2018 Rolling All Australian Team

[GhostofJimJess]

Higgins and Tarrant both good and our best again

Keeping that AA form going

Higgins got to be a lock, he's been brilliant. Tarrant is a gun and should've been AA the last two years but might struggle this year. I probably wouldn't use yesterday as a selling point though - the whole backline was torn to shreds.

 

[Damon_3388]

As much as I would love him in, still take Brown and Buddy ahead of him.

Surprised there isn’t more love for Blicavs though. I think his been amazing all year but probably a tad bias.

Among players that have played at least 13/17 games this year (equivalent to 17/22 across the full season), Hawkins is:

#3 in goals per game (on pace for a 7th straight 45+ goal season)
#4 in goal assists per game (career high average)
#12 in marks per game (leading all forwards, career high average, indicating that the workrate and mobility is still there)
#1 in marks inside 50 per game (works back towards goal too)
#3 in contested marks per game (showing that he's not just taking uncontested "cheapies" up the ground)
#3 in score involvements per game
#13 in tackles inside 50 per game (#1 at Geelong, #2 among key forwards, betraying the idea that he's too slow and doesn't provide enough forward pressure)

Also averaging a career-high 15.13 disposals per game, again a product of workrate and mobility.

I've said this before, but what more does he have to do?

 

[A Swallow]

Among players that have played at least 13/17 games this year (equivalent to 17/22 across the full season), Hawkins is:

#3 in goals per game (on pace for a 7th straight 45+ goal season)
#4 in goal assists per game (career high average)
#12 in marks per game (leading all forwards, career high average, indicating that the workrate and mobility is still there)
#1 in marks inside 50 per game (works back towards goal too)
#3 in contested marks per game (showing that he's not just taking uncontested "cheapies" up the ground)
#3 in score involvements per game
#13 in tackles inside 50 per game (#1 at Geelong, #2 among key forwards, betraying the idea that he's too slow and doesn't provide enough forward pressure)

Also averaging a career-high 15.13 disposals per game, again a product of workrate and mobility.

I've said this before, but what more does he have to do?

Be rated in the top 2-3 KPF’s over the course of the season I’d say.

 

[MadMaxx]

Afl team of the week
Most selected player after gaff and gawn

As picked by Kane Cornes, who is an ÜberSpüd.

Irrelevant

 

[moond0g]

Be rated in the top 2-3 KPF’s over the course of the season I’d say.

Fair call.

And obviously Brown and Buddy are as close to locks as you can get. But who would you have 3rd? I think Hawkins has as much claim to that spot as anyone else

 

[DanA]

Fair call.

And obviously Brown and Buddy are as close to locks as you can get. But who would you have 3rd? I think Hawkins has as much claim to that spot as anyone else

That’s the issue for me. He’s 3rd or 4th behind Darling and I’d rather go Grundy (2nd ruck) than 3rd KPF.

 

[A Swallow]

Fair call.

And obviously Brown and Buddy are as close to locks as you can get. But who would you have 3rd? I think Hawkins has as much claim to that spot as anyone else

Yeah I agree. He’s fighting for 3rd with Darling, Riewoldt and Hogan for mine. Kennedy an outside chance with a huge last 6 weeks.
Hawkins is a chance for sure, but with the top two pretty well locked in it’s hard.

 

[Damon_3388]

Be rated in the top 2-3 KPF’s over the course of the season I’d say.

Given what he's doing, why isn't he rated among the top 2-3 key forwards? What else does he have to do?

IMO he's been the best and most consistent key forward this year, and ticks all the boxes - goals, playmaking, marking, workrate, and defensive efforts.

 

[Damon_3388]

Luke Breust has him covered

Breust has all non-key forwards covered this year.

 

[A Swallow]

Given what he's doing, why isn't he rated among the top 2-3 key forwards? What else does he have to do?

IMO he's been the best and most consistent key forward this year, and ticks all the boxes - goals, playmaking, marking, workrate, and defensive efforts.

He’s had a comparable year stats-wise to Hogan, Riewoldt Darling & Franklin. They are all having a similar output, and hard to split for the 2nd and 3rd key forward positions. (Assuming they pick 3).
I find it difficult to say Hawkins has been better than Brown, 11 goals more as a key forward is significant. He’s averaging a few more touches, but Brown has clearly been the best KPF so far this season.

 

[PhatBoy]

He’s had a comparable year stats-wise to Hogan, Riewoldt Darling & Franklin. They are all having a similar output, and hard to split for the 2nd and 3rd key forward positions. (Assuming they pick 3).
I find it difficult to say Hawkins has been better than Brown, 11 goals more as a key forward is significant. He’s averaging a few more touches, but Brown has clearly been the best KPF so far this season.

