List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread

[Snuffaluphagus]

Mod notice after Mr Bob did a lot of annoying work in moving days of posts out of here. As we are heading into offseason, this thread is for 2023 list management only. Getting upset on previous trades can be taken to the vent thread. Lets keep this thread on track in the part of the year it's actually relevant

 

[King Tenz]

You're gonna have to forgive me because I'm totally out of the loop on player movement this year outside of Henry and Brockman.

Is Chol actually getting pushed out by the Suns or just speculation on our end trying to get their pick 4?

 

[Taylor]

You're gonna have to forgive me because I'm totally out of the loop on player movement this year outside of Henry and Brockman.

Is Chol actually getting pushed out by the Suns or just speculation on our end trying to get their pick 4?

Pick #4 is on the table but you should put Chol in the same basket as any time the media notices a player coming into a side and assumes that same type of player has to move out the other end of the bed - like Darcy with Jackson, Chol has an 18 year old top three draft pick academy player who will eventually push out a tall forward and Chol hasn't played for most of the season.

 

[King Tenz]

Pick #4 is on the table but you should put Chol in the same basket as any time the media notices a player coming into a side and assumes that same type of player has to move out the other end of the bed - like Darcy with Jackson, Chol has an 18 year old top three draft pick academy player who will eventually push out a tall forward and Chol hasn't played for most of the season.

So speculation? I'm not actually opposed to bringing in Chol as forward/ruck depth.

 

[Docker82]

I think an elite small forward could walk into the side ahead of all of Schultz, Walters and especially Emmett.

We are severely lacking the agile, one step kick snapped goal small forward that pulls a goal out of nowhere.

Walters is one of our best users and finishers, Emmett and Schultz are hard working grunt. We need the polish who will take the tag.

There was only around 15-20 small forwards in the entire competition that kicked more goals than Schultz and/or Walters.

We underrate them massively on here.

We'd basically be expecting an 18 year old to be in the top 20 small forwards in the league.

 

[Taylor]

There was only around 15-20 small forwards in the entire competition that kicked more goals than Schultz and/or Walters.

We underrate them massively on here.

We'd basically be expecting an 18 year old to be in the top 20 small forwards in the league.

Yes, an elite small forward of which you've told me there is potentially one per team on averages outside of our own could come into the league and kick bulk goals.

Forwards to have achieved this recently are not limited to Stephenson who kicked nearly 40 goals, as did Ginnivan in his first full year.

 

[Taylor]

The only way we can justify a top five pick on a player as small as Watson is if he is such a high and immediate impact that he wins the rising star in his debut season kicking 30 to 40 goals. Should he have that talent making him impossible to pass up, we should expect an elite small forward.

 

[DragoDelph]

Should be going for Lukosious instead...

 

[mayne iac]

Sounds like a Butters....will end up a hellish goal kicking Mid

 

[Purple Suit]

Yes, an elite small forward of which you've told me there is potentially one per team on averages outside of our own could come into the league and kick bulk goals.

Forwards to have achieved this recently are not limited to Stephenson who kicked nearly 40 goals, as did Ginnivan in his first full year.

Rachele kicked 17 last year from 13 games.

Pickett kicked 7 from 14 games in 2020.

I wouldn't be holding your breathe that even if we got pick 4 and a gun small fwd, that they could impact more than Walters or Shultz in the next few years. It would take an injury or two to get games in 2024.

 

[Paracleet]

Yes, an elite small forward of which you've told me there is potentially one per team on averages outside of our own could come into the league and kick bulk goals.

Forwards to have achieved this recently are not limited to Stephenson who kicked nearly 40 goals, as did Ginnivan in his first full year.

Stephenson his team made a GF and he kicked 38 from 26 matches. Has never exceed 26 since.

Ginnivan was not in his first season. Further both achieved this by lifting the defensive contribution the other forwards had to make by 1/6th each.

The chances of drafting a small forward that kicks 35 plus year one (semantics aside) is tiny, let alone with a pick outside the first round.

 

[gungho]

Rachele kicked 17 last year from 13 games.

Pickett kicked 7 from 14 games in 2020.

I wouldn't be holding your breathe that even if we got pick 4 and a gun small fwd, that they could impact more than Walters or Shultz in the next few years. It would take an injury or two to get games in 2024.

It's a fair point. Realistically, how many small forwards in the AFL are Papley, Charlie or Toby good? Shultz, Walters and Freddy kicked 33,33 and 26. It's actually not a bad return. Freddy is our most reliable set shot and is being under utilized IMO. If he could kick 40 next year it would be huge.

 

[Purple Suit]

It's a fair point. Realistically, how many small forwards in the AFL are Papley, Charlie or Toby good? Shultz, Walters and Freddy kicked 33,33 and 26. It's actually not a bad return. Freddy is our most reliable set shot and is being under utilized IMO. If he could kick 40 next year it would be huge.

Rachele also kicked 5 vs us in his first game, then went a goal a game. Kids can impact in bursts but it take someone very special who can consistently get off the chain once teams put effort into stopping them. Amiss level special.

Having that spread of goal kickers is much better and I think hoping Emmett kicks 30 is probably more realistic than a new draftee. It doesn't mean if we got one they won't be ready to take over Walters role full time in two years.

