Autopsy 2022 Round 5 Heart attack Blues hold on again
- Thread starter The Old Dark Navy's
- Start date
- Tagged users None
thylacine60
Premium Platinum
- Banned
- #927
isn't that what opposition teams said when we staged massive comebacks against them in the past, only to fall short? people who think supporters are oblivious to our shortcomings are truly deluded..........
Not the same thing, but yesterday we were ahead vs Port in:
Total distance 276.4km v 270.1
Total at High Speed 34.6 v 33.6
Average speed in attack 7.7 v 7.3
Average speed in defence 7.6 v 7.3
Beyond Blue
Club Legend
- Jun 25, 2021
- 2,473
- 8,069
- AFL Club
- Carlton
We’ve already got 3 interceptors on the list - Gov, Marchy and Parks - the problem is 2 of them are so often injured and the other is raw.
Every club, knows what gameplan every other team has and how to combat it and break it down
The biggest difference to the best sides and someone like us is continuity, repetitiveness and cohesion of better players staying on the park over that period
Demons finished 17th in 2019, 9th in 2020 and prior to that, were still building their brand
The biggest difference to the best sides and someone like us is continuity, repetitiveness and cohesion of better players staying on the park over that period
Demons finished 17th in 2019, 9th in 2020 and prior to that, were still building their brand
Interesting, numbers don't always tell the full story but that would suggest it wasn't a fitness issue.
Maybe mental/tactical where we get too defensive to protect the lead? We seemed to lack overlap run in the second half and our forwards were often outnumbered...possibly our small forwards rolling back to help block up space and defend a bit too much and we lose forward structure ahead of the ball.
I also noticed when our opponents have the ball at half back, we run across to that side to condense the ground. However in both the Port and Hawks games, there were times where they would switch the ball, our zone would move across, then they'd simply switch it back to free players who didn't really move from the original wing. So that's extra running our players did for nothing in the end.
thylacine60
Premium Platinum
- Banned
- #932
couldn't believe the way port brought the ball down the wing and flanks 3 times in a row yesterday without us touching it..........
- Mar 19, 2014
- 571
- 1,574
- AFL Club
- Carlton
I believe our issue is a 50/50 split between mental and physical.
When we are under pressure (both scoreboard and territorial) we resort to bombing it long down the line rather than working hard laterally to spread their zone and then create some run from behind when we move the ball in the middle, break the line and kick over the zone to one on one contests or advantage to our forwards.
There may be a physical/fitness aspect of this but I believe everyone is too scared to make an error and turn the ball over and resort to the long bomb.
This is where players like Saad, Doc and Williams should be working hard to move the ball around, observe the opposition zone and wait for an opportunity to make a run, especially with the new stand on the mark rule; basically play a Quarterback role.
Some times this may not work but at least we get our hands on the ball, halt their momentum and move them out of position if we do turn it over.
IMO, Williams is simply not fit enough. His disposal after half time is usually poor and loses any pentration in his kicking. He's not the only culprit as we probably lack the conditioning of the top teams. Again, this can be mental as players don't push themselves but I feel this is an area Voss is trying to improve upon.
There are other issues that have already been discussed such as lack of KPD, but the fact that we are playing damn good football in periods that sets us up for a win is a massive improvement on what we have seen for a long time.
When we are under pressure (both scoreboard and territorial) we resort to bombing it long down the line rather than working hard laterally to spread their zone and then create some run from behind when we move the ball in the middle, break the line and kick over the zone to one on one contests or advantage to our forwards.
There may be a physical/fitness aspect of this but I believe everyone is too scared to make an error and turn the ball over and resort to the long bomb.
This is where players like Saad, Doc and Williams should be working hard to move the ball around, observe the opposition zone and wait for an opportunity to make a run, especially with the new stand on the mark rule; basically play a Quarterback role.
Some times this may not work but at least we get our hands on the ball, halt their momentum and move them out of position if we do turn it over.
IMO, Williams is simply not fit enough. His disposal after half time is usually poor and loses any pentration in his kicking. He's not the only culprit as we probably lack the conditioning of the top teams. Again, this can be mental as players don't push themselves but I feel this is an area Voss is trying to improve upon.
There are other issues that have already been discussed such as lack of KPD, but the fact that we are playing damn good football in periods that sets us up for a win is a massive improvement on what we have seen for a long time.
Earls Smother
Club Legend
- Oct 4, 2019
- 1,332
- 4,371
- AFL Club
- Carlton
Be interesting to compare the 2 halves. Do they release stats for that?
Port were able to move the ball from end to end much too easily.
But their 6 goals in the 3rd all came from turnovers, 5 of those in our back half. And at least 5 of the 6 were decision making errors, rather than skill. We made some bad mistakes, they scored, and then we tightened up.
No doubt it looked like we tired, but we just weren't moving to make options to bring the ball out of defence. Seemed like the talk dropped off too.
