News AFL overhauls Academy and FS bid matching, discussing draft lockout

[JTTheKing]

lol. I don't actually like Gold Coast, but it's f*cking fodder when people whinge about them, while ignoring that their own clubs have shafted them.

We were in the same place to less than a decade ago, and it took the AFL parachuting in our CEO, Head of Football and Coach to sort us out. It's amazing how quickly things can turn around when the right people are in charge at the top.

A lot of that is on the AFL, not setting them up properly to start with. No club base, just demountable work site offices and port -a-loos, no gym, etc.

It was literally here's your license, good luck. When kids coming from the Vic private schools had better resources, you know the AFL half @rsed it.

The AFL actually stepping in and making the hard decisions to straighten the whole competition out.

I don't actually believe in academies or father sons, but the whole competition if full of inequalities that disadvantage almost every club, while benefitting the big 6 Victorian clubs, so in such a competition, I'll take every advantage my club can get. The only regret I currently have, is that my club doesn't prioritise it's academy to the same level that Gold Coast and Sydney do.

Considering some of the other garbage trades they have made over the past 5-10 years the fact they wouldn’t accept what we were offering was laughable. Jack Martin was hardly a star leaving that club.

I agree Gold Coast were set up poorly overall. That was my point. Even in Brisbane’s case which I’m sure you’re well aware they were in a difficult position in a number of areas when all those departures eventuated.

The AFL’s grown so much in the last decade alone to the point I just don’t think ‘interstate’ clubs or any struggling club in general is going to be in such poor shape in all facets that a bunch of Victorians for example would go home soon after if you drafted them.

The historical context of mass exoduses makes list managers nervous when some draftee doesn’t want to move. But as I mentioned I think clubs are being sucked in by slimy player managers.

Just take Bailey Smith for example who was telling every non Victorian club not to draft him because he wouldn’t cope with leaving his family in Melbournes Now 7 years later he isn’t even in Melbourne and has moved down the coast and screwed over his club in the process. Sure it’s not that far from Melbourne but the point is players these days will continually try shit on because they know they can get away with it.

Plus these are 17-18 year old kids who have never left their 10-15km radius so they think that’s where their life has to continue to revolve around. A team like West Coast picks one of them and maybe they actually discover Perth is great.

It’s idealistic yes but I’m just saying if you can build a good culture and team with young players I think you’ll be able to retain most of them.

 

[Elixuh]

Elliot yeo was all Brisbane. He confirmed on a podcast it was an arguement over $50k and had Brisbane given it to him, he would have stayed.

Brisbane didn’t rate him enough. To be fair we didn’t think he would be that good either.

50k in the cap 15 years ago is a lot more significant than 50k under today’s cap. What you’re describing is us having to overpay to retain interstate talent.

Thank you for demonstrating why the academies are important.

I think it’s a bit of revisionist history from Elliot as well, who by all reports wasn’t happy in Brisbane. But sure if we overpaid him he may have stayed. Not a very sustainable way to build a list thought.

 

[Elixuh]

Sure, but you can see how it's not exactly appreciated when you bucket those big Victorian teams with North, St Kilda and Dogs who by many measures have the worst of it of anyone in the league, Victorian or otherwise, and fail to exclude them when you attack "the Victorians"

‘Worst of it of anyone in the league’ get outta here. You still have all of the structural advantages of the vfl which interstate clubs will never be able to attain and which contributes to this league being as lopsided as it is.

 

[mpal6]

Yeah, the overall list management landscape really benefits teams like St Kilda. Who just had to pay the best contract in history to a player who probably isn't in the top 20 best players in the league, in order to retain them, after they drafted them.

Just listen to yourself, seriously.

St.Kilda dug a hole for themselves offering 1.7M repeatedly for Finn Callaghan, LDU and many more. Natives got restless at that point, which is bound to happen. They are still not out of the woods yet in terms of re-signing existing players. Let's see how it pans out for them.

Also, why does St.kilda need to overpay? They could've left Nasiah to go "home" and pillage the other club via trade. They chose to and its still on them - like it seems to be on us needing to overpay to retain talent back in the day. Spare me for not crying for the plight of salary cap mismanagement from Saints. This shoe was in our foot like 10 years ago and the standard line trotted out against us was to "fix our kulcha"

 

[ghostbat12]

50k in the cap 15 years ago is a lot more significant than 50k under today’s cap. What you’re describing is us having to overpay to retain interstate talent.

