List Mgmt. 2021 Trade Thread - Part II

George · Aug 24, 2021

Continued in Part III

List Mgmt. - 2021 Trade Thread - Part III

We are onto Part 3.

www.bigfooty.com

Delisted;
Oscar Clavarino
Sam Alabakis

Traded;
-

Retired;
Jake Carlisle
Dylan Roberton
Shaun McKernan
James Frawley

Current Players Out of Contract;
7. Luke Dunstan (RFA) - Link
13. Jack Lonie - Link
25. Dean Kent - Link
39. Darragh Joyce - Link
41. Paul Hunter - Link

To see the full list (it gets updated regularly) visit this thread;

List & Contract Status

SENIOR LIST 1. Jack Higgins 2. Marcus Windhager 3. Zak Jones 4. Lance Collard 5. Brad Crouch 6. Sebastian Ross 7. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera 8. Bradley Hill 9. Jack Steele 10. Mitchito Owens 11. Hunter Clark 12. Max King 13. Ryan Byrnes 14. Liam Stocker 15. Paddy Dow 16. Daniel Butler 17. Isaac...

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Restricted and Unrestricted Free Agency Window
Friday October 1 – Friday October 8

Trade Period
Players: Monday October 4 – Wednesday October 13
Picks: Monday October 4 – tbc (approx. Friday November 19)

List Lodgement 1
tbc (approx. Thursday October 28)

Delisted Free Agency Window 1
tbc (approx. Friday October 29 - Monday November 8)

List Lodgement 2 (Final date for primary list delistings)
tbc (approx. Tuesday November 9)

Delisted Free Agency Window 2
tbc (approx. Wednesday November 10 - Friday November 19)

StCicatriz · Sep 30, 2021

Captain Paddy said:
GCS could’ve had King, King & Smith instead of Lukosius, Rankine and King.

they shoot themselves more than anyone shoots them.

I dunno how they get out of this mess. It feels like a pattern of recycling talent.

Is their plan to wait for the explosion in junior footy in North qld to come through?

jwikked · Sep 30, 2021

StCicatriz said:
yes

Where did they say this? If it’s clear enough for you to give glib one word replies about it, show the actual quote.

Baker_for_PM · Sep 30, 2021

What's the likelihood of us actually trading any one in? I wouldn't mind if for once we don't trade away a 2nd round pick this year rather just go for the best player with our first and then get the academy boys. The only potential trade I've actually heard being brought up is for another ruck for depth. I like Flynn but I doubt he we leave GWS, Ladhams probably would cost to much for a decent player at this stage and I don't think we should look at mason because of his age.
I get shot down each time I bring this up but I wouldn't mind us enquiring about Constable from Geelong I think his potential is huge if he is given a decent crack at it.

George · Sep 30, 2021

jwikked said:
Where did they say this? If it’s clear enough for you to give glib one word replies about it, show the actual quote.

They've never said it lol, I've listened to the interview Healy is referring to. It was a few months ago. What we need to ask actually is are people really stupid enough to believe any club is going to say they expect to sign a contracted player, haha. It's just exaggerated nonsense for clicks and an unfair but easy excuse to find fault with the club if it doesn't eventuate. Don't bother entertaining the garbage. A good tip is to get your information from more credible sources than Gerard Healy lol.

St Kilda chief Matt Finnis on list management, Max King and the future of footy in China - 3AW is Football

omny.fm

Leigh Matthews asks him if he's going to be chasing players from other clubs and his response was;

"There's no doubt we were very deliberate and felt like we needed to fill some gaps in our list and we targeted players accordingly. But we also need to balance that with bringing in youth and so I'd imagine that you'd see us prioritising the draft again at the end of this year, but having said that if there's players keen to come and we can get them in a way which balances our interest with our salary cap then we'd never say never"

Leigh then asks "Max King's brother?" They laugh, and Finnis says "He'd look good wouldn't he?"

Then they moved on to discussing King's contract and other topics.

