AFL Player 5: Elijah Tsatas

[Nuggs Bunny]

 

[chungi]

Had 2 more marks than Durham, was one of only 4 goal scorers, 5th overall for metres gained all with 20-30% less game time. A serviceable performance all-round in a game that did him no favours in terms of support and how bad everyone was all while coming off no proper run of senior games no less.

He's deserved a chance for that run ahead of a few for a while now and would have done him good for ongoing improvement. We certainly stifled his potential so far with how ineptly we've handled it and that's an indictment on the club.

Respectfully disagree. We have a #5 pick averaging near 30 a game in the VFL who isn't a regular, so you've got to ask why. I'm sure the coaches would love him to be, but he's weaknesses are just that poor he is a liability. He's not the type of player who's game would improve at the top level like some players, with better ball movement and delivery. I'd say the AFL exposes he's weaknesses even more so. If he can't kick, run or apply pressure in the VFL, he's not magically going to do it in the 1s, which we've seen.

And yeah, he had one game where he took more marks than Durham (he was 4th lowest for us on the night including Martin). But he played 30% less game time because he was absolutely gassed. We've beamoned players on here for years that don't run defensively or can't hit a target... he hasnt deserved squat or taken the opportunities he's been given, because if he did he'd be in our starting midfield.

 

[SpeckieMcVeigh]

Re: 4. Jobe Watson

After reading what Sheedy has said about him during the week i watched a few of his games again recently and i have to say im worried about Jobe. I hadnt really realised how bad he is at running both ways until i had another look. He really struggles to keep up with opponents and is often left trailing them by 10 to 15 meters when they have the ball. They get a lot of easy possessions when they play on him.
After watching todays game against Casey i have to say it didnt improve at VFL level. On big grounds he simply struggles to get anywhere near an opponent and his defencive game is ordinary at best.
He is great at the clearances. His disposal has improved but it needs to get more damaging but he has to find something as far as pace and ability to run goes.

Not picking on you ant555 - quite the opposite. I'm using a quote of yours because I think this board knows you're one of the most respected posters here and have a great footy brain.

I'm lifting this quote of yours from the from the Jobe thread when he'd played ~50 games. Defensive deficiencies, struggling to keep up with opponents, great at clearances but not damaging. Sound familiar?

This is why I don't want to give up on Elijah prematurely. Not saying that his ceiling is Jobe Watson. But his strengths, weaknesses and even early career frame are remarkably similar. Imagine if we gave up on Jobe and he became Brownlow quality at scum like Hawthorn or Collingwood?

 

[yodellinhank]

Not picking on you ant555 - quite the opposite. I'm using a quote of yours because I think this board knows you're one of the most respected posters here and have a great footy brain.

Then why not quote me?

 

[eth-dog]

Then why not quote me?

Who's gonna tell him?

 

[ant555]

Not picking on you ant555 - quite the opposite. I'm using a quote of yours because I think this board knows you're one of the most respected posters here and have a great footy brain.

I'm lifting this quote of yours from the from the Jobe thread when he'd played ~50 games. Defensive deficiencies, struggling to keep up with opponents, great at clearances but not damaging. Sound familiar?

This is why I don't want to give up on Elijah prematurely. Not saying that his ceiling is Jobe Watson. But his strengths, weaknesses and even early career frame are remarkably similar. Imagine if we gave up on Jobe and he became Brownlow quality at scum like Hawthorn or Collingwood?

Jobe was never as bad as far as kicking. He could kick it 50 meters . His issue was more lazy ball drop early on. Also Jobe was never selective about attacking the contest.

Anyway even if Tsatas improves the fitness base we are locked into a guy that will never kick at anything more than average at best and we are a side that has kicking issues and trouble converting kicks inside 50 because of poor execution.


Jobe never ended up being great defensively but he just got better physically and once he sorted his ball drop his kicking was reliable.