Not on the AFL app
Beyond Blue
Club Legend
- Jun 25, 2021
- 2,473
- 8,069
- AFL Club
- Carlton
Yep it’s a big big problem for us and an area that plays into Freo’s biggest strength so it’s an area of major concern for next week.
- Moderator
- #938
From Twitter from yesterday's game ...
Cerra & Hewett
65 disposals
17 clearances
6 tackles
14 score involvements
10 inside 50s
DE% 84 and 91
Cerra & Hewett
65 disposals
17 clearances
6 tackles
14 score involvements
10 inside 50s
DE% 84 and 91
Justnetime
Team Captain
- May 18, 2021
- 521
- 1,047
- AFL Club
- Carlton
I think the argument for Kennedy to be dropped falls to you. You say too slow but that wasn’t an issue for you versus the tigers and doggies I guess?
You might indicate a drop in last two games output possession wise but then you didn’t call for Cerras dropping when he also had two bad games in a row. So no consistency there.
Kennedys output over 5 games still equals the averages of a player like Wines over four games. Panic much?
You post later in this thread about speed and running not really being Carlton’s issue at all yet you post earlier in the thread that Kennedy should be dropped as too slow.
You have enough insight to be dangerous.
Carltons problems are elsewhere. Not on Kennedys back. Dropping him ruins integrity. If in two more games he is average then there is a case.
That’s why we need to target an intercept defender..... !!!
No, I didn't call for Cerra to be dropped after a couple of poor weeks, because Cripps was out. And the first 2 weeks and this week, we played with 4 mids, not 5, and that seems to be a better structure for us.
My argument has been Kennedy is the logical player to make way for Cripps (the guy who is 4 votes off the lead in the AFLCA Award, despite missing almost 2 games) when he comes back in due to what would seem to be our best structure. You haven't addressed that at all.
Coaches' Votes
9 - Charlie Curnow (CARL)
8 - Sam Walsh (CARL)
7 - George Hewett (CARL)
2 - Connor Rozee (PORT)
2 - Harry McKay (CARL)
2 - Zak Butters (PORT)
9 - Charlie Curnow (CARL)
8 - Sam Walsh (CARL)
7 - George Hewett (CARL)
2 - Connor Rozee (PORT)
2 - Harry McKay (CARL)
2 - Zak Butters (PORT)
thylacine60
Premium Platinum
- Banned
- #943
Love these circular disagreements. Recall my mother in the kitchen tapping her foot with "Explain yourself!"
Justnetime
Team Captain
- May 18, 2021
- 521
- 1,047
- AFL Club
- Carlton
Which game was it that Kennedy killed the last quarter with over 10 possessions and desperation.
I think people are a little confused. Kennedy has played two blinders, one pretty good game and two average games. Maybe one poor game for Kennedy. In two of the games he was in the argument with Cripps for best afield.
I understand why Lob gets dropped. We are accepting him of him to be just average and not a total draft bust so we excused him for 4 games. Lob never got in the top 2 players in any game. Didn’t get in the top ten of our players in any game. We were simply delighted that lob wasn’t completely useless.
Lob is someone you drop. Kennedy on the other hand was in our top players for 2 if not 3 games. Collecting over 30 possessions while getting Least time in the midfield compared to the other mids.
Port persist with Zak butters despite him having games of 13 and 23 possessions.
Jimmyonesix
Premiership Player
- Jun 7, 2019
- 3,683
- 6,773
- AFL Club
- Carlton
Been said earlier but this kicking in from a behind really S$"&S me -- even when we have played pitto silvagni tdk Mackay cripps curnow we struggle often kicking to a small in front of everyone he causes turnover then ball is stuck in the defensive half till eventually Oppo score -- we also defend badly from kick ins often sides go coast to coast .. I would imagine this is something that could be trained ??
Kemp and Stockers' worst is better than Parkes, Newnes, Cottrel best. Put Kemp and Stocker back. Move Saad and Docherty to the wings
Beyond Blue
Club Legend
- Jun 25, 2021
- 2,473
- 8,069
- AFL Club
- Carlton
Most lists would only accomodate 3 intercept defenders so Id agree going after Doedee but we’d probably have to delist Marchbank if that was the case.
Justnetime
Team Captain
- May 18, 2021
- 521
- 1,047
- AFL Club
- Carlton
But it doesn’t make sense based on games where they have played well together. Why not look to players who have never impacted to the same degree as Kennedy? Cottrell or Newnes? Both weren’t bad but both were not close to our top 7-8 players…something Kennedy has achieved.
Id drop Setterfield before Kennedy on exposed form. Kennedy has lined up on the wing before. So there is three players. I really want Setterfield to do well and despite some good defensive efforts is just in the wrong position to shine. Setterfield has done enough to hold his spot but if it’s not newnes or Cottrell then it is him based on the simple fact he hasn’t had a huge impact on any one game. Hate to do this to Setters, but his two key moments to kick a goal he fluffed. Remember he was 20 metres clear in fwd 50 and fell over trying to mark. Then his poor kick in the square.
ferrisb
Brownlow Medallist
Similar threads
- Poll