Has brown played all games? Not being facetious - genuine question as I know Hawkins has missed 2 from memory.

 

[Tyruddanaut]

Stewart Rance Hurn
Sicily Tarrant Laird
Gaff Cripps Cotchin
Breust Franklin Edwards
Gray Brown Dangerfield
Gawn Mitchell Fyfe

Grundy Higgins Westhoff Selwood

 

[A Swallow]

Has brown played all games? Not being facetious - genuine question as I know Hawkins has missed 2 from memory.

Yeah he has, Brown has played two extra games. Brown averaging 3.0 goals per game and Hawkins 2.70. Though consistency over an entire season should be rewarded IMO.

 

[Damon_3388]

He’s had a comparable year stats-wise to Hogan, Riewoldt Darling & Franklin. They are all having a similar output, and hard to split for the 2nd and 3rd key forward positions. (Assuming they pick 3).
I find it difficult to say Hawkins has been better than Brown, 11 goals more as a key forward is significant. He’s averaging a few more touches, but Brown has clearly been the best KPF so far this season.

Among 191cm+ forwards to played 13/17 games in 2018 so far:

Goals Per Game
1. Ben Brown - 3.06
2. Lance Franklin - 3.00
3. Tom Hawkins - 2.73
4. Jack Darling - 2.62
5. Jesse Hogan / Jack Riewoldt - 2.41

Score Involvements Per Game
1. Lance Franklin - 8.50
2. Tom Hawkins - 8.07
3. Jack Darling - 7.77
4. Jesse Hogan - 7.35
5. Jack Gunston - 6.88

Inside 50s Per Game
1. Lance Franklin - 5.00
2. Jack Riewoldt - 3.65
3. Charlie Curnow - 3.27
4. Jack Gunston - 2.94
5. Jesse Hogan - 2.88

Goal Assists Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 1.20
2. Jack Riewoldt - 0.88
3. Lance Franklin - 0.86
4. Jack Darling - 0.85
5. Ben Brown / Jarryd Roughead - 0.76

Marks Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 7.07
2. Jack Darling - 7.00
3. Lance Franklin - 6.93
4. Charlie Curnow - 6.40
5. Jesse Hogan - 6.29

Contested Marks Per Game
1. Jack Darling - 2.85
2. Tom Hawkins - 2.40
3. Jack Riewoldt - 1.94
4. Charlie Curnow - 1.93
5. Ben Brown - 1.88

Marks Inside 50 Per Game
1. Tom Hawkins - 3.40
2. Lance Franklin - 3.29
3. Jack Darling - 3.23
4. Jack Riewoldt - 3.06
5. Ben Brown - 2.82

Tackles Inside 50 Per Game
1. Jack Riewoldt - 1.47
2. Tom Hawkins - 1.40
3. Charlie Dixon - 1.18
4. Jack Watts - 1.14
5. Josh Jenkins - 1.06

If we're then affording a 5-4-3-2-1 points scale to each of these categories (eg. #1 ranking equals 5 points, #2 equals 4 points, and so on), then the players would be ranked like so:

1. Tom Hawkins - 30 points (of a possible 40 points)
2. Lance Franklin - 24 points
3. Jack Darling - 21 points
4. Jack Riewoldt - 19 points
5. Ben Brown - 8 points
6. Charlie Curnow - 7 points
7. Jesse Hogan - 5 points
8. Jack Gunston / Charlie Dixon - 3 points
9. Jack Watts / Josh Jenkins / Jarryd Roughead - 1 point

Shows that Hawkins is consistent, versatile, and prolific, perhaps moreso than any other key forward this season.

 

[markm106]

Tom McDonald will surely work his way into the key forward conversation. Has played 12 games to date. At the top end of most of the key forward stats.

 

[Suma Magic]

Yeo is really putting his hand up. BOG today.

10 coaches votes would bring him to 47.

 

[dave123]

I dont watch enough other games besides eagles to know who is in


West coast candidates

Hurn
Gov
Darling
Gaff
Yeo

Outside chance Redden

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

He’s had a comparable year stats-wise to Hogan, Riewoldt Darling & Franklin. They are all having a similar output, and hard to split for the 2nd and 3rd key forward positions. (Assuming they pick 3).
I find it difficult to say Hawkins has been better than Brown, 11 goals more as a key forward is significant. He’s averaging a few more touches, but Brown has clearly been the best KPF so far this season.

I think if Brown maintains this gap in the Coleman, he's a lock for full forward. Hawkins has closed the gap to Franklin though and whenever Franklin's name is in the mix, there's always the opportunity to stick him on a flank, or put Hawkins in a pocket or whatever.

