Mega Thread VICBias - Genuine Discussion Part 2

[doppleganger]

A far more substantive statistic is games played at the grand final venue versus who wins which is skewed hugely in favour of the teams that play more games at the MCG.

Just need to actually extrapolate that to the full season.

Stats show is you want to be premier, best chance is if you play 5 or less games at the G.

 

[demondavey]

Just need to actually extrapolate that to the full season.

Stats show is you want to be premier, best chance is if you play 5 or less games at the G.

5 or less games at the MCG? Over what period of the season?

 

[doppleganger]

5 or less games at the MCG? Over what period of the season?

Kranky already provided his stats.

And as always, it is only worth talking 21st century - post ground rationalisation in Melbourne.

Break the premier into H&A games played at the G

0-5
6-10
11+

The myth is 11+ group should dominate, but nope they barely even play in GFs.

It is non Melbourne teams who play 5 or less GFs who play in the most GFs, and win the most flags.

 

[Deepthroat]

We are all being played by the media.

Last three years..

"West Coast are uncompetitive, it's a black mark on the comp, too much advantage when teams play them twice, their games are unwatchable, it results in meaningless games, we can't have a side like this, the AFL needs to look at this and intervene".

Last three weeks..

"West Coast are rich, a powerhouse, won a flag just 7 years ago. Why do they need any assistance"

 

[demondavey]

Kranky already provided his stats.

And as always, it is only worth talking 21st century - post ground rationalisation in Melbourne.

Break the premier into H&A games played at the G

0-5
6-10
11+

The myth is 11+ group should dominate, but nope they barely even play in GFs.

It is non Melbourne teams who play 5 or less GFs who play in the most GFs, and win the most flags.

So Hawthorn between 12-15 played how many at the G? Richmond between 17-19? Collingwood 2023? Collingwood 2010?

I mean, really?

 

[sr36]

That had nothing to do with the point Grin was making about the ledger being pretty much even.

Yes, when there is only 40 data points, it's best to use all of them.

Yep. It's too small a sample size to be relevant to start with and discussion of results seems to assume that teams are equal - when we all know that just isn't the case.

I would have thought posters would have realised that when we looked at the bird and mammal mascot domination of flags during the AFL era.

 

[doppleganger]

So Hawthorn between 12-15 played how many at the G? Richmond between 17-19? Collingwood 2023? Collingwood 2010?

I mean, really?

Kranky provided the stats

Of the 22, 21st century GFs won 12 have been to non-Melbourne teams who played 5 or less

55% of flags....and if you consider for the first half of the century GC and GWS didn't exist, pretty obvious that they are not disadvantaged as per the sooking.

But I guess when you consider how entitled the whingers are, I guess it is unfair to them that sometimes a Melbourne based club wins a flag.

 

[doppleganger]

I would have thought posters would have realised that when we looked at the bird and mammal mascot domination of flags during the AFL era.

It is feline bias

Lions, Tigers and Cats have won 11 of the 24 21st century premierships.

AFL needs to act!!

 

[demondavey]

Kranky provided the stats

Of the 22, 21st century GFs won 12 have been to non-Melbourne teams who played 5 or less

55% of flags....and if you consider for the first half of the century GC and GWS didn't exist, pretty obvious that they are not disadvantaged as per the sooking.

But I guess when you consider how entitled the whingers are, I guess it is unfair to them that sometimes a Melbourne based club wins a flag.

Didn’t answer my question mate.

We had a surge of 6 non vic premiers then it went totally vic centric. Of those big centric premiers please look at the MCG games. If you can’t look at that then see yourself out.

 

[Carringbush2010]

We are all being played by the media.

Last three years..

"West Coast are uncompetitive, it's a black mark on the comp, too much advantage when teams play them twice, their games are unwatchable, it results in meaningless games, we can't have a side like this, the AFL needs to look at this and intervene".

Last three weeks..

"West Coast are rich, a powerhouse, won a flag just 7 years ago. Why do they need any assistance"

Different opinions from different people, ignore.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Didn’t answer my question mate.

We had a surge of 6 non vic premiers then it went totally vic centric. Of those big centric premiers please look at the MCG games. If you can’t look at that then see yourself out.

It's ALWAYS been vic centric, this comp is an expanded vfl, how could it not be?

 

[doppleganger]

Didn’t answer my question mate.

We had a surge of 6 non vic premiers then it went totally vic centric. Of those big centric premiers please look at the MCG games. If you can’t look at that then see yourself out.

Hawks won 4 of them.

Hawks are the team that travels most of any Melbourne team, usually playing 9-10 games outside of Vic...so only actually 13 in Melbourne. That fixture is more like an SA club than a team like Essendon or Collingwood who play 17 games in Melbourne.