And then months later Gerard Healy (who I doubt bothered to go back and actually listen to the interview) says this;

“It’s amazing,” he said on Sportsday. “I don’t hear anybody from another club talking about players from anywhere else other than Gold Coast (discussing) who’s on their radar. “Nobody is hearing about a player at Collingwood who is on a club's radar, it’s borderline embarrassing and disrespectful. “To me this particular one… a club 12 months out is saying (Ben King) is on their radar.”

One thing Gerard seems to forget is that we haven't spoken about Ben King unless we've been asked about it. Every time we've said something along the lines of "he's a good player, isn't he?" and obviously we see the connection with his brother playing here. That's as far as it's ever gone. Embarrassing and disrespectful is actually what they're doing - trying to get snippets out of other clubs about contracted players. If he wants to spin it in a way that suggests we said Ben is on our radar then I'll spin it and suggest all he was saying is that he's a talented footballer.

Either way, like I said, it's the time of the year where nothing is happening so space needs to be filled with garbage. Nowhere did we say we expect to get him.

Sunshine Sainter · Sep 30, 2021

StCicatriz said:
i've got a bit of a different take to others on this.

i actually agree with Healy and its not because i think its insulting to GC. it's because it backs our club into a corner. we are telling people we should be able to get that trade done and we are not even trying to hide it. Caro has reiterated it on national TV. Lloyd has done the same and on radio. its gone into print media and social media.

so what happens if we don't make this happen. we are going to look like absolute fools. so brazenly stating another clubs player is ours, then when we go to make it happen and it falls over? either because he re-signs or he nominates another club.

this bullishness cuts both ways. great if comes off. but if it doesn't it looks bad.

but lets imagine he doesn't re-sign and he nominates us. how does this position us come trade time, after all this bravado. same for any contract negotiation.

i would have liked us to be quiet and work behind the scenes to get that one sorted. instead of calling something 2 seasons out! something that's not even in our control!

again it's not GC i am concerned with. it's us.

Very good point. When shopping for car or house, with multiple inspections a considerable time out, do we keep telling the owner how valuable it is and how much we want it? And if we do, does this affect the sale price?

To the Gold Coast, we are not really interested in Ben King, we have a surplus of great and very good forwards and all talk regarding Ben King is just media hype. Our only interest would be in doing the right thing, to make a family reunion possible for a young guy who desperately wants to play with his brother. We view Ben's interest in possibly coming to St Kilda, more as a community service than anything else.

Pardon me · Sep 30, 2021

botts said:
Maybe we need a witch doctor to do some magic down at Moorabbin. Break our curse of bad luck. Worth a shot. Anyone know one?

Well we do have a Sharman (sic) on the books...

Edit: Chef Ratts beat me to it!

bird_man · Sep 30, 2021

Teflon said:
do not get this at all
Soft front runner at AFL level
Makes no sense

I'm not for or against it, just pointing out his strengths and weaknesses.

The fact that we are going to have a heap of list spots to fill with very little draft picks though means we'll most likely have to pick up DFA's.

We are going to struggle to find any DFA that every one will be happy with.

Chef Ratts · Sep 30, 2021

Twomey just released his top 30 draft prospects for September. No Michito, but...

Midfielder
183cm/82kg
16/5/03
Sandringham Dragons/Vic Metro
A member of St Kilda's Next Generation Academy, Windhager's progress this season has caught more eyes than just those of the Saints. Powerful and flexible, Windhager can be used in midfield roles or at either end of the ground. He overcame a knee reconstruction last year to piece together a strong campaign in 2021 and will be on the verge of the top-20 – where the Saints would not be able to match a bid for him.

bird_man · Sep 30, 2021

George said:
They've never said it lol, I've listened to the interview Healy is referring to. It was a few months ago. What we need to ask actually is are people really stupid enough to believe any club is going to say they expect to sign a contracted player, haha. It's just exaggerated nonsense for clicks and an unfair but easy excuse to find fault with the club if it doesn't eventuate. Don't bother entertaining the garbage. A good tip is to get your information from more credible sources than Gerard Healy lol.

