Autopsy Round 11 - St Kilda v Gold Coast

[gringo2011]

Keeler was moved forward in the final term, but I really hope he starts in defence again next week. Really liked the look of Wilkie + Caminiti + Keeler. Kept King + Walter + Read to just 3 goals total

Caminiti with an equal team-high 8 intercepts. Keeler with 7

Keeler looked alright down back. Travaglia is much better off HB too.

 

[gringo2011]

Thank god you’re back el Gringus, place was very depressing without you x

You love it.

 

[CaptainRisky]

We are making ourselves a joke. We spent all our draft capital topping up to sit mid table 5 years ago. All that cohort that should be rising and carrying us up the ladder are gone. The few good ones we did draft, we let walk out.

We let hubris pick a substandard side to play West Coast and lost the trust of our fans. We promised finals and then cut the list back hard and made us youth heavy and uneven. We play laborious footy that isn't getting results and isn't enjoyable to watch the we lose.

We have one bankable elite talent under 23 and some potential but will still need all our recent draftees to overachieve to catch up because of past mistakes.

Richmond have probably added just as much talented youth in one draft as we have in all drafts since 2012. We are now about to repeat mistakes and overpay for a few players with potential to look popular. Same as SOS did at Carlton and why their list maxed out just off the peloton.

We need to shut up and get everything right from here and stop whinging like a bong smoking dole bludger that thinks he should be CEO of Apple.

100 %

 

[Minga]

Beautiful day in Melbourne too. Alarming

Can’t be that surprising. We’re 14th, Gold Coast are 3rd. We’re coming off a loss to the previously winless West Coast Eagles, one of the worst performing sides in modern football history.

4:40pm on a Sunday in the ****ing Docklands.

Honestly don’t see how anyone could expect anything different, it’s the graveyard slot.

Would be interested in seeing the expected score for this game cos despite all that there’s an argument we could’ve won if we weren’t abysmally inaccurate.

Not that we looked like the better team mind you, but we’re capable of highly competitive football, and incapable of realising that in any sort of consistent way.

Looking forward to seeing how the list develops but as is my go to now, I’m not expecting any significant and persistent development until we see a rising tide of young players come into their own. Many of them have earned reason to be optimistic.

I think it’s clear that we need to land another a grade player at the draft, or luck into one someway. We’ve got a core of youth now, keep adding to it and watch momentum turn in time.

Tauru in next week?

 

[BrutThough]

I love seeing Ross and the club call out the inequities of the competition. The all expect us to just sit back and take it, and the media (such as Josh Jenkins

11

Josh Jenkins

Age

36

Ht

200cm

Wt

108kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.9

3star

K

9.1

4star

HB

3.8

3star

M

5.1

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.1

5star

No current season stats available

D

11.0

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

1.2

3star

G

1.6

5star

little cry post-game) can't handle us not being quiet.

And the GC CEO crying about it on radio this morning that the comment implies some sort of favouritism. Mate, we can all see the favouritism. If all the discounted top 10 picks weren't enough or that extra draft picks they've been handed with the very public messaging that they are getting them because the AFL want them to play finals. Let's not pretend that the fixture they were handed to start the season wasn't manipulated to give them the easiest start to the season possible - all of last years bottom 6 in the first 6 rounds. Don't question our intelligence by acting like that was a coincidence.

Even just a small things here - they had a 10 day break before this game. Our entire break over the bye is 11 days, as short as it could possibly be. It's little things like that which show which teams get looked after by the AFL and which teams they just expect to rot.

 

[BrutThough]

We are making ourselves a joke. We spent all our draft capital topping up to sit mid table 5 years ago. All that cohort that should be rising and carrying us up the ladder are gone. The few good ones we did draft, we let walk out.

We let hubris pick a substandard side to play West Coast and lost the trust of our fans. We promised finals and then cut the list back hard and made us youth heavy and uneven. We play laborious footy that isn't getting results and isn't enjoyable to watch the we lose.

We have one bankable elite talent under 23 and some potential but will still need all our recent draftees to overachieve to catch up because of past mistakes.

Richmond have probably added just as much talented youth in one draft as we have in all drafts since 2012. We are now about to repeat mistakes and overpay for a few players with potential to look popular. Same as SOS did at Carlton and why their list maxed out just off the peloton.