The Hawks played only 9 games at the G during H&A in 2013 and 2015, and also played 2 finals in WA in 2015 enroute to the flag.

The other "Vic side" to dominate premierships is Geelong with 4 flags. Geelong also only tend to play 7-8 games in Melbourne, they have their own home ground in a different city.

They avg just 4 games at the G when they won their flags.

Geelong's fixture is also nothing like the "advantaged" big Melbourne clubs like Essendon and Carlton who play 17 games in Melbourne.

What Geelong have (and Hawthorn created in Tassie) is a strong home ground advantage.

Cat Park is a fortress, and teams only ever play there once per year...whilst Cats play 9-10 and train there often.

Tassie is miserable, cold and windy, and teams also only ever play there once per year...whilst Hawks play 4-6 times down there most years, as they do pre-season trips and train there too.

The two successful "ViC" teams are the two who play the least games in Melbourne.

Playing heaps of games in Melbourne at neutral grounds that almost all clubs are familiar with isn't an advantage...what you want is a large number of games where you enjoy a strong home ground advantage, and then to play away games at familiar venues.

 

[demondavey]

It's ALWAYS been vic centric, this comp is an expanded vfl, how could it not be?

In terms of premiers….

 

[Carringbush2010]

In terms of premiers….

So non vic won a bunch in a row and vic have won a bunch in a row, not a conspiracy, who cares?

 

[demondavey]

So non vic won a bunch in a row and vic have won a bunch in a row, not a conspiracy, who cares?

Well by in a row you mean 6, with 3x against non vic clubs compared to 18x GF where 2x have been non vic winners against vic runners up. I mean apparently 18 years isn’t a good enough sample size for your mate doppleganger. You’ve also got to realise the game has evolved substantially the last 20 years in terms of preparation, recovery, training etc. The travel factor is more important then ever.

Nobody is wanting to replace big clubs playing at the G, I just want the travel to fall in line with the non vics for the back end of the year so come finals the levels are even. As it stands now Collingwood and other clubs in the past have had great runs coming into finals.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

We are all being played by the media.

Last three years..

"West Coast are uncompetitive, it's a black mark on the comp, too much advantage when teams play them twice, their games are unwatchable, it results in meaningless games, we can't have a side like this, the AFL needs to look at this and intervene".

Last three weeks..

"West Coast are rich, a powerhouse, won a flag just 7 years ago. Why do they need any assistance"

Just on that ie "media", these are the 2nd and 3rd top NEWS stories in the Herald Sun rn wouldn't know finals are around the corner

 

[Carringbush2010]

Nobody is wanting to replace big clubs playing at the G

Agreed, no need to mention it then.

I just want the travel to fall in line with the non vics for the back end of the year so come finals the levels are even.

You say this now, but if Collingwood had a run of non travel at the front end or in the middle there'd be complaints about that too, probably yourself as well, you say you wouldn't, I say yeah sure Jan.

As it stands now Collingwood and other clubs in the past have had great runs coming into finals.

True, probably because leading into finals vs having a front ended run at home would likely bring more through the gates and the remotes

 

[demondavey]

Agreed, no need to mention it then.

You say this now, but if Collingwood had a run of non travel at the front end or in the middle there'd be complaints about that too, probably yourself as well, you say you wouldn't, I say yeah sure Jan.

True, probably because leading into finals vs having a front ended run at home would likely bring more through the gates and the remotes

I’d be very happy with Collingwood having a front ended MCG draw. I’ve been saying this adnauseum.

 

[demondavey]

Just on that ie "media", these are the 2nd and 3rd top NEWS stories in the Herald Sun rn wouldn't know finals are around the corner

View attachment 2382976

Was Hird even a good coach?

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Was Hird even a good coach?

He was bloody awful

New lows for the Hun

 

[Carringbush2010]

I’d be very happy with Collingwood having a front ended MCG draw. I’ve been saying this adnauseum.

Yeah and I don't believe you.

 

[demondavey]

Yeah and I don't believe you.

I couldn’t GAF what you believe. You’re a complete and utter non entity to me. You’re just a name on an Internet forum like I am to you. Believing me or unveiling the truth will never be tested so there’s literally no logic in saying I don’t believe you. You don’t know me. To believe me you’d have to know me or know a lot about me beyond interacting on this site.

Saying you don’t believe me based on this limited conversation simply shows how basic you are.

 

[demondavey]

He was bloody awful

New lows for the Hun

Essendon just can’t let go off the past. Hird and Sheedy. That’s all they have.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I couldn’t GAF what you believe. You’re a complete and utter non entity to me.

Couldn't GAF.

 

[demondavey]

Couldn't GAF.

Lovely.

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