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List Mgmt. 2021 Trade Thread - Part I

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Delisted;
-

Traded;
-

Retired;
Jake Carlisle
Shaun McKernan

Current Players Out of Contract;
3. Zak Jones - Link
6. Sebastian Ross (RFA) - Link
7. Luke Dunstan (RFA) - Link
13. Jack Lonie - Link
15. Jack Billings (RFA) - Link
18. Patrick Ryder - Link
24. James Frawley - Link
25. Dean Kent - Link
38. Oscar Clavarino - Link
39. Darragh Joyce - Link
41. Paul Hunter - Link
42. Max Heath - Link
45. Sam Alabakis - Link


To see the full list (it gets updated regularly) visit this thread;

List & Contract Status

SENIOR LIST 1. Jack Higgins 2. Marcus Windhager 3. Zak Jones 4. Lance Collard 5. Brad Crouch 6. Sebastian Ross 7. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera 8. Bradley Hill 9. Jack Steele 10. Mitchito Owens 11. Hunter Clark 12. Max King 13. Ryan Byrnes 14. Liam Stocker 15. Paddy Dow 16. Daniel Butler 17. Isaac...
www.bigfooty.com www.bigfooty.com
 
I think an ideal trade period for us now looks something like:
  • Dunstan out
  • Charlie Constable In
  • Keep Billings on reduced coin
  • Ross to GC and
  • Ben King in (plus whatever it takes)
  • Kieren Briggs in
  • Will Gould in
  • Carlisle delist
  • Frawley delist
  • Hunter delist
  • McKernan delist
  • Clavarino persist
 
Interesting time for those 3.

Billings the most room for improvement and potential to help us into finals IMO.
Ross the most decorated and durable.
Dunstan playing the best football of the three currently, but is surrounded by similar players.

I reckon we'll be very open-minded about all three but keep at least one, probably Ross I imagine, hope we hold onto Billings and he rips it up next year.
 
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CursingFijian said:
I think an ideal trade period for us now looks something like:
  • Dunstan out
  • Charlie Constable In
  • Keep Billings on reduced coin
  • Ross to GC and
  • Ben King in (plus whatever it takes)
  • Kieren Briggs in
  • Will Gould in
  • Carlisle delist
  • Frawley delist
  • Hunter delist
  • McKernan delist
  • Clavarino persist
Click to expand...

I'd loved us to get Constable. No shame in being behind the likes of Selwood, Danger, Guthrie, Duncan, Parfitt etc. He could flourish given the chance. In fact, when he's played he's always done well.
 
Winmar2Lockett said:
Well that is where we disagree.

Seb & Spook aren’t winning us a flag (more likely to cost us with simple skill errors when we least can afford them to).

At some stage you’ve got to back the younger players.


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Click to expand...
If you look at Sydney (Warner, McDonald, Goulden) and Essendon (Cox, Perkins, Jones) this year who have introduced multiple younger drafted players it is the quickest way to give your club an added boost up the rankings. Both teams will likely play finals this year. Port also did it a few years back with Crozee, Butters and Duursma.

As a contrast West Coast gave up multiple first round picks for Kelly and now they have no good youngsters coming through. We did the same with Hill and I bet we would all like our time over again with that deal. Picking up and blooding Sharman is an example of what is possible if we have the fortitude.
 

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CaptainRisky said:
Pick 55 - Brad Miller (Melbourne/Richmond)
Pick 58 - Dane Swan (Collingwood)
Pick 71 - Brian Lake (Western Bulldogs/Hawthorn)
Pick 53 - Adam Selwood (WCE)
Pick 55 - Ryan Crowley (Fremantle)
Pick 64 - Nick Malceski (Sydney)
Pick 53 - Daniel Jackson (Richmond)
Pick 55 - Sam Fisher (St Kilda)
Pick 58 - Ben Hudson (Adel/WB/Brisbane/Coll)
Pick 61 - Michael Rischitelli (Bris/GC)
Pick 73 - Shane Tuck (Richmond)
Pick 53 - Lindsay Thomas (NM)
Pick 55 - Robbie Gray (PA)
Pick 63 - Tyson Goldsack (Collingwood)
Pick 71 - Justin Westhoff (PA)
Pick 79 - Jesse White (Syd/Coll)
Pick 82 - Aaron Edwards (NM/Rich)
Pick 53 - Michael Walters (Fremantle)

Yeah Nah ,,,, No good players are available after the first round
Click to expand...
Yeh there s some gems but chances are most end up de listed after a few years . We of all clubs should know that as we’ve had a massive turnover. There’s nothing wrong with having Billings players on your list at the lower end of valuation in the best 22. It’s a gamble not worth taking now that he will be on a pay cut for a pick in mid 30s 40s imo.
 