Supporter line up to have a crack at Parish and McGrath and Shiel over disposal issues but with Tsatas there seems to be some sort of do not worry. He will be okay because he can win the footy.

 

[Vindicater]

Supporter line up to have a crack at Parish and McGrath and Shiel over disposal issues but with Tsatas there seems to be some sort of do not worry. He will be okay because he can win the footy.

It is more that most supporters don't watch VFL or training so they keep seeing McGrath, Shiel and Parish get games despite being a shit kick so they wander why Tsatas is not getting a game.

 

[faible]

Jobe was never as bad as far as kicking. He could kick it 50 meters . His issue was more lazy ball drop early on. Also Jobe was never selective about attacking the contest.

Anyway even if Tsatas improves the fitness base we are locked into a guy that will never kick at anything more than average at best and we are a side that has kicking issues and trouble converting kicks inside 50 because of poor execution.


Jobe never ended up being great defensively but he just got better physically and once he sorted his ball drop his kicking was reliable.

Supporter line up to have a crack at Parish and McGrath and Shiel over disposal issues but with Tsatas there seems to be some sort of do not worry. He will be okay because he can win the footy.

Jobe could also handpass further, faster and more accurately than a lot of players can kick.

 

[FootyGuru]

Jobe was never as bad as far as kicking. He could kick it 50 meters . His issue was more lazy ball drop early on. Also Jobe was never selective about attacking the contest.

Anyway even if Tsatas improves the fitness base we are locked into a guy that will never kick at anything more than average at best and we are a side that has kicking issues and trouble converting kicks inside 50 because of poor execution.


Jobe never ended up being great defensively but he just got better physically and once he sorted his ball drop his kicking was reliable.

Supporter line up to have a crack at Parish and McGrath and Shiel over disposal issues but with Tsatas there seems to be some sort of do not worry. He will be okay because he can win the footy.

Shiel parish and Shiel never had the size to be a pure inside midfielder. Tsatas could get there. As a pure inside mid his kicking won’t matter a whole lot. Jobes kicking got better because he chose better targets. Parish the same. Tsatas kicking looks the worse on the run but it’s improving. He can hit short kicks at an adequate level.

It’s not great that our other mids aren’t great kicks either but they play in roles that’s it’s more required. Will tsatas be our inside midfielder, I’m not sure.

I’d give him another year to find out though. I’d rather see tsatas fill out for another year and see where he’s at

 

[ant555]

Shiel parish and Shiel never had the size to be a pure inside midfielder. Tsatas could get there. As a pure inside mid his kicking won’t matter a whole lot. Jobes kicking got better because he chose better targets. Parish the same. Tsatas kicking looks the worse on the run but it’s improving. He can hit short kicks at an adequate level.

It’s not great that our other mids aren’t great kicks either but they play in roles that’s it’s more required. Will tsatas be our inside midfielder, I’m not sure.

I’d give him another year to find out though. I’d rather see tsatas fill out for another year and see where he’s at

Well I just do not get excited by the bloke who is supposed to make the midfield better but still only ticks one box. Is he going to move Durham or Caldwell out of the middle ? He certainly is not going to do Setterfields role, he has no defensive side at all. Most of all he simply selective about what he does. As for his kicking improving, yeah. Has gone from 30% to 40% and yes he hits some targets, off one step.
I am tired of the old Essendon "it okay his kicking will not matter". Just can not get excited about a bloke who gathers a lot of possessions but can not consistently make the most of them. If our standard is we are okay with it then we will spend another 15 years without winning a final.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Well I just do not get excited by the bloke who is supposed to make the midfield better but still only ticks one box. Is he going to move Durham or Caldwell out of the middle ? He certainly is not going to do Setterfields role, he has no defensive side at all. Most of all he simply selective about what he does. As for his kicking improving, yeah. Has gone from 30% to 40% and yes he hits some targets, off one step.
I am tired of the old Essendon "it okay his kicking will not matter". Just can not get excited about a bloke who gathers a lot of possessions but can not consistently make the most of them. If our standard is we are okay with it then we will spend another 15 years without winning a final.

