List Mgmt. 2025 Trade/FA Thread

[gouki88]

Appreciate the effort in getting the stats.
This is a far more nuanced argument than the head to head stats IMO. Jordy is in the same class as Heeny, Rankine and Danger all of whom can be elite contributors in the midfield and forward.
They can turn a game playing in either position and have X factor.
Rowell is a mid Bull, - that’s it. No X factor or silk, and no ability to hurt a team by playing another position.
When Ned stands him, and blunts his effectiveness being 14cm taller and probably 8kg heavier- there is no other position for Hardwick to move Rowell with any likelihood of success.

So if Jordy can get healthy then my view is that he stays, and we don’t need to sell the farm for Rowell.

He just isn't though, at least at any consistent level. In 2023 he was close to Rankine and Heeney (has never been close to Danger though), but he hasn't been close to that for a while and never over multiple seasons consecutively

 

[YouBeauty]

Degoey is twice the player Rowell is to date. Rowell might be good, no guarantee. It's all done in sept. Goat to save us again.

 

[BillyElliott]

Sorry, I have no idea what that means.
Is it a compliment?

Not that I want to get involved in this argument, but having never heard the word, I googled :

Doing the "j-diddles" means a person is drooling over the sight of a huge man arse,
while at the same time emitting a high pitched drone that resembles the sound of hitting a baby with a bag of cats.

 

[Apex36]

Appreciate the effort in getting the stats.
This is a far more nuanced argument than the head to head stats IMO. Jordy is in the same class as Heeny, Rankine and Danger all of whom can be elite contributors in the midfield and forward.
They can turn a game playing in either position and have X factor.
Rowell is a mid Bull, - that’s it. No X factor or silk, and no ability to hurt a team by playing another position.

The way you talk about Rowell makes me think you’ve never really watched him, because while he is indeed a very good clearance player, he is not just a mid bull. He’s one of the best balanced inside/outside players in the comp and he would compliment both Nick and Ned beautifully.

When Ned stands him, and blunts his effectiveness being 14cm taller and probably 8kg heavier- there is no other position for Hardwick to move Rowell with any likelihood of success.

So if Jordy can get healthy then my view is that he stays, and we don’t need to sell the farm for Rowell.

When Ned stands him and blunts his effectiveness?? I’m sorry but what is this nonsense? This has never happened, and is no fait accompli given that GC are also playing the likes of Anderson and Miller in the middle too, who are both incredibly damaging in their own right.

Don’t argue based on events that have not yet happened please.

 

[gouki88]

Degoey is twice the player Rowell is to date. Rowell might be good, no guarantee. It's all done in sept. Goat to save us again.

Have you been asleep for the last 18 months?

 

[Apex36]

You are being condescending and then trying to say what's the problem. Classic.
dO yOu eVeN waTcH muCH

And you’re being emotional and providing nothing of substance to the discussion. Only drive by’s. Stop pretending you have some sort of high ground here.

 

[Apex36]

Not that I want to get involved in this argument, but having never heard the word, I googled :

Doing the "j-diddles" means a person is drooling over the sight of a huge man arse,
while at the same time emitting a high pitched drone that resembles the sound of hitting a baby with a bag of cats.

This can’t be real

 

[BillyElliott]

This can’t be real

It is

Well it's what google told me anyway.

 

[Apex36]

It is

I swear jmac70 i was unaware of this hilarious definition

 

[sideswipe]

Not that I want to get involved in this argument, but having never heard the word, I googled :

Doing the "j-diddles" means a person is drooling over the sight of a huge man arse,
while at the same time emitting a high pitched drone that resembles the sound of hitting a baby with a bag of cats.

Jordy’s arse isn’t small. I was j-diddling pretty hard late in the 23 GF. With my wife and daughters next to me. We all were. Not sure about the kid copping a bag of cats noise.

 

[No SPIN]

He just isn't though, at least at any consistent level. In 2023 he was close to Rankine and Heeney (has never been close to Danger though), but he hasn't been close to that for a while and never over multiple seasons consecutively

That’s why I said if he can stay healthy- but it doesn’t change the premise of my post - that he has the ability to impact fwd, and mid, unlike Rowell.

 

[No SPIN]

The way you talk about Rowell makes me think you’ve never really watched him, because while he is indeed a very good clearance player, he is not just a mid bull. He’s one of the best balanced inside/outside players in the comp and he would compliment both Nick and Ned beautifully.

When Ned stands him and blunts his effectiveness?? I’m sorry but what is this nonsense? This has never happened, and is no fait accompli given that GC are also playing the likes of Anderson and Miller in the middle too, who are both incredibly damaging in their own right.

Don’t argue based on events that have not yet happened please.

I think you’re also arguing about things that haven’t happened - ie. Ned will fail.
Ned will definitely blunt Rowell as he has many other mids - his improvement has been dramatic. And only an irrational view dismisses this improvement as irrelevant.

But the central premise remains - Rowell doesn’t have the ability to impact mid and fwd like a healthy Jordy.

 

[gouki88]

That’s why I said if he can stay healthy- but it doesn’t change the premise of my post - that he has the ability to impact fwd, and mid, unlike Rowell.

It’s been a while since he’s impacted at either position. Hopefully that changes over the next 2 months

 

[NMBB]

The same Hirdy who was shocked to be sitting there.

ie - how the hell was I caught?

 

[Apex36]

I think you’re also arguing about things that haven’t happened - ie. Ned will fail.
Ned will definitely blunt Rowell as he has many other mids - his improvement has been dramatic. And only an irrational view dismisses this improvement as irrelevant.