St Kilda chief Matt Finnis on list management, Max King and the future of footy in China - 3AW is Football

omny.fm

Leigh Matthews asks him if he's going to be chasing players from other clubs and his response was;

Leigh then asks "Max King's brother?" They laugh, and Finnis says "He'd look good wouldn't he?"

Then they moved on to discussing King's contract and other topics.

And then months later Gerard Healy (who I doubt bothered to go back and actually listen to the interview) says this;

One thing Gerard seems to forget is that we haven't spoken about Ben King unless we've been asked about it. Every time we've said something along the lines of "he's a good player, isn't he?" and obviously we see the connection with his brother playing here. That's as far as it's ever gone. Embarrassing and disrespectful is actually what they're doing - trying to get snippets out of other clubs about contracted players. If he wants to spin it in a way that suggests we said Ben is on our radar then I'll spin it and suggest all he was saying is that he's a talented footballer.

Either way, like I said, it's the time of the year where nothing is happening so space needs to be filled with garbage. Nowhere did we say we expect to get him.

And then there was the recent Gallagher interview where he was asked the question and shut it down straight away.

All the speculation is driven my the media.

It seems the be the first question asked of anyone at the club this time of year.

BrutThough · Sep 30, 2021

Captain Paddy said:
GCS could’ve had King, King & Smith instead of Lukosius, Rankine and King.

they shoot themselves more than anyone shoots them.

Bailey Smith was never leaving Victoria. Doubt he would have made it up there for day 1, let alone stay for at least 4 years.

sammm · Sep 30, 2021

Hubnester said:
Are we though?
I've heard us say that obviously, yes, we'd love to have him.
But I've not heard us say we expect to get him. Have I missed it or is that based on what people external to the club have reported?

That is correct, StKilda have not come out and said they will get B King, or they will trade for him. all they have said is yes like all clubs we would love to have him.

George · Sep 30, 2021

bird_man said:
And then there was the recent Gallagher interview where he was asked the question and shut it down straight away.

All the speculation is driven my the media.

It seems the be the first question asked of anyone at the club this time of year.

Yep spot on, that's actually the embarrassing and disgraceful behaviour. Got nothing to do with us and we shouldn't have to shoulder the blame for others inability to comprehend or just blatantly make shit up.

sammm · Sep 30, 2021

George said:
They've never said it lol, I've listened to the interview Healy is referring to. It was a few months ago. What we need to ask actually is are people really stupid enough to believe any club is going to say they expect to sign a contracted player, haha. It's just exaggerated nonsense for clicks and an unfair but easy excuse to find fault with the club if it doesn't eventuate. Don't bother entertaining the garbage. A good tip is to get your information from more credible sources than Gerard Healy lol.

St Kilda chief Matt Finnis on list management, Max King and the future of footy in China - 3AW is Football

omny.fm

Leigh Matthews asks him if he's going to be chasing players from other clubs and his response was;

Leigh then asks "Max King's brother?" They laugh, and Finnis says "He'd look good wouldn't he?"

Then they moved on to discussing King's contract and other topics.

And then months later Gerard Healy (who I doubt bothered to go back and actually listen to the interview) says this;

One thing Gerard seems to forget is that we haven't spoken about Ben King unless we've been asked about it. Every time we've said something along the lines of "he's a good player, isn't he?" and obviously we see the connection with his brother playing here. That's as far as it's ever gone. Embarrassing and disrespectful is actually what they're doing - trying to get snippets out of other clubs about contracted players. If he wants to spin it in a way that suggests we said Ben is on our radar then I'll spin it and suggest all he was saying is that he's a talented footballer.

Either way, like I said, it's the time of the year where nothing is happening so space needs to be filled with garbage. Nowhere did we say we expect to get him.

the same when Gallagher came onto Sports day recently. everyone form the Saints is'playing the same tune' saying the same things.