We need to shut up and get everything right from here and stop whinging like a bong smoking dole bludger that thinks he should be CEO of Apple.

Not this again. It was 1 first round pick and a bunch of late picks.

We tried topping up and it didnt work. But we dont need to exaggerate what we use in those trades while doing so.

 

[Mowman]

We are making ourselves a joke. We spent all our draft capital topping up to sit mid table 5 years ago. All that cohort that should be rising and carrying us up the ladder are gone. The few good ones we did draft, we let walk out.

We let hubris pick a substandard side to play West Coast and lost the trust of our fans. We promised finals and then cut the list back hard and made us youth heavy and uneven. We play laborious footy that isn't getting results and isn't enjoyable to watch the we lose.

We have one bankable elite talent under 23 and some potential but will still need all our recent draftees to overachieve to catch up because of past mistakes.

Richmond have probably added just as much talented youth in one draft as we have in all drafts since 2012. We are now about to repeat mistakes and overpay for a few players with potential to look popular. Same as SOS did at Carlton and why their list maxed out just off the peloton.

We need to shut up and get everything right from here and stop whinging like a bong smoking dole bludger that thinks he should be CEO of Apple.

I reckon everyone involved at Carlton would’ve been contacting TDK and saying is it worth it playing in front of 13440 at Marvel 4.40 on a Sunday

 

[LeonardHayes87]

The Hammer could’ve taken 15 marks yesterday, got first hands to the ball multiple times but spilled it. In time I reckon he clunks those. If he can weed out the brain fades we might have a really good tall defender there.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

Not this again. It was 1 first round pick and a bunch of late picks.

We tried topping up and it didnt work. But we dont need to exaggerate what we use in those trades while doing so.

At this stage we are better off tanking and being shit.

Then at least afl will give us handouts.

Do the right thing and compete while rebuilding gets us nothing which is a shame, we did it right and get no rewards.

 

[gringo2011]

We need to improve our list quality no doubt, but this year still has a question mark to it as we just haven't been able to play any where near our best side, constantly not having our book ends has hurt Howard,King coupled with a slow & at time deveoloping M/F hasn't helped.

The need for TDK is more evident week in week out & Ross needs to start settling players in positions Eg: Caminiti & Keeler play them forward or back evidence shows that moving players around stiffles their development.

Fast track Boxshall,Garcia,Windhager & Pou in the M/F only play 1 of Steele or McCrae in there during centre bounces.

Keep Wood,Hill,Byrne's & Wilson on the wings we lack run and carry across those area's.

Start looking at Henry post 2025 is he going to get back to where he should be if not time to move him on.

Develop Dodson as the Number 1 ruck at Sandy for the remainder of the year see how he develops as he shows potential but playing Heath,Dodson & Boyd in the same side when they all look as though they play the #1 ruck surley isn't smart.

TDK would have made zero difference. We need a KPF and midfield quality. Carlton fans will tell you they often play better with Pittonet in the side over TDK.

We should throw money at Gruzewski from GWS not $900k for a stopper. It looks insane that Essendon pay that for McKay.

Gruzewski doesn't jump any of their KPFs in the near future and Cadman looks like he's ear marked to take over.

Chase Hustwaite, Erasmus, Harry Rowston types of good mids just outside the system. Collingwood are excellent at finding under utilised low profile types like Ned Long.

Take Donovan Toohey in the mid season draft. He's kept getting better and is now number 2 in the VFL for possessions. He can actually kick and is still young.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

I reckon everyone involved at Carlton would’ve been contacting TDK and saying is it worth it playing in front of 13440 at Marvel 4.40 on a Sunday

Entire weekend free for $5,000,000? Say no more!

 

[g_TRAIN]

Positives:

Hammer
Trav
Pou
Keeler
Owens
NAS
Sharman

All showed something.

Didn't mind LOC's game either

 

[gringo2011]

The Hammer could’ve taken 15 marks yesterday, got first hands to the ball multiple times but spilled it. In time I reckon he clunks those. If he can weed out the brain fades we might have a really good tall defender there.

