List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread

[Snuffaluphagus]

Mod notice after Mr Bob did a lot of annoying work in moving days of posts out of here. As we are heading into offseason, this thread is for 2023 list management only. Getting upset on previous trades can be taken to the vent thread. Lets keep this thread on track in the part of the year it's actually relevant

 

[Dockeroo]

We're going to need to finish bottom 6 twice more after this year if we want a realistic chance of 2 A+ forwards. Sure would be nice though. I think we'd run into cap problems if we had them, tbh.


It's interesting to compare us to the Crows, because you see their wins where they get on top in the middle and belt teams because of the forwards. It looks great and everyone gets excited.

Then you see games where they lose the midfield and they get well beaten. This is what you'd expect when 90% of your top draft picks are in the forwardline. They appear to lack the midfield class to compete consistently away to the best sides.

I don't think it is reasonable to assume that their mids/backs will start producing more consistency as they mature unless you also grant our forwards can do the same. Our forwards have shown they can score heavily when the game is on our terms. Also, our best forward is 19 and theirs is 34 or whatever.


Also, remember there is a salary cap. You can't have all the good players on every line.

That’s all true to an extent. But I’d argue when your rebuild is 90% done and you have a hole to fill, it’s FAR easier to find a serviceable B grade defender or midfielder than a forward. Even more so if you are not a Melbourne based club with limited trade options.
Would love to get a look at Sam Flanders and he’s very good mates with Serong too so you’d think it might be possible.
An experienced cheap winger would be ideal - maybe Zac fisher or McIntosh from the tigers?

 

[Docker82]

That’s all true to an extent. But I’d argue when your rebuild is 90% done and you have a hole to fill, it’s FAR easier to find a serviceable B grade defender or midfielder than a forward. Even more so if you are not a Melbourne based club with limited trade options.
Would love to get a look at Sam Flanders and he’s very good mates with Serong too so you’d think it might be possible.
An experienced cheap winger would be ideal - maybe Zac fisher or McIntosh from the tigers?

Fisher is not much good.

Pretty sure McIntosh has recently re-signed and is already 30+.

Think we're better off developing from within tbh.

Grabbing a B Grade forward from pick 21/22 isn't impossible. It's part of the reason I've been so big on trying to package up our later picks for a second top 30 pick. It's no guarantee but I'd rather the qualy over quantity at this point. Our depth will be good enough if we develop those at Peel well enough imo - it's our best 22 that concerns me far more.

 

[Taylor]

We want a guy about as tall as Sturt with the football smarts of Sturt and the skills of either Walters or Sturt but the speed of either Frederick or Sturt - with the effort of Schultz and the stoppage creativity of Switkowski. I'd like him to be able to take a mark too.

But we will get most of the way there by finding a small forward with speed who can run into opponents.

Aiden O'Driscoll is quick and scrappy.

 

[Ge3ks]

Aiden O'Driscoll is quick and scrappy.

Is this his draft year, and where would he fall?

 

[Superkoops]

Taking emotion out of the equation players who could assist Freo at this stage of their flag window IMO.

Darling
Waterman
Kelly
Yeo
Barrass
Ryan

Won't get into what they are worth. Some more than others.

Eagles obviously interested in picks or young players. Erasmus the obvious one. Henry maybe. A ruck forward but Freo likely retains any tall forwards.

Erasmus won’t be going anywhere. He would probably have played 35 games if drafted to West Coast as compared to the 10 with Freo but he developing away nicely and an area where we need his inside skills and ball winning abilities.

Sure fringe players like Henry, Banfield, Sturt, Hughes to improve your depth but we’re not trading out Erasmus who has been on our list for only 18months - straight out of high school.

Barrass is not one I wasn’t referencing for Freo. It is an area we don’t need unless Cox was to go. If your Eagles are interested in having a stab at English - Barrass is one that would help facilitate that trade.

 

[Alfonz]

Taking emotion out of the equation players who could assist Freo at this stage of their flag window IMO.