Yeah. He can be a player but it’s gonna take 3 more years to become okay. The best midfields in the comp are lethal and creative, for whatever reason Essendon supporters think we can get it done with okay players.

 

[FootyGuru]

Well I just do not get excited by the bloke who is supposed to make the midfield better but still only ticks one box. Is he going to move Durham or Caldwell out of the middle ? He certainly is not going to do Setterfields role, he has no defensive side at all. Most of all he simply selective about what he does. As for his kicking improving, yeah. Has gone from 30% to 40% and yes he hits some targets, off one step.
I am tired of the old Essendon "it okay his kicking will not matter". Just can not get excited about a bloke who gathers a lot of possessions but can not consistently make the most of them. If our standard is we are okay with it then we will spend another 15 years without winning a final.

Setterfeilds gotta go. Injury prone, 27 year old role player. Setters has a much better defensive side but not near the clearance player that tsatas already is.
Much easier to teach someone to tackle and run defensively than it is to have clearance nous.

Essendon actually needs a bigger clearance midfielder. Tsatas could fill that role and play alongside Durham and Caldwell.

There’s a lot of development left in tsatas body. Far too early to give up on him.

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

I’d rather keep Setterfield. Thought he was very good this season. Think his latest injury from being stepped on so unlucky. Love to see Tsatas turn it around but doubt it

 

[joey_jo_jo]

I’d rather keep Setterfield. Thought he was very good this season. Think his latest injury from being stepped on so unlucky. Love to see Tsatas turn it around but doubt it

Yeah the option is try get setterfield fit or find someone who can play his role and is durable. I wouldn't want to take him out of the midfield rotation just to replace him with tsatas/parish.

 

[ghostdog]

Yeah the option is try get setterfield fit or find someone who can play his role and is durable. I wouldn't want to take him out of the midfield rotation just to replace him with tsatas/parish.

This is why I'm keen on Sharp or Greeves in the long run. Tsatas is over.

 

[ant555]

Setterfeilds gotta go. Injury prone, 27 year old role player. Setters has a much better defensive side but not near the clearance player that tsatas already is.
Much easier to teach someone to tackle and run defensively than it is to have clearance nous.

Essendon actually needs a bigger clearance midfielder. Tsatas could fill that role and play alongside Durham and Caldwell.

There’s a lot of development left in tsatas body. Far too early to give up on him.

Of course Setterfield is not as good at clearance which is why I said Setterfields "role". We need to upgrade him as well. Yes we do need a bigger clearance player. Just do not need one with so many flaws. As far as Tsatas and his body development. It is not his body which is the issue. The physical contest is not in his nature and this is based on seeing a lot of him since he was 17. He was actually drafted as a guy who could break the lines on the outside as well.
Yes he could be a decent inside midfielder who wins the footy 30 times but he is just that. One dimensional.

 

[ant555]

This is why I'm keen on Sharp or Greeves in the long run. Tsatas is over.

Sharp has a bit of outside game as well and is a good leader. He would fit the bill if that is what we wanted.

 

[DERO]

Who's gonna tell him?

Not bad by you Eth dog

 

[BomberManU]

Of course Setterfield is not as good at clearance which is why I said Setterfields "role". We need to upgrade him as well. Yes we do need a bigger clearance player. Just do not need one with so many flaws. As far as Tsatas and his body development. It is not his body which is the issue. The physical contest is not in his nature and this is based on seeing a lot of him since he was 17. He was actually drafted as a guy who could break the lines on the outside as well.
Yes he could be a decent inside midfielder who wins the footy 30 times but he is just that. One dimensional.

How on earth did they get this selection so wrong? Was he 'breaking the lines' in underage footy? If we hadn't taken him, would he have still gone so high in the draft, or were other clubs onto his flaws? So many questions.

