are the type and calibre of players I would only consider offering up our first pick this year for (given its likely a top 6 pick)

IN order as follows:

Finn Callaghan - Tall, quick, skillfull midfielder in the perfect age bracket. Absolute definition of who we need. Total gun. Watch his game against Bris last week if in any doubt.

Chad Warner - Quick, skillful, tough midfielder who has X factor and can kick goals. Again, perfect age bracket too.

Noah Anderson - Skillfull, tough midfielder who is now starting to get goals. Not super quick but very crafty. Yes please.

*Clayton Oliver - Yes, this is the most risky but it would be a bold brave call buy the AFC which I would be open to if he stays healthy. At 26 would give us 5 quality years and immediately be an upgrade on Laird and take pressure off Dawson in midfield. Yes people will say wait till hes a FA, but then we would be waaaay down the qeue as at least 10 other clubs will be desperate to get him. As I said, would have to be bold.

Caleb Serong - Quality young mid starting to show his wares. Would instantly make up for the Macasey pick debacle.

Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera - Qaulity ball user, skillfull, quick and would be an instant long term Smith replacement.

Sam Flanders - Mid/Half back who is racking up the numbers and could fill a number of roles for us. Really like how he has developed. Reminds me a bit of a young Sloaney with his tough courageous approach.


Just an initial short list - but really just to show the calibre of player we would have to target to have any confidence giving up a top pick in a stacked midfielder draft this year.

 

[Southerntakeover]

The media tend to leave out the balance of the trades

Eg if we gave up our 2023 + 2024 1st rounders for Petty + Melbourne's 2023 1st that would be headlined as "Crows give up two first round picks"

When in reality it's one 1st round pick and one pick downgraded

Moving from the start of the round to the end of the round is probably a bit more significant than you're posing now.