Winmar2Lockett said:
Well that is where we disagree.

Seb & Spook aren’t winning us a flag (more likely to cost us with simple skill errors when we least can afford them to).

At some stage you’ve got to back the younger players.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
This + 1000000000000000000000000
 
busso_mick said:
If you look at Sydney (Warner, McDonald, Goulden) and Essendon (Cox, Perkins, Jones) this year who have introduced multiple younger drafted players it is the quickest way to give your club an added boost up the rankings. Both teams will likely play finals this year. Port also did it a few years back with Crozee, Butters and Duursma.

As a contrast West Coast gave up multiple first round picks for Kelly and now they have no good youngsters coming through. We did the same with Hill and I bet we would all like our time over again with that deal. Picking up and blooding Sharman is an example of what is possible if we have the fortitude.
Click to expand...
I agree. I think young players bring a real burst of energy to the player group, and if they have solid leadership who can help channel that energy then I think it's healthy for the 40 man squad. Again, I hope that in coming years we have enough talent to be able to rotate players through. Not only does this help manage niggles, but it means the experience of the youth continues to grow. This only happens if we can start the season with a wins.
 
BigMonty said:
Great comment.

Kent just does nothing special. He may be quick but rarely see it. Cannot compete in the air does not crumb well...much prefer Battle. Dees have not suffered by him leaving.

Anyway just pointing out that going to the draft is not a bad thing in lieu of drafting players....Hill has left me a bit cold that's all.

Hanna's cost a lot but not in terms of draft picks..so can live with that.

We are on the right track just need to add some top end quality have enough GOF and role players.

Difference was clear against Geelong. Danger is a hardened elite footballer and we could not stop him...Geary would have been handy. His handballs are questionable as is some of his body positioning same with Selwood...but I am looking through one eye.

Geel have in that team 2 Brownlows 2 Coleman's and numerous GF PF appearances within their team...we have in reality none. To make GFs this dynamic needs to change.

On SM-G977B using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...

If King can become Cameron it would make a massive difference. What a champion does is also bring focus on themselves so that others can get off the chain. By having two players focus on Danger you get an older Selwood a bit more time and space or Menagola can get free. King frees up Membrey and Coops to get free.

We also need some depth in the midfield so that if any players are sore or out of form there is always someone playing at a top level in the VFL to walk in to their spot.
 
Winmar2Lockett said:
Sorry mate, can't agree with that in the slightest.

We don't know what we'll get in return for starters.... Billings aside getting a 2nd or 3rd rounder for Dunstan & Seb is more than a fair return.

Everyone who's worried about losing a few senior players is ignoring the quality kids that are coming up behind them... and who aren't kids anymore. 2022 will be time to throw more responsibility the way of Clark, Coff, Byrnes, Bytel, etc. They're the ones who have to be relied upon to push us towards to where we want to be. Not Dunstan and Seb. Billings is still a super talent who could have a big influence on growing this team into a flag contender. If he stays then all well & good, if he goes then we all hope like hell that Libba can jag a Touk Miller type 2nd rounder rather than a Brad Howard.
Click to expand...

this.

it's also assuming they wont target more players in the off-season.

take the three talked about: Billings, Dunstan and Ross.

reality is Billing is now a forward flanker. Hill and Dmac and to a lesser extent Byrnes/Clark have pushed him out. he's the easiest of the 3 to replace. they grow on trees pretty much. its where you blood newly drafted, potential mids.

the way i view it, Gresham is coming back, he takes billings spot with the added bonus of being able to play in the guts.

Dunstan, we really need more help for Steele/Jones/Crouch. Bytel could develop. Byrnes could see more time in there. Clark could have a good pre season and step up. We could also be drafting a pure inside mid who will spend time in there. Or even target a mature player.

Ross, if hanners can get fit that fixes that problem. If not i think Clark will suit that role. Ross is used as a sweeper almost.
 
Winmar2Lockett said:
That wasn’t the point though…

Yes we’re better with Sir Patrick

But Roma is more than a decent #1 when asked to do the job by himself


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Click to expand...