I went to the game, he was very good IMO. He would look very good in a better back 6. They had a lot of inexperience in the backline yesterday. Travaglia, Keeler, LOC and Hammer is a very young set up. They actually did well over all. A lot of mistakes were due to players all going to one player or communication break downs.

 

[BrutThough]

At this stage we are better off tanking and being shit.

Then at least afl will give us handouts.

Do the right thing and compete while rebuilding gets us nothing which is a shame, we did it right and get no rewards.

Unless we move to QLD, the AFL doesnt care either way. They aren't giving us handouts if we finished last for 5 years because a successful, small victory club isnt on their agenda.

 

[gringo2011]

and we deserve everything we get, its unwatchable football and the supporters agree 13400 yesterday at the game and most leaving early. This is RTB 3rd year and we are going backwards this year.

everyone finding it easier to blame the AFL then the club it self

About the worst skilled side AFL but we train less then any other club, it was hard being there yesterday watching turn over after turn with basic skills

We are 3 -5 years away from finals

The AFL should take note though. They need to make the competition competitive and not over focus on their vanity projects. They need to farm us to pay for their shit ideas.

Anyone unsure of the damage done under Lethlean and Gallagher needs too look at our list profile.

 

[The Punter]

There's some things that need to be said:

• "we can either take responsibility for our own success or we can criticise the AFL for the broken system, but not both at the same time" is this year's version of "we can have the pride game or we can focus on footy, but not both at the same time". Of course we can do both and should. Nothing Bassatt has said has absolved anyone at the club for the responsibility for our success, but OTOH we all agree we need elite midfield talent and it's impossible to get it. You know who has it? The accurately identified nepo baby of the AFL.
• Do we want blokes who have a dip? I mean, don't we always, but Trav would want to learn how to kick. We lost yesterday for one reason: disposal. Not just on him, but Wilson, Hill & Byrnes turned the ball other by hand and/or foot.
• Leave Caminiti and Keeler back. Perhaps swap Tauru and Keeler at some stage. Play Caminiti ahead of Howard. But Stocker was missed yesterday.
• No pressure forward yesterday. It showed.
• Sharman was fantastic except for the posters, but imagine how hard he would be to defend if he was the #2 forward and not the #1. Same with Owens being #3 instead of #2.
• Good to see Steele back to very good levels.

 

[stavro#4]

We are making ourselves a joke. We spent all our draft capital topping up to sit mid table 5 years ago. All that cohort that should be rising and carrying us up the ladder are gone. The few good ones we did draft, we let walk out.

We let hubris pick a substandard side to play West Coast and lost the trust of our fans. We promised finals and then cut the list back hard and made us youth heavy and uneven. We play laborious footy that isn't getting results and isn't enjoyable to watch the we lose.

We have one bankable elite talent under 23 and some potential but will still need all our recent draftees to overachieve to catch up because of past mistakes.

Richmond have probably added just as much talented youth in one draft as we have in all drafts since 2012. We are now about to repeat mistakes and overpay for a few players with potential to look popular. Same as SOS did at Carlton and why their list maxed out just off the peloton.

We need to shut up and get everything right from here and stop whinging like a bong smoking dole bludger that thinks he should be CEO of Apple.

You are kidding aren’t you?

We spent 1 first round pick Gringo at the end of 2019. 1 ****ing first. The following year we got Higgins for our first.

We picked what we had available. You do understand that our Gun Key forward hasn’t played a single game. Our full back is again missing a large chunk. We were robbed of seeing Tauru. Phillipou & Clark have missed effectively half a season. We have been wiped out with injuries to blokes who should be supporting the kids in Dow Cordy. We are the third youngest list and we have shown more than any of the bottom 5 with those restrictions. The swans are missing Gulden and have fallen apart ffs.

Richmond traded their equivalents talents of Sinclair Marshall Battle to acquire their bounty. The very thing you are completely against. We have to give to get because it’s almost impossible to build with our 1 single FRP. TDK is better than Marshall and if he wants out - it should be our avenue to a second top 10 pick via taking advantage to the clubs like Sydney who need the points.

There looks to be plenty coming up behind Nas. Owens looks as good as 23 without the senior support along side him. Sharman another who has come along. But really unless we nail free agency it’s about draft picks and they need to come from somewhere without AFL handouts like the suns Brisbane giants swans etc all get.