Thank you for demonstrating why the academies are important.

I think it’s a bit of revisionist history from Elliot as well, who by all reports wasn’t happy in Brisbane. But sure if we overpaid him he may have stayed. Not a very sustainable way to build a list thought.

Brisbane were close to their cap limit, were they? Please.

Explaining that he was unhappy etc is revisionism

 

[MPMonkeys]

Considering some of the other garbage trades they have made over the past 5-10 years the fact they wouldn’t accept what we were offering was laughable. Jack Martin was hardly a star leaving that club.

I agree Gold Coast were set up poorly overall. That was my point. Even in Brisbane’s case which I’m sure you’re well aware they were in a difficult position in a number of areas when all those departures eventuated.

The AFL’s grown so much in the last decade alone to the point I just don’t think ‘interstate’ clubs or any struggling club in general is going to be in such poor shape in all facets that a bunch of Victorians for example would go home soon after if you drafted them.

The historical context of mass exoduses makes list managers nervous when some draftee doesn’t want to move. But as I mentioned I think clubs are being sucked in by slimy player managers.

Just take Bailey Smith for example who was telling every non Victorian club not to draft him because he wouldn’t cope with leaving his family in Melbournes Now 7 years later he isn’t even in Melbourne and has moved down the coast and screwed over his club in the process. Sure it’s not that far from Melbourne but the point is players these days will continually try shit on because they know they can get away with it.

Plus these are 17-18 year old kids who have never left their 10-15km radius so they think that’s where their life has to continue to revolve around. A team like West Coast picks one of them and maybe they actually discover Perth is great.

It’s idealistic yes but I’m just saying if you can build a good culture and team with young players I think you’ll be able to retain most of them.

Exactly.
All over the world kids move across the country and even overseas to follow their sporting dream. The world is not the same as it was 30 or 40 years ago. Going interstate holds no fears for 99% of the draftees. In the NBA. MLB and NFL players are sometimes traded to three clubs within a year - and these are players with families so any move is obviously more onerous for them than a young single bloke.

 

[mpal6]

Considering some of the other garbage trades they have made over the past 5-10 years the fact they wouldn’t accept what we were offering was laughable. Jack Martin was hardly a star leaving that club.

I agree Gold Coast were set up poorly overall. That was my point. Even in Brisbane’s case which I’m sure you’re well aware they were in a difficult position in a number of areas when all those departures eventuated.

The AFL’s grown so much in the last decade alone to the point I just don’t think ‘interstate’ clubs or any struggling club in general is going to be in such poor shape in all facets that a bunch of Victorians for example would go home soon after if you drafted them.

The historical context of mass exoduses makes list managers nervous when some draftee doesn’t want to move. But as I mentioned I think clubs are being sucked in by slimy player managers.

Just take Bailey Smith for example who was telling every non Victorian club not to draft him because he wouldn’t cope with leaving his family in Melbournes Now 7 years later he isn’t even in Melbourne and has moved down the coast and screwed over his club in the process. Sure it’s not that far from Melbourne but the point is players these days will continually try shit on because they know they can get away with it.

Plus these are 17-18 year old kids who have never left their 10-15km radius so they think that’s where their life has to continue to revolve around. A team like West Coast picks one of them and maybe they actually discover Perth is great.

It’s idealistic yes but I’m just saying if you can build a good culture and team with young players I think you’ll be able to retain most of them.

This is all fair points but when a Sheezel or a Wardlaw subtly tells you not to pick him and you're one of the clubs whose holding that pick 3/4/5 it'll be downright irresponsible to still gamble that pick and pray it all works out in the end. This is an ongoing issue here where Vic clubs celebrate the kid who is "brave" to express himself and when interstate clubs find another avenue to get players like academy or NGA or whatever- it gets frowned upon.

as an interstate club you're allowed to have some moderate success in building your list with local talent but not too much success. That's not good for the game.

 

[Elixuh]

Brisbane were close to their cap limit, were they? Please.

Explaining that he was unhappy etc is revisionism

So we should overpay to retain interstate talent which at that time was around 95% of our list. Seems like a bold strategy cotton let’s see how it plays out.