I'm not sold on marshall as number 1 ruck. i think his best position is a resting ruck. he just doesn't have the dominance or body for a full season.

i really hope the new kid comes on. we need an absolute bull in there, if ryder breaks we are effectively screwed.
 
Ducky Tie said:
Don't need five elite mids to be a quality side, even without an elite tap ruckman. We're probably one or two high end mids away from where we need to be. Lots riding on whether or not Clark can get there.
Click to expand...


You probably need two high end to elite mids and 5 to 6 very good to reliable mids to compete these days. You aren't going to get them all fit and in form at once and a couple of kids need to be getting some game time to develop along side that,.
 
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Winmar2Lockett said:
Losing 2 plodders & 1 very good but inconsistent player isn't sacking half the list.
Click to expand...


They are still players that take away quality depth at the very least. We aren't rebuilding. If we are they have been lying to us. The club said they expected this year to be a down year but 2022 is challenge time. If they lose those three we would be one of the youngest least experienced sides in the comp with our outs. That's getting bottom 6 vibes not premiership vibes. Hopefully the list management isn't as trigger happy as you are.
 
Ducky Tie said:
We're probably one or two high end mids away from where we need to be.
Click to expand...

Amen brother.

We don't need any more solid citizen mids; we've got plenty now having brought in jones and crouch to compliment ross, dunstan, bytel, byrnes etc.

What we do need is 2 genuine stars to run alongside steele everyweek plus those solid citizens.

Fingers crossed we already have them in clark and gresh... but no guarantees with either.

Dunkley is still getting sidelined at the dogs, I hope we are trying to get our hooks into him this year or next year.
He's not the perfect fit, but we shouldn't let imperfect be the enemy of excellent.

We should be targeting the top shelf or nothing... if we settle for something like constable etc on the 2nd or 3rd shelf we are screwed.
 
No point in trading out Dunstan and Ross for like for like or small upgrades.

I am maybe wrong but can’t recall a premiership winning team lately that had an abundance of players traded in. Most are drafted and developed.

Tigers GF2020 team had Prestia and Lynch, the 2019 team had 3 traded in I think.

Our 22 at the weekend had 9 players traded in. Don’t mind adding a few pieces to complete the puzzle but we are trying it to build the puzzle this way and history suggests it won’t work, all the while we are trading away our future doing it.

I don’t even want to know what % of our salary cap is taken up by these players.
 
Winmar2Lockett said:
Well that is where we disagree.

Seb & Spook aren’t winning us a flag (more likely to cost us with simple skill errors when we least can afford them to).

At some stage you’ve got to back the younger players.


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Click to expand...
How long do we persist with them? We have made the finals once in a decade with Spook not in the team.

We can't continue to play the same players and keep failing
 
Winmar2Lockett said:
That's all fine and dandy but it should not be forgotten what Cho & Trout inherited from the previous regime.

Ageing superstars, a few good mid age players and virtually no decent kids. Then made worse by the AFL's plastic franchise fantasy and free agency. Just a terrible time to fall off a cliff & need to rebuild.

It's been a horrible decade which ever way you cut out.
Click to expand...


Just every move seemed to be the wrong one. Poor drafting, losing the older generation meant having no older heads to speed development, the club kept misreading how close they were etc. Sold players to get access to the draft and blew picks.

Anyway it looks a lot better now. Late season form has shown our depth to be much better than we thought. We have found another bunch of players that can all be depth at a minimum and in hindsight we didn't need to chase the old crocs that we did. Still have a few promising kids and a solid if unspectacular core.
 

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Winmar2Lockett said:
That wasn’t the point though…

Yes we’re better with Sir Patrick

But Roma is more than a decent #1 when asked to do the job by himself


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Click to expand...
Learning to win without Ryder is critical too I reckon. Not saying Marshall has worked or is a better tap ruckman, clearly he isn't, but we need to go through that learning and shake some of the players perception that we can't win without Paddy. At some point we will need to play with either just one ruckman or without someone as good as Ryder. I've enjoyed seeing us persevere without him.
 
sammm said:
how long ago wehre all of those pick ups. none that i can see in the last 3 years.
Click to expand...
The article i got that from was from 2000 - 2010
 
A few of the names thrown up these past few pages:

E33mp6sVUAA8BXP.jpg
 
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