 

[Hayes4PM]

Isn't it interesting that we will be absolutely torn to shreds in the media this week for pointing out the fact that Gold Coast get ridiculous access to this talent, at the cost of cellar dweller minnows like us because the big Vic clubs poached their talent. St Kilda are in absolute no mans land when it comes to talent access, and we will be ripped apart for it.

Nah, it's pretty accurate, and Lyon's comment was clearly made in good spirits, Dimma and co. just fired back after hearing it rather than seeing the interview. They can try and get defensive, but at the end of the day they have been offered hand out after hand out. It's the elephant in the room.

Given a larger list size than other clubs for almost all of their existence, given academy privileges that extend to about a quarter of Australia, the AFL ambassador payments and then you look at the free kick differential this year to the Suns well clear of anyone else.

The AFL wants to expand into QLD, they need Gold Coast to succeed for that agenda, ipso facto, bingo boingo etc etc. they are getting the golden goose treatment. Don't think it's a smart PR move from Gold Coast to let the spotlight linger on this little exchange.

 

[jwikked]

You love it.

Reported. We’ve had enough of this kind of rhetoric.

 

[stavro#4]

Can’t be that surprising. We’re 14th, Gold Coast are 3rd. We’re coming off a loss to the previously winless West Coast Eagles, one of the worst performing sides in modern football history.

4:40pm on a Sunday in the ****ing Docklands.

Honestly don’t see how anyone could expect anything different, it’s the graveyard slot.

Would be interested in seeing the expected score for this game cos despite all that there’s an argument we could’ve won if we weren’t abysmally inaccurate.

Not that we looked like the better team mind you, but we’re capable of highly competitive football, and incapable of realising that in any sort of consistent way.

Looking forward to seeing how the list develops but as is my go to now, I’m not expecting any significant and persistent development until we see a rising tide of young players come into their own. Many of them have earned reason to be optimistic.

I think it’s clear that we need to land another a grade player at the draft, or luck into one someway. We’ve got a core of youth now, keep adding to it and watch momentum turn in time.

Tauru in next week?

Expected score still had us losing by 13 points.

 

[Desperate saint]

My thoughts.

At half time I had lost all hope in our rebuild and in the talent of our young players.

By full time, I was more positive but also circumspect in that if we do make it to a GF in the next 5 years, it will be through grit and system rather than talent and we’ll probably be up against a nepo baby club. However the crappy Tigers sides that won flags a few years ago is proof that a good system can win flags.

Positives:

• captain Steele showing something
• Boxshalls desperation. This kid will be a star.
• Keeler getting his hands on the footy!
• Cama taking the front position and intercepting. That was a breath of fresh air.
• Travalgia’s run and carry and superb handball game to get run going. Don’t worry about the kicking turnovers, we need to persist !
• Pou getting his hands on the footy and elite kicking.
• Owens getting busy.
• Windy showing some fight. Still think in the long run he’s better suited to a lockdown back pocket role or pressure forward like Rylee West.
• O Connell. I just like him.
• and the animal Hunter Clark with his tackling. Boy did he represent the jumper.

Negatives:

• coughing up handballs to the oppo when getting tackled when we should hold onto it instead.
• Hill’s turnovers
• centre square mauling
• etc

so agree with the coughing up the ball when tackled with a wild handball or a knock on -unless you give it to the jumper hold on to the fffing thing and get a ball up

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Expected score still had us losing by 13 points.

Which kick a few goals in the 3rd it's probably close

 

[stavro#4]

Which kick a few goals in the 3rd it's probably close

And that’s the issue with Xscore.

We nail the 3rd quarter dominance and who knows how the last plays out.

I’m not doom and gloom about this season whilst I openly admit I’m ECO with the results.

But that’s more to do with the fact that we won’t see our best side and the suns with their plethora of gifts still struggled with our sticky tape together side.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

But that’s more to do with the fact that we won’t see our best side and the suns with their plethora of gifts still struggled with our sticky tape together side.

Only the finest of sticky tape for our side

 

[Sully111]

I wonder how many years of building it will take before our disposal and decision making isn't completely shithouse.

Even players who were considered our better players on the day.. Owens and Nas for example... were guilty of some very poor turnovers.

It's killing us.