 

[Lore]

Something you’ll only ever read from a VIC club who has 10x as many players to choose from as non-VIC

Actually I did the numbers on it a couple of years ago… there’s a post somewhere but without looking it up directly, about 50% of the players in the league come from Vic. ~16% from WA, ~11% from SA and the rest are from NT, Tasmania, USA, Ireland combined.

Compared to 50% of clubs being from Vic, 11% from WA, 11% from SA, 11% from NSW, 11% from Qld.

So in comparison to the spread of teams, the clubs with the most “local” draft prospects to choose from are actually in WA (air quotes because I recognise that WA is a big place and local is relative). This is why I think a 20th team should be based out your way.

 

[Lore]

Tell us how you really feel…

I’m well aware of past exits of players.

A team like Gold Coast for example was a complete joke in terms of how they were run so it’s hardly shocking they continually lost players. Young draftees were just treating their time up there as a few years of relaxation before getting sick of the club amounting to nothing and wanting to win somewhere else. They made it very easy for players to move on.

I’m not saying players will just magically stop leaving if you draft them but I think if clubs are serious about improving they’ll be successful in retaining some of these players.

Not sure what else the solution is. Managers won’t stop with the BS.

The interesting thing is the same was happening to Brisbane, and then they got Hodge and Fages and pulled off some kind of magic trick and now everyone wants to go there.

 

[Maybe Tomorrow]

Yep, the easiest solution seems to be to limit how many first rounders you can take in the one year if you have an academy or father son.

It stinks this year that the Suns will make the finals and have access to potentially two top ten picks (one maybe being the best player in the draft) when you’ve got teams like the Eagles and Roos who have just been terrible for seasons on end now.

The Suns might argue it stinks that they have been terrible for 15 years and when they finally scrap into the finals (assuming that happens) for the first time their one advantage gets taken away.......

It's simple. Keep the academies but pay fair market value.

The points have been changed to make it harder this year. The Suns have traded in 3 firsts this year and will probably only be able to match 2 bids in the first round.

Isn't this EXACTLY what people want?

But it's still not good enough apparently.

 

[Purple Suit]

Again much of your reasoning is incorrect, we added the likes of Charlie Cameron (2017) and Neale (2018), well before we lucked in to Ashcroft and Fletcher in 2022.

We traded for both Cameron and Neale.

The first round pick we used to trade in Cameron came from Port, which was part of a three team trade in 2016, when we traded out Pearce Hanley.

Neale cost us our 2 first round picks in 2018 and 2019.

There was no double dipping for academy talent in those drafts.

It’s been smart list management.

The system has had advantages in it for all teams.

Daniher was a free agent, every team had their chance to sell their club to him.

Yes, we got Dunkley the same year as Ashcroft and Fletcher, but we had pushed picks from 2021 in to 2022 to help achieve this, as well as trading our future first and second round picks from 2023 back in to 2022.

We lost Dan McStay in free agency and received a second round pick as compensation, and traded Tom Berry for a second round pick.

I’m not saying we lost out, but it “cost us” two first round picks, four second round picks, and a couple of players, as well as multiple 3rd and 4th round picks across 3 drafts to get Dunkley, Ashcroft and Fletcher.

Smart list management teams, like those from the Bulldogs and Melbourne, have used it to accrue multiple later picks to trade up for high picks from the Gold Coast.

You got Dunkley, Ashcroft & Fletcher for less than we paid for Jackson and less than we paid for Bolton. Dunkley on par with both of those player and was the difference that got you over the line.

3 for 1 deals that get you are flag are massive.

 

[bzparkes]

Must be nice to win 4 flags in 25 years and complain that you're hard done by

 

[Lore]

The points have been changed to make it harder this year. The Suns have traded in 3 firsts this year and will probably only be able to match 2 bids in the first round.

Isn't this EXACTLY what people want?

But it's still not good enough apparently.

I think it’s just down to ignorance. People don’t understand DVI at the best of times, let alone the updated version which is purely theoretical until mid November when you start getting new examples of how it will actually work going forward.

This new administration at AFL HQ seems to want to change things for the sake of changing them, instead of seeing how things go and finding the best way forward.

 

[Lore]

Must be nice to win 4 flags in 25 years and complain that you're hard done by

92, 94, 06, 18?

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Exactly.
All over the world kids move across the country and even overseas to follow their sporting dream. The world is not the same as it was 30 or 40 years ago. Going interstate holds no fears for 99% of the draftees. In the NBA. MLB and NFL players are sometimes traded to three clubs within a year - and these are players with families so any move is obviously more onerous for them than a young single bloke.