Darling
Waterman
Kelly
Yeo
Barrass
Ryan

Won't get into what they are worth. Some more than others.

Eagles obviously interested in picks or young players. Erasmus the obvious one. Henry maybe. A ruck forward but Freo likely retains any tall forwards.

We might have signed JOM and extended Fyfe and Walters, but realistically our premiership window is not going to open for 2-3 years. We don't need to go full dad's army and the age of Darling, Kelly, Yeo becomes questionable. Plus the developing players they would push out of the side. If it was just Yeo (after playing out the season with no more injuries) for a late pick, that might be OK.

Barrass would be a dream, but even he would be the wrong side of 30 when we are challenging. And no way on earth will WC let him come here, and we don't have currency anyway. Plus it would clear the decks for WC to make a play for Taylor, when Taylor should be Freo's #1 FA target end of 2025, when we should be about to properly launch for the 2026 season (hopefully have edged into the 8 next year, and then pushed towards the top 4-6 in 2025).

Waterman just not that good. Zero interest.

Ryan is the main one I would look at, but we'd have to be sure the media would protect him like they do while he plays for WC, not harrass him like they have done with Freo players such as Hogan, McCarthy, Bennell, Yarran.

 

[Joao]

That’s all true to an extent. But I’d argue when your rebuild is 90% done and you have a hole to fill, it’s FAR easier to find a serviceable B grade defender or midfielder than a forward. Even more so if you are not a Melbourne based club with limited trade options.
Would love to get a look at Sam Flanders and he’s very good mates with Serong too so you’d think it might be possible.
An experienced cheap winger would be ideal - maybe Zac fisher or McIntosh from the tigers?

Yes I think that's mostly a function of there not being as many good forwards as mids or defenders. But I'd also argue, as Snuffaluphagus does, that we are not that far off purely because of the quality of Amiss. Once you factor in how inexperienced most of our forwards are, you realise they are probably better (in the long run) than we give them credit for. Especially the big guys (well not Amiss, I and many others foam about him constantly). I think we only need 1 more B+/A grade forward and we're set. That player may already be on the list just not anywhere near their potential.

I don't think C/B- grade players will help. McIntosh is an improvement but not worth the development time we'd give up for the 2 or 3 years we'd get out of him. Basically I don't think he's good enough to bother

Fisher just isn't any good on exposed form.

We have about 5 blokes on the list developing as wingers. I know it sucks for fans having to wait another season or two for our forwards and outside mids to come on but its just the way it is.


I'd absolutely have a crack at Flanders or Stephens if we could, but you'd think we'd be a long way back on their preferences for a move.

 

[Ge3ks]

Eagles fans are shopping their players in here now?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Someone else said it a while ago but you could argue short of somehow bringing in a quality forward, Nick Martin would probably make the biggest difference though maybe that’s paying too much for a wing

 

[Taylor]

Is this his draft year, and where would he fall?

This is his year. We have the picks to selected him currently.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Taking emotion out of the equation players who could assist Freo at this stage of their flag window IMO.

Darling
Waterman
Kelly
Yeo
Barrass
Ryan

Won't get into what they are worth. Some more than others.

Eagles obviously interested in picks or young players. Erasmus the obvious one. Henry maybe. A ruck forward but Freo likely retains any tall forwards.

Personally for mine:
Darling: If basically free I'd do it but there's a reason why half you guys have turned on him. I'm not convinced he's cooked but not convinced he's not not cooked either. Not cooked could be the difference in a flag though so there's some benefit there
Waterman: Not enough of an upgrade on our players to warrant paying best 22 salary.
Kelly / Yeo: I would take either and shuffle pieces to put Brayshaw or one of these two on a wing. Salary is the biggest problem with Kelly and injury is the problem with Yeo.
Barass: Only if Cox left otherwise there is no point, I'd almost be more interested in McGovern who has more forward ability and could make a diff up there.
Ryan: The good version of Ryan? Sure, would we get the version that tries though or the one that tries when he feels like it?