CursingFijian · Sep 30, 2021

George said:
They've never said it lol, I've listened to the interview Healy is referring to. It was a few months ago. What we need to ask actually is are people really stupid enough to believe any club is going to say they expect to sign a contracted player, haha. It's just exaggerated nonsense for clicks and an unfair but easy excuse to find fault with the club if it doesn't eventuate. Don't bother entertaining the garbage. A good tip is to get your information from more credible sources than Gerard Healy lol.

St Kilda chief Matt Finnis on list management, Max King and the future of footy in China - 3AW is Football

omny.fm

Leigh Matthews asks him if he's going to be chasing players from other clubs and his response was;

Leigh then asks "Max King's brother?" They laugh, and Finnis says "He'd look good wouldn't he?"

Then they moved on to discussing King's contract and other topics.

And then months later Gerard Healy (who I doubt bothered to go back and actually listen to the interview) says this;

One thing Gerard seems to forget is that we haven't spoken about Ben King unless we've been asked about it. Every time we've said something along the lines of "he's a good player, isn't he?" and obviously we see the connection with his brother playing here. That's as far as it's ever gone. Embarrassing and disrespectful is actually what they're doing - trying to get snippets out of other clubs about contracted players. If he wants to spin it in a way that suggests we said Ben is on our radar then I'll spin it and suggest all he was saying is that he's a talented footballer.

Either way, like I said, it's the time of the year where nothing is happening so space needs to be filled with garbage. Nowhere did we say we expect to get him.

Well said.

I thought the banker was pretty clear we aren’t chasing Ben King and he isn’t part of this years trading plan.

I would say the extent of our dealings with the GC this year will be trying to find out how we can get our hands on some of their later draft picks, which they are on record as saying will not be used this year and they are keen to exchange for future picks.

I’d definitely trade a future second for a second this year.

bird_man · Sep 30, 2021

CursingFijian said:
Softer than Hill?

No, but Hill has the talent to get by.

He's have to bring a harder edge if he were going to make it

bird_man · Sep 30, 2021

Still no signing for Seb Ross?

gringo2011 · Sep 30, 2021

luca77 said:
Someone ought to call up Gerard on his show and tell him that what's embarrassing and disrespectful is him playing dumb and pretending that there isn't a very specific set of circumstances that has led to this discussion taking place.

We've got an identical twin playing for the club he grew up supporting on the cusp of finals, and his brother playing for a club with a history of poor performance and poor player retention. We've got countless media outlets and 24 hour sports media, and he thinks the question won't be asked and answered.

You're not a dill Gerard, stop pretending you are one for the sake of being a drama queen and getting headlines.

Forget about Ben King. How would the Gold Coast look with Tom Lynch or Charlie Dixon up forward. They were poached without the twin connection or the supporter connection, and went to top clubs (a premier in fact). Where was the uproar then, you cantankerous fop?

The way we publicly push the idea that he'll come back to the Saints is a dangerous one IMO. It's likely to annoy the Suns who we still have to appease in a trade. In the past we have been burnt by wanting to get the trade story out to push memberships and publicity up before they are done. We don't hide our desperation and are ripe to be reamed by people like Bell. We have been kind of arrogantly joking about stealing him off them, if I was them I'd want to bend us over.

George · Sep 30, 2021

CursingFijian said:
Well said.

I thought the banker was pretty clear we aren’t chasing Ben King and he isn’t part of this years trading plan.

I would say the extent of our dealings with the GC this year will be trying to find out how we can get our hands on some of their later draft picks, which they are on record as saying will not be used this year and they are keen to exchange for future picks.

I’d definitely trade a future second for a second this year.

Yeah exactly. More truth would be nice. Not healthy to bite on every piece of shit that gets reported lol

gringo2011 · Sep 30, 2021

Hubnester said:
Are we though?
I've heard us say that obviously, yes, we'd love to have him.
But I've not heard us say we expect to get him. Have I missed it or is that based on what people external to the club have reported?

Suns “upset” by Saints CEO's Ben King comments

Gold Coast aren't happy with the comments from the Saints chief.

www.sen.com.au

mighty_sainters · Sep 30, 2021

Amazing the amount of talk on Ben King in the media currently, he isn’t going anywhere this trade period.