Considering some of the other garbage trades they have made over the past 5-10 years the fact they wouldn’t accept what we were offering was laughable. Jack Martin was hardly a star leaving that club.

I agree Gold Coast were set up poorly overall. That was my point. Even in Brisbane’s case which I’m sure you’re well aware they were in a difficult position in a number of areas when all those departures eventuated.

The AFL’s grown so much in the last decade alone to the point I just don’t think ‘interstate’ clubs or any struggling club in general is going to be in such poor shape in all facets that a bunch of Victorians for example would go home soon after if you drafted them.

The historical context of mass exoduses makes list managers nervous when some draftee doesn’t want to move. But as I mentioned I think clubs are being sucked in by slimy player managers.

Just take Bailey Smith for example who was telling every non Victorian club not to draft him because he wouldn’t cope with leaving his family in Melbournes Now 7 years later he isn’t even in Melbourne and has moved down the coast and screwed over his club in the process. Sure it’s not that far from Melbourne but the point is players these days will continually try shit on because they know they can get away with it.

Plus these are 17-18 year old kids who have never left their 10-15km radius so they think that’s where their life has to continue to revolve around. A team like West Coast picks one of them and maybe they actually discover Perth is great.

It’s idealistic yes but I’m just saying if you can build a good culture and team with young players I think you’ll be able to retain most of them.

Yes the US is different and a lot of that has to do with drinking age. Kids want to get out of home to have an actual life which isn’t so much the case here. 80% still go to college in their home state but they are twice as mature by the time they are drafted as ours are.
Other sports around the world have 100 times the talent pool so you take the best options you have. Australian kids have no problem with that but people seem to forget they are actually choosing where they want to go just like college players do. They aren’t getting told where they have to play until they are ~20 and have already left home or in soccer etc ever

 

[Danog]

So has there been any actual news over the past 2 days

 

[Lore]

So has there been any actual news over the past 2 days

You mean since they floated the possibility of a lockout for bid matching in the first 5/10/round picks?

Twomey on Gettable (transcript is voice recognition software from the Podcasts app):

“Well, I spoke to several clubs who are a part of the AFL's football managers meeting on Monday. And they all left with the view that the league very much has significant change on its mind with regards to the bidding system as part of that, of course, the father-son and academy system. So while clubs in some quarters are pushing for this, we know St Kilda, we know Geelong have raised this.

The majority are fearful that the AFL is going to be bringing in a draft lockout, whether it's the first five picks, first 10 picks or the first round, whether it's a protected zone, the bids can't be matched on those father-sons, academy and NGA players. And the feeling that the clubs took from Monday's meeting as well is that the league is keen to get the ball rolling on this pretty soon, potentially even as soon as next year. So I think there's gonna be some significant backlash to this, this potential draft lockout.

And clubs will rally against that. So let's look at a couple that will. I mean, we just spoke about Cody Walker in recent weeks and how good he's been[…]”

From Gettable: Father-son ‘lockout’ fear, Don to depart, big play for Saint, Harley call close?, 20 Aug 2025

This material may be protected by copyright.

 

[Lore]

Spoiler: Changes in effect for 2025

Changes announced at the end of 2024 to come into effect in 2025 are based around a new draft value index (how many points each pick is worth), a reduced discount for clubs matching bids (10%, down from 20%), and as of the 2024 Draft, bids on NGA players can be matched in the first round, rather than being locked out until pick 40.

Below are the two Draft Value Indexes (DVIs), the first was in use up until 2024, and the second is from this year (2025) onwards. I've added an extra column to indicate what pick you would need to match a bid if the bid was matched with only one pick. In 2024 you could match pick 1 with pick 2, but in 2025 you would need pick 1 to match a bid at 1... etc.