 

[Runk]

Respectfully disagree. We have a #5 pick averaging near 30 a game in the VFL who isn't a regular, so you've got to ask why. I'm sure the coaches would love him to be, but he's weaknesses are just that poor he is a liability. He's not the type of player who's game would improve at the top level like some players, with better ball movement and delivery. I'd say the AFL exposes he's weaknesses even more so. If he can't kick, run or apply pressure in the VFL, he's not magically going to do it in the 1s, which we've seen.

And yeah, he had one game where he took more marks than Durham (he was 4th lowest for us on the night including Martin). But he played 30% less game time because he was absolutely gassed. We've beamoned players on here for years that don't run defensively or can't hit a target... he hasnt deserved squat or taken the opportunities he's been given, because if he did he'd be in our starting midfield.

Nailed it.

 

[Runk]

So to sum up:

Elijah Tsatas is a talented young midfielder who can find the ball but is currently struggling to convert that into AFL standard impact due to:

1. below average kicking,
2. lack of defensive work rate,
3. and limited endurance.

Whilst there’s potential, especially in clearance work, serious doubts remain about his physicality, versatility, and whether his style suits the modern game or Essendon’s current midfield need.

Fair?

 

[BomberManU]

So to sum up:

Elijah Tsatas is a talented young midfielder who can find the ball but is currently struggling to convert that into AFL standard impact due to:

1. below average kicking,
2. lack of defensive work rate,
3. and limited endurance.

Whilst there’s potential, especially in clearance work, serious doubts remain about his physicality, versatility, and whether his style suits the modern game or Essendon’s current midfield need.

Fair?

I guess all can be fixed, to some degree...but he'll be 22 going into next season.

 

[dondolla]

How on earth did they get this selection so wrong? Was he 'breaking the lines' in underage footy? If we hadn't taken him, would he have still gone so high in the draft, or were other clubs onto his flaws? So many questions.

If I remember correctly, I think if Essendon passed on him he was expected to slide to St Kilda at 10. In my head every other pick in the top 10 was set except for Essendon possible picking Phillipou at 5, in which case Tsatas would’ve gone to St Kilda. Hawthorn were set on Mackenzie because he was in their academy/NGA?

It feels a bit like 2020 because it’s a pretty average draft and Essendon had their best hand. It’s also disappointing because how many of the other top 10 would be doing well at Essendon? I think Sheezel wouldn’t have moved to half back like he has, so he’d probably be struggling as a half forward. Humphrey would be good but he was too tough and from the country so Dodoro wouldn’t go near him. Wardlaw’s hamstrings were cooked when he was 17, so he’d be on out injury list at the moment. Cadman would be great to have but other than that Weddle went at 18, which was a speculative pick so Dodoro wouldn’t have gone for that either. I’m ignoring Fletcher and Ashcroft because they’d be great to have but weren’t available.

 

[ant555]

How on earth did they get this selection so wrong? Was he 'breaking the lines' in underage footy? If we hadn't taken him, would he have still gone so high in the draft, or were other clubs onto his flaws? So many questions.

He did break the lines and had some outside run. That is why I thought he could become a Treloar type even though I didn’t really think he was the guy for us.
The issue around how he was rated probably comes down to the sample size in his top age year being limited due to injury.
The conversation I have had with a couple of recruiters has been if he plays a full season some of the flaws would have been more apparent.
I do not rate him yet I still got him wrong as I was thinking he could be a bit of an outside jet.

 

[dank420_]

So to sum up:

Elijah Tsatas is a talented young midfielder who can find the ball but is currently struggling to convert that into AFL standard impact due to:

1. below average kicking,
2. lack of defensive work rate,
3. and limited endurance.

Whilst there’s potential, especially in clearance work, serious doubts remain about his physicality, versatility, and whether his style suits the modern game or Essendon’s current midfield need.

Fair?

Thanks ChatGPT

 

[Runk]

Thanks ChatGPT

I won't lie I did use it to sum up the page