 

[poshman]

Personally for mine:
Darling: If basically free I'd do it but there's a reason why half you guys have turned on him. I'm not convinced he's cooked but not convinced he's not not cooked either. Not cooked could be the difference in a flag though so there's some benefit there
Waterman: Not enough of an upgrade on our players to warrant paying best 22 salary.
Kelly / Yeo: I would take either and shuffle pieces to put Brayshaw or one of these two on a wing. Salary is the biggest problem with Kelly and injury is the problem with Yeo.
Barass: Only if Cox left otherwise there is no point, I'd almost be more interested in McGovern who has more forward ability and could make a diff up there.
Ryan: The good version of Ryan? Sure, would we get the version that tries though or the one that tries when he feels like it?

The media would do a number on Ryan the moment he switched to us - for his sake he shouldn't want to make the move.

 

[Rockmelon]

Hope we can package some picks to move up the draft and get someone like Tholstrup if he gets to pick 15 or beyond.

Would also like to have a crack at Sam Flanders and see if he’d be willing to come across and play on a wing or as a high half forward

 

[Obeanie1]

We might have signed JOM and extended Fyfe and Walters, but realistically our premiership window is not going to open for 2-3 years. We don't need to go full dad's army and the age of Darling, Kelly, Yeo becomes questionable. Plus the developing players they would push out of the side. If it was just Yeo (after playing out the season with no more injuries) for a late pick, that might be OK.

Barrass would be a dream, but even he would be the wrong side of 30 when we are challenging. And no way on earth will WC let him come here, and we don't have currency anyway. Plus it would clear the decks for WC to make a play for Taylor, when Taylor should be Freo's #1 FA target end of 2025, when we should be about to properly launch for the 2026 season (hopefully have edged into the 8 next year, and then pushed towards the top 4-6 in 2025).

Waterman just not that good. Zero interest.

Ryan is the main one I would look at, but we'd have to be sure the media would protect him like they do while he plays for WC, not harrass him like they have done with Freo players such as Hogan, McCarthy, Bennell, Yarran.

RE Taylor someone with club contacts saying Eagles going hard to get him this year, obviously involved with a pick 1 trade discussion. However looks like he will re-sign for two more seasons and reach FA in 2025.

Eagles also throwing big offers at English and Naughton as FA's in 2024 and 2025. No surprises there.

 

[Taylor]

Sam Taylor

15

Sam Taylor

Age

26

Ht

198cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.1

4star

MG

130.5

2star

D

8.0

2star

K

2.5

1star

HB

5.5

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.5

3star

MG

60.8

1star

D

8.6

3star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.6

4star

M

1.2

2star

T

2.8

5star

MG

110.8

2star

extended until end of 2025 around the middle of 2021.

 

[Obeanie1]

Fisher is not much good.

Pretty sure McIntosh has recently re-signed and is already 30+.

Think we're better off developing from within tbh.

Grabbing a B Grade forward from pick 21/22 isn't impossible. It's part of the reason I've been so big on trying to package up our later picks for a second top 30 pick. It's no guarantee but I'd rather the qualy over quantity at this point. Our depth will be good enough if we develop those at Peel well enough imo - it's our best 22 that concerns me far more.

Fisher looks like a salary dump from the Blues.

Eagles have shown interest but it won't be a big deal trade. Similar to SPS fringe player movement.

 

[Docker82]

Fisher looks like a salary dump from the Blues.

Eagles have shown interest but it won't be a big deal trade. Similar to SPS fringe player movement.

It's possible but he won't see through your rebuild unless it ends up being a faster rebuild than expected. Basically I'd expect the eagles to give him 2-3 years if he comes and for him to be delisted after that contract is finished or maybe a year or two later.

 

[Dockeroo]

There are always moneyball players out there if we can get creative. People like Lipinski who went to the pies from the stacked dogs midfield. That type of trade for a pick 45 or so should always be open to us.
Someone like Jack Ginnivan could be an option if he remains out of favour at the pies.
Chapman needs to fit back in to our 22 soon enough too - maybe as a winger??