Spoiler: 2024 DVI

Round	Pick	Pick value	Bid match requirement	Equivalent pick
Round 1	1	3000	2400	2
Round 1	2	2517	2014	4
Round 1	3	2234	1787	5
Round 1	4	2034	1627	7
Round 1	5	1878	1502	8
Round 1	6	1751	1401	9
Round 1	7	1644	1315	11
Round 1	8	1551	1241	12
Round 1	9	1469	1175	13
Round 1	10	1395	1116	14
Round 1	11	1329	1063	16
Round 1	12	1268	1014	17
Round 1	13	1212	970	18
Round 1	14	1161	929	19
Round 1	15	1112	890	20
Round 1	16	1067	854	21
Round 1	17	1025	820	22
Round 1	18	985	788	23
Round 2	19	948	751	25
Round 2	20	912	715	26
Round 2	21	878	681	27
Round 2	22	845	648	28
Round 2	23	815	618	30
Round 2	24	785	588	31
Round 2	25	756	559	32
Round 2	26	729	532	34
Round 2	27	703	506	36
Round 2	28	677	480	37
Round 2	29	653	456	38
Round 2	30	629	432	39
Round 2	31	606	409	41
Round 2	32	584	387	42
Round 2	33	563	366	43
Round 2	34	542	345	45
Round 2	35	522	325	46
Round 2	36	502	305	47
Round 3	37	483	286	49
Round 3	38	465	268	50
Round 3	39	446	249	51
Round 3	40	429	232	53
Round 3	41	412	215	54
Round 3	42	395	198	55
Round 3	43	378	181	57
Round 3	44	362	165	58
Round 3	45	347	150	59
Round 3	46	331	134	61
Round 3	47	316	119	62
Round 3	48	302	105	63
Round 3	49	287	90	65
Round 3	50	273	76	66
Round 3	51	259	62	67
Round 3	52	246	49	69
Round 3	53	233	36	70
Round 3	54	220	23	71
Round 3	55	207	10	72
Round 3	56	194	nil	any
Round 4	57	182
Round 4	58	170
Round 4	59	158
Round 4	60	146
Round 4	61	135
Round 4	62	123
Round 4	63	112
Round 4	64	101
Round 4	65	90
Round 4	66	80
Round 4	67	69
Round 4	68	59
Round 4	69	49
Round 4	70	39
Round 4	71	29
Round 4	72	19
Round 4	73	9

Spoiler: 2025 and beyond DVI

Round	Pick	Pick value	Bid match requirement	Equivalent pick
Round 1	1	3000	2700	1
Round 1	2	2481	2233	2
Round 1	3	2178	1960	4
Round 1	4	1962	1766	5
Round 1	5	1795	1616	6
Round 1	6	1659	1493	7
Round 1	7	1543	1389	8
Round 1	8	1443	1299	9
Round 1	9	1355	1220	10
Round 1	10	1276	1148	11
Round 1	11	1205	1085	12
Round 1	12	1140	1026	13
Round 1	13	1080	972	15
Round 1	14	1024	922	16
Round 1	15	973	876	17
Round 1	16	924	832	18
Round 1	17	879	791	19
Round 1	18	836	752	20
Round 2	19	796	712	21
Round 2	20	757	673	22
Round 2	21	721	637	23
Round 2	22	686	602	24
Round 2	23	653	569	25
Round 2	24	621	537	26
Round 2	25	590	506	27
Round 2	26	561	477	28
Round 2	27	533	449	30
Round 2	28	505	421	31
Round 2	29	479	395	32
Round 2	30	454	370	33
Round 2	31	429	345	34
Round 2	32	405	321	35
Round 2	33	382	298	36
Round 2	34	360	276	38
Round 2	35	338	254	39
Round 2	36	317	233	40
Round 3	37	297	nil	any
Round 3	38	277
Round 3	39	257
Round 3	40	238
Round 3	41	220
Round 3	42	202
Round 3	43	184
Round 3	44	167
Round 3	45	150
Round 3	46	134
Round 3	47	118
Round 3	48	102
Round 3	49	86
Round 3	50	71
Round 3	51	57
Round 3	52	42
Round 3	53	28
Round 3	54	14
Round 3	55	0
Round 3	56	0

Clubs have already been limited to one pick in the national draft for each available spot on the senior list for the last few years. The minimum open list spots prior to the draft is 3, in order to take a minimum of 3 picks in the national draft (including rookie upgrades).

With the new DVI, picks in the second and third round are significantly devalued, and fourth round picks have no value at all. Grand Final teams' third round picks also have no value under the new DVI. This means that trading in enough points to match a high bid is far more difficult from 2025 onwards.

Notably, in 2025 you cannot match Pick 1 with your natural draft hand if you finish outside the bottom 5. The club that starts with picks 5, 23 and 41 will not have enough points to match Pick 1 without trading for more picks, while the premiers' natural draft hand is now insufficient to match a bid above 10th.