 

[Taylor]

I would expect that a player of Watson's size, assuming our talent identification is solid, would be something truly special to be rated so highly.

Expectations would need to be adjusted upwards.

 

[Docker82]

Tbf if a really good small forward came in we'd probably shift Frederick to the wing and/or drop lesser players than Schultz or Walters.

Having said that 30+ goals in a season seems a bit beyond realistic expectations for most 18-year olds. It happens but probably once or twice a decade.

 

[dominguez]

There are NFL teams that refuse to work with certain player agents.

Time for us to stop trading in Young managed players and any borderline players be delisted or not played.

Tell under 18 players Fremantle won’t draft you if you are managed by Young.

It’s time to take the gloves off.

Wilson being managed by Young didn't help his chances of staying on the list for 2024.

At some stage one of Young's WA born players will want a trade back to WA and the shoe will be on the other foot.

 

[Fyfster]

Wilson being managed by Young didn't help his chances of staying on the list for 2024.

At some stage one of Young's WA born players will want a trade back to WA and the shoe will be on the other foot.

He will just push for the Eagles.

 

[Bud]

Sam Menegola

27

Sam Menegola

Age

33

Ht

189cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.6

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

9.6

5star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.4

3star

CL

1.7

4star

D

19.6

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

9.6

5star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.4

2star

CL

1.7

4star

D

18.4

5star

K

9.0

4star

HB

9.4

5star

M

5.6

5star

T

1.8

4star

CL

1.8

4star

delisted from Geelong.. an upgrade on Colyer.. not quite Acres but a mature hard running wingman at no cost

 

[Fyfster]

Pick #4 is on the table but you should put Chol in the same basket as any time the media notices a player coming into a side and assumes that same type of player has to move out the other end of the bed - like Darcy with Jackson, Chol has an 18 year old top three draft pick academy player who will eventually push out a tall forward and Chol hasn't played for most of the season.

Choi has had some off field issues this year likes the drinkey poos a little I am led to believe .

 

[dominguez]

Extremely low probability. He was at the peel game today supporting the players. I feel like he’s part of the culture / young players who drive standards.

Darcy and Jackson both post photos on instagram drinking together which is a good sign too. Seem like genuine mates.

 

[Righteo]

The problem with bringing in midfielders is that unless they are A-grade, they are just stalling development time of Johnson and Erasmus who may become A-grade. JoM for example. That's not useful in the medium-long term, which is what our list is about.

We clearly need at least one winger just so we have someone to stick out on the wing in round 1 to replace Henry, hence Sharp.

Other than that, it's top-end only at the trade table (so probably nobody).

Especially when we also have Will Brodie gathering dust on the shelf. Outside mid and genuine small forward should be our biggest targets.

 

[dominguez]

Sam Menegola delisted from Geelong.. an upgrade on Colyer.. not quite Acres but a mature hard running wingman at no cost

He'll be 32 at the start of next season.

Finding roles for Fyfe, Brodie and O'Meara in 2024 and 2025 is already an issue, adding Menegola to the mix makes it even tougher.

 

[dominguez]

I ask again, how do you feel about taking over the two years remaining of Chol's free agency contract with Gold Coast as part of a deal to move pick #4?

To me, it all rides on the ability for Jye Amiss to play a smaller forward role as a 196cm marking player so that Chol can play the tall target down the line that was mostly vacant this year.

A midfield of Darcy, Jackson, Fyfe, Johnson is averaging about 197cm tall as it is. A forward line of Amiss, Treacy/Tabs, Chol. May as well just move the whole club to western Sydney.

I like the idea of getting pick 4, probably depends what $$ Chol is on. Around 500k a season???

 

[dominguez]

I think this is pie in the sky stuff to be honest.
What we get Chol, AND pick 4? For what in return?
We would have to give our F1 and pick 21 as a minimum starting point I’d say.

Also as I understand it, Gold Coast sorted out all their salary cap issues last year in the Bowes deal to Geelong. They have not said anything about needing to clear salary cap space in 2023. In fact, quite the opposite. They reportedly want a mature high quality player to come to the club as part of any deal for pick 4, which indicates to me that they have some salary to splash around.
I think this is just Taylor getting carried away again with unrealistic trade outcomes favourable to freo.

It’s actually quite possible that we have a tighter salary cap that Gold Coast right now, in reality. We didn’t want to pay acres what he was worth due to salary cap clearing last season.

Pick 4 is equal to 2,034 points. All our picks are equal to 1,723 points. Trade our future 3rd for a pick in the 40's this year and that's over 2,000 points plus we're taking Chol's $$ off their books.

Then head to the draft with pick 4 + whatever we get for Henry.

 

[gungho]

He'll be 32 at the start of next season.

Finding roles for Fyfe, Brodie and O'Meara in 2024 and 2025 is already an issue, adding Menegola to the mix makes it even tougher.

Going to sound really harsh here but, If O'Meara performs the same next year as this year, I'd imagine he'd be spending time at Peel, regardless of reputation or contract. At this stage you can't count on Fyfe to play anymore than 5-10 games for the year.

 

[gungho]

Gold coast aren't giving up pick 4 to get Chol off their books guys. It's not going to happen.