We should be looking at Ireland (incidentally Ultan Kelm had a great year for fermanagh this year - he’s an absolute speed demon), all overseas options (that Condon kid that commited to Collingwood despite being a freo boy was annoying). Callum Brown of GWS came from Ireland and looks a very likely type now.
You just can’t rest on your laurels in this game. Every single decent team is trying to improve for next year and coming off a higher base than us too.

 

[Joao]

There are always moneyball players out there if we can get creative. People like Lipinski who went to the pies from the stacked dogs midfield. That type of trade for a pick 45 or so should always be open to us.
Someone like Jack Ginnivan could be an option if he remains out of favour at the pies.
Chapman needs to fit back in to our 22 soon enough too - maybe as a winger??

We should be looking at Ireland (incidentally Ultan Kelm had a great year for fermanagh this year - he’s an absolute speed demon), all overseas options (that Condon kid that commited to Collingwood despite being a freo boy was annoying). Callum Brown of GWS came from Ireland and looks a very likely type now.
You just can’t rest on your laurels in this game. Every single decent team is trying to improve for next year and coming off a higher base than us too.

I don't want to cheer for Ginnivan.

The last sentence is pointless. What evidence do you have that we are not 1 of 18 teams doing this?

 

[Taylor]

I'll say it up front that if we bring across a "moneyball" player they will first get a massive wave of negativity because they will appear to be the same sort of options we currently have and a pick in the 50s at some point in history turned out to be a decent player.

Tyler Brockman could turn into Shai Bolton

10

Shai Bolton

Age

27

Ht

176cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.3

3star

K

6.9

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

12.7

3star

K

9.2

4star

HB

3.5

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.7

4star

CL

1.8

4star

D

9.2

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

4.6

4star

M

2.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.0

1star

in two years time and it will be considered good fortune that it happened, not projections of player ability with development the entire time because the first season isn't looking like Rankine in the games he dominates - even though he cost nothing like a top ten pick.

Wanting someone to fill a role, cost that sort of role price, but also be a star, isn't going to happen overnight.

It's why Henry could be such an interesting prospect for another side. Developing a defensive side to his game to partner his offensive abilities would make a very solid AFL player - if they can get him for cheap it's a win for them.

 

[blue shark]

Hope we can package some picks to move up the draft and get someone like Tholstrup if he gets to pick 15 or beyond.

Would also like to have a crack at Sam Flanders and see if he’d be willing to come across and play on a wing or as a high half forward

Unless the WA team starts to show something, the other states kids will have an advantage.
Eagles NGA just smashed colts and isn’t in the team?
Obviously individual talent is still high but why as a football state are we so poor?

 

[Dockeroo]

I don't want to cheer for Ginnivan.

The last sentence is pointless. What evidence do you have that we are not 1 of 18 teams doing this?

Nothing yet.
But if i see us turning over just 4 players from the 2023 list at the end of the season, or even less as I’ve seen some posters on here suggesting, that will be a sign that we think our list is great already and needs limited surgery.
That would be a big concern IMO as it’s clearly not good enough to win a flag at the moment.

We just signed Walters and Fyfe on 2 year deals so clearly the club thinks we can contend for the flag in 2024 or 2025.

I’m interested in where posters see Kuek fitting into the 22 long term?
Who’s place is he taking?

Brodie also - how does he get back into the team? We clearly don’t see him as a depth player of he would not be signed to 2026..

 

[Taylor]

A quarter of the list is out of contract at the end of the season still but that includes Sturt, Henry and Treacy who all played on the weekend.

 

[Dockeroo]

It is sounding more and more like tholstrup will be available at our first. According to draft watchers him and Moir from SA are sliding big time and getting overtaken by several other prospects.
Mayne they just aren’t that good then

 

[Ge3ks]

Mayne they just aren’t that good then

On that. What is Chris Mayne doing now? Thought he was pursuing a coaching career.