As of Monday 18th of August 2025, the AFL is also floating the possibility of a draft lockout affecting the first 5 or 10 picks, or potentially the whole first round.

Spoiler: Twomey on Gettable (transcript is voice recognition software from the Podcasts app)

“Well, I spoke to several clubs who are a part of the AFL's football managers meeting on Monday. And they all left with the view that the league very much has significant change on its mind with regards to the bidding system as part of that, of course, the father-son and academy system. So while clubs in some quarters are pushing for this, we know St Kilda, we know Geelong have raised this.

The majority are fearful that the AFL is going to be bringing in a draft lockout, whether it's the first five picks, first 10 picks or the first round, whether it's a protected zone, the bids can't be matched on those father-sons, academy and NGA players. And the feeling that the clubs took from Monday's meeting as well is that the league is keen to get the ball rolling on this pretty soon, potentially even as soon as next year. So I think there's gonna be some significant backlash to this, this potential draft lockout.

And clubs will rally against that. So let's look at a couple that will. I mean, we just spoke about Cody Walker in recent weeks and how good he's been[…]”

From Gettable: Father-son ‘lockout’ fear, Don to depart, big play for Saint, Harley call close?, 20 Aug 2025

This material may be protected by copyright.

22 September 2025 update, an AI summary:
The AFL will not prevent clubs from matching bids on father-son and Academy talent in 2026, but will tighten bidding rules. A grading system will be implemented, requiring teams to be in specific zones based on their ladder position to match bids. This change aims to balance access for clubs while preserving the draft pool.

No father-son draft lockout, but AFL set to tighten bidding rules

Clubs will still be able to match bids on father-son and Academy talent in 2026 and beyond but the League is make them pay up for the privilege

www.afl.com.au

 

[astrowizzle]

Every vic team has advantages that non-vic's aren't afforded. Full stop.

No most of them do not have a true home ground advantage. They share a field with other teams and and as time progresses that becomes less of a home ground advantage because the interstate teams play there multiple times per year against different teams. One vic club has this advantage and had been part of the reason they have been near the top of the ladder for 20 years.

 

[Obeanie1]

Because teams are being encouraged to let mature age players leave because they are getting a pick in return which values them much higher than they are

Buddy Franklin didn't.

Dangerfield didn't.

Swings both ways and the teams at the bottom get an uplift to cover losing a quality player.

Teams at the top get unders or force a trade without generating compo picks.

And the AFL use it to balance other ledgers.

Swings and roundabouts.

 

[Elixuh]

You got Dunkley, Ashcroft & Fletcher for less than we paid for Jackson and less than we paid for Bolton. Dunkley on par with both of those player and was the difference that got you over the line.

3 for 1 deals that get you are flag are massive.

Just because Freo has overpaid for players doesn’t mean it’s the systems fault.

Bolton has been an abject failure given what you have up for him and he was one the tigers didn’t want to keep.

 

[Obeanie1]

My favourite self inflictions; a generational injury list and multiple medical retirements.

Yep, Sheppard, McGovern, Vennables and Edwards concussion retirements.

Naitanui knee.
Sheed knee
Yeo banged up
Allen banged up

Warriors in Kennedy, Hurn and Shuey retire all over 33, Shuey struggled late.

Barrass traded for a 1st, 2nd and a 3rd round pick after being poached.

All self inflicted?

 

[mpal6]

You got Dunkley, Ashcroft & Fletcher for less than we paid for Jackson and less than we paid for Bolton. Dunkley on par with both of those player and was the difference that got you over the line.

3 for 1 deals that get you are flag are massive.

You are going through the overpaying cycle. We did too, when Aish (pick 7) left for Collingwood and we got Bastinac + token picks, when Yeo left for West Coast and we got a second rounder, when Longer (pick 9) left for St.Kilda and we got pick 25, when Sam Docherty (pick 12) left for Carlton for pick 33 etc. No one was mourning our losses - more like picking off our carcass for their own benefit.

Sorry that I'm not raging about all these other clubs now having to overpay for their trade targets. We will have our down cycle too if we lose our current management and get some other newbies running the joint. Until then, we'll make hay while the sun shines.

 

[mpal6]

92, 94, 06, 18?

That's 26 years !!
the complaint was about 25 !!