At no point did I say that Ned will fail, or even imply it. And you’ve completely ignored the possibility that Ned doesn’t even play on Rowell. So, “definitely”? No. A possibility? Absolutely. But please don’t act like it’s something that’s guaranteed to happen, because it’s absolutely not. Rowell has gone up against plenty of high quality players this year successfully, don’t act like Long is superior to them all.

But the central premise remains - Rowell doesn’t have the ability to impact mid and fwd like Jordy.

And? Some of the best mids in the game don’t have the impact of Jordy as a forward, it doesn’t make them any less effective as players. Jordy doesn’t have the defensive impact that Rowell does. Does that mean he’s a lesser player? No it just means he’s different. There’s nothing about your argument that makes either player more or less effective than each other, all you’re describing is the type of player they are. If Rowell was consistently getting tagged out of games then you might have a point, but he’s not, and he’s unlikely to while playing alongside Nick either, so this all seems to be a rather moot discussion.

 

[jmac70]

I swear jmac70 i was unaware of this hilarious definition

It’s not that funny.

 

[JLC]

He just isn't though, at least at any consistent level. In 2023 he was close to Rankine and Heeney (has never been close to Danger though), but he hasn't been close to that for a while and never over multiple seasons consecutively

Credit to Jordy - unlike Heeney he has performed in grand finals.

Jordy has his faults but he has always turned up when it counts most.

 

[No SPIN]

At no point did I say that Ned will fail, or even imply it. And you’ve completely ignored the possibility that Ned doesn’t even play on Rowell. So, “definitely”? No. A possibility? Absolutely. But please don’t act like it’s something that’s guaranteed to happen, because it’s absolutely not. Rowell has gone up against plenty of high quality players this year successfully, don’t act like Long is superior to them all.

And? Some of the best mids in the game don’t have the impact of Jordy as a forward, it doesn’t make them any less effective as players. Jordy doesn’t have the defensive impact that Rowell does. Does that mean he’s a lesser player? No it just means he’s different. There’s nothing about your argument that makes either player more or less effective than each other, all you’re describing is the type of player they are. If Rowell was consistently getting tagged out of games then you might have a point, but he’s not, and he’s unlikely to while playing alongside Nick either, so this all seems to be a rather moot discussion.

Ok so you accept that Ned could blunt Rowell.
So now you need to consider my other point that Jordy offers Heeny, Rankin, Danger, like flexibility to impact both as a mid and fwd - which Rowell can not do.
If Heeney, Or Rankine were available at the same cost as Rowell, clearly they’d be preferred, because of this flexibility.

 

[gouki88]

Ok so you accept that Ned could blunt Rowell.
So now you need to consider my other point that Jordy offers Heeny, Rankin, Danger, like flexibility to impact both as a mid and fwd - which Rowell can not do.
If Heeney, Or Rankine were available at the same cost as Rowell, clearly they’d be preferred, because of this flexibility.

These are some large logical leaps

 

[No SPIN]

These are some large logical leaps

Like what?

 

[gouki88]

Like what?

Like your rigid commitment to the idea that De Goey offers the flexibility of these top talents, despite having not done so for 18 months and being currently sidelined with an ongoing and somewhat mysterious injury. I would be surprised if GMs would prefer any of those players over Rowell - it doesn't seem as if coaches do going by coaches votes (of which De Goey has 0 for the year, and was by far the worst of that bunch in that regard last year too).

You've floated this idea of Ned "blunting" Rowell - what examples of Ned blunting other contested clearance winners give you this belief?

 

[No SPIN]

Like your rigid commitment to the idea that De Goey offers the flexibility of these top talents, despite having not done so for 18 months and being currently sidelined with an ongoing and somewhat mysterious injury. I would be surprised if GMs would prefer any of those players over Rowell - it doesn't seem as if coaches do going by coaches votes (of which De Goey has 0 for the year, and was by far the worst of that bunch in that regard last year too).

You've floated this idea of Ned "blunting" Rowell - what examples of Ned blunting other contested clearance winners give you this belief?

I’ve responded to you previously that my comments relate to a “healthy” Jordy.
A more pertinent question re Ned, is to which mids has he lowered his colours to apart from Danger - which is an impossible task.
Why has he been so lauded by the media, as a massive improver, unless his performance against the best were impressive?

 

[gouki88]

I’ve responded to you previously that my comments relate to a “healthy” Jordy.
A more pertinent question re Ned, is to which mids has he lowered his colours to apart from Danger - which is an impossible task.
Why has he been so lauded by the media, as a massive improver, unless his performance against the best were impressive?

His improvement doesn't necessarily have anything to do with nullifying opposition midfielders. Our midfield has been challenged, particularly at centre bounce, quite a bit recently. Rowell is one of the top handful of centre bounce players in the entire competition.

 

[Apex36]

Ok so you accept that Ned could blunt Rowell.

Could, not will. Not that it’s in any way relevant.

So now you need to consider my other point that Jordy offers Heeny, Rankin, Danger, like flexibility to impact both as a mid and fwd - which Rowell can not do.

Will you consider that Jordy has never in his entire career been as consistent as any of the aforementioned players? Jordy might have a game at that level every so often but he’s just has likely to have a 15 disposal 1 goal game, without the defensive impact of any of those other players. He’s not in the same conversation as those guys.

If Heeney, Or Rankine were available at the same cost as Rowell, clearly they’d be preferred, because of this flexibility.

Pointless hypothetical, because Jordy is not in the same conversation given his lack of consistency over the course of his career.

 

[Bianconeri]

Then really the whole conversation is irrelevant

This whole footy forum is irrelevant then