Unless there’s a chance????

Wouldn’t want to lose Rankine, Lukosius and King all next year.

Yawkey way · Sep 30, 2021

StCicatriz said:
I dunno how they get out of this mess. It feels like a pattern of recycling talent.

Is their plan to wait for the explosion in junior footy in North qld to come through?

Trade more picks for established players, the draft is hit and miss anyway. Build a decent team with some select high end draft picks and focus wherever possible on Qld talent.

The AFL have made things unnecessarily difficult Imo, why a trade week, why can’t you trade players during the season, why can’t you trade kids you’ve just drafted. Draft tampering is a ripper as well, why shouldn’t a kid be honest and say don’t draft me because at best I’ll be two and out. If you back yourself in to change the kids mind who’s fault is it if you can’t and he requests a trade.

Lastly it’s a sporting graveyard, the Lions argued against another team and who’s to say they couldn’t have grown football just as much on their own. Maybe they would have played 3 games a year on the coast and the AFL could have pumped some of that money into local clubs for junior development.

Joffaboy · Sep 30, 2021

Who cares if we disrespect Fold Coast.

they aren't respected by anyone in the football industry.

A fake plastic club with no support apart from AFL administrators who have making them viable a KRA on their PRD so they can get their fat bonuses.

Where was the respect for the St.Kilda fans when Ben King indicated he wanted out of GC after two years and the AFL came and and rorted the SC with 'ambassador' money to basically make a 20 y.o one of the highest paid players in the game and deny the 55,000 Saints members the chance to see him in our colours?

Fold Coast is a basket case and a money pit. they can't manage their books and have 38 contracted players currently on their books. The need to make three mandantory changes to their list and have committed to Chol.

That means there will be a fire sale of under performing players on over inflated contracts.

So nope no respect for them. All they have done is the drain the competition of talent and are a farce. But I am sure the AFl will keep pouring millions into them and keep screwing over the smaller clubs like they did with Kings contract.

Yawkey way · Sep 30, 2021

Joffaboy said:
Who cares if we disrespect Fold Coast.

they aren't respected by anyone in the football industry.

A fake plastic club with no support apart from AFL administrators who have making them viable a KRA on their PRD so they can get their fat bonuses.

Where was the respect for the St.Kilda fans when Ben King indicated he wanted out of GC after two years and the AFL came and and rorted the SC with 'ambassador' money to basically make a 20 y.o one of the highest paid players in the game and deny the 55,000 Saints members the chance to see him in our colours?

Fold Coast is a basket case and a money pit. they can't manage their books and have 38 contracted players currently on their books. The need to make three mandantory changes to their list and have committed to Chol.

That means there will be a fire sale of under performing players on over inflated contracts.

So nope no respect for them. All they have done is the drain the competition of talent and are a farce. But I am sure the AFl will keep pouring millions into them and keep screwing over the smaller clubs like they did with Kings contract.

Who‘s crying for the guys who will be forced out through miss management but it’s all hand wringing and tears when someone wants to be traded. Ben king was always a high risk pick, if he leaves who’s even remotely surprised.

Chef Ratts · Sep 30, 2021

Still hard to fathom how a player who kicked 47 goals for a team that finished 16th with a percentage of 76ish doesn't feature in their b&f top ten

Jade Buddha · Sep 30, 2021

Baker_for_PM said:
What's the likelihood of us actually trading any one in? I wouldn't mind if for once we don't trade away a 2nd round pick this year rather just go for the best player with our first and then get the academy boys. The only potential trade I've actually heard being brought up is for another ruck for depth. I like Flynn but I doubt he we leave GWS, Ladhams probably would cost to much for a decent player at this stage and I don't think we should look at mason because of his age.
I get shot down each time I bring this up but I wouldn't mind us enquiring about Constable from Geelong I think his potential is huge if he is given a decent crack at it.

I think the thing with Constance is he’s too similar to our other slow miss like Dunstan and Ross. Why get rid of Dunny to get Dunny mark 2?

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