I think the forward line and interchange bench is where players get in on merit, rather than 'team balance'. If there's been three outstanding key forwards that year, what's wrong with having a forward named on the interchange bench? Team balance shouldn't exactly be the main consideration when it's a ceremonial team. As long as it doesn't look utterly ridiculous, I think you take a bit of creative licence to ensure it's as close to the most outstanding 22 players in the competition that year as possible.

 

[Damon_3388]

Tom McDonald will surely work his way into the key forward conversation. Has played 12 games to date. At the top end of most of the key forward stats.

Is he really going that far above and beyond others to make up for the fact that he'll have missed at least 5 games though? I don't think so.

 

[MasterSamurai]

I would suggest that Breust is having a better season than his 2014 AA year.
Bar a few games, he’s been on fire for most of the year.

 

[eth-dog]

Grundy probably just edged him. But neither did much that day.

v Ryder. 16 touches & 53 hitouts (won that battle)
v Bellchambers. 16 touches 2 goals & 43 hitouts (coaches gave him the 10 votes)
v Goldstein. 18 touches, 6 marks & 50 hitouts (once again the coaches gave him the full 10 votes)
Didn't get to play NikNat.

Would you care to try again champ?

Not that he wasn't best on but Bellcho didn't play that day.

 

[eth-dog]

Okay. Posted this on the Essendon board. A simplistic way of ranking them, but goals and goal assists combined this season (top 10):

1. Ben Brown 65 (52 goals + 13 Assists)
2. Tom Hawkins 59 (41 + 18)
3. Luke Breust 57 (41 + 16)
4. Jack Riewoldt 56 (41 + 15)
5. Lance Franklin 54 (42 + 12)
6. Jesse Hogan 53 (41 + 12)
7. Tom McDonald 49 (37 + 12)
8. Jake Melksham 47 (21 + 26)
8. Will Hoskin-Elliott 47 (34 + 13)
10. Jade Gresham 46 (30 + 16)

I probably have Hawkins ahead right now. Melksham's stats are excellent, if he was more accurate in front of goal he'd be in the squad and quite possibly the team. WHE very unlucky to be behind JDG right now in my team. The team I last posted has a couple of changes to make however:

Stewart - McGovern - Simpson
Hurn - Davis - Lloyd
Sidebottom - Mitchell - Gaff
De Goey - Franklin - Gresham
Hawkins - Brown - Breust
Gawn - Macrae - Oliver
Cripps - Whitfield - Higgins - Dangerfield

Hurn captain, Phil Davis vice. Those who say a second ruck ahead of a 3rd tall forward, Brown and Hawkins are both capable rucks.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Okay. Posted this on the Essendon board. A simplistic way of ranking them, but goals and goal assists combined this season (top 10):

1. Ben Brown 65 (52 goals + 13 Assists)
2. Tom Hawkins 59 (41 + 18)
3. Luke Breust 57 (41 + 16)
4. Jack Riewoldt 56 (41 + 15)
5. Lance Franklin 54 (42 + 12)
6. Jesse Hogan 53 (41 + 12)
7. Tom McDonald 49 (37 + 12)
8. Jake Melksham 47 (21 + 26)
8. Will Hoskin-Elliott 47 (34 + 13)
10. Jade Gresham 46 (30 + 16)

I probably have Hawkins ahead right now. Melksham's stats are excellent, if he was more accurate in front of goal he'd be in the squad and quite possibly the team. WHE very unlucky to be behind JDG right now in my team. The team I last posted has a couple of changes to make however:

Stewart - McGovern - Simpson
Hurn - Davis - Lloyd
Sidebottom - Mitchell - Gaff
De Goey - Franklin - Gresham
Hawkins - Brown - Breust
Gawn - Macrae - Oliver
Cripps - Whitfield - Higgins - Dangerfield

Hurn captain, Phil Davis vice. Those who say a second ruck ahead of a 3rd tall forward, Brown and Hawkins are both capable rucks.

For a pure forward, I'd say the importance of stats could be ranked something like this:

1. Goals
=2. Contested marks, marks inside 50, goal assists
=5. Inside 50s, score involvements
=7. Tackles and other disposals

 

[markm106]

Is he really going that far above and beyond others to make up for the fact that he'll have missed at least 5 games though? I don't think so.

I know he hasn’t massively put performed that lot. But he could legitimately end up averaging the most goals per game. And if he plays every game for the rest of the year surely he’s in consideration. Especially if he puts up a couple more big games.

 

[Seeds]

Be rated in the top 2-3 KPF’s over the course of the season I’d say.

He is in the top 2. Brown averaging .3 more goals a game but Hawkins averaging more then 0.5 goal assists per game. Put them together and Hawkins is better. Actually Hawkins is slightly better then franklin as well on the combined goals and goal assist stats.

If you just pick two key forwards it’s Hawkins and franklin right now.