Bickley does things Craig could never do

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

LOL - all those who said Craig was nuts to play him forward (he's a natural defender remember?) can start apologising

Subtle difference though.

Neil would play him forward, then drop him.

Bicks is playing him forward and picking him every week.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

I wish Bickley could get the players to shut up about playing better footy out of guilt for getting Craig sacked. He brought it on himself. Every week its been a different player (Sloane, Petrenko the last 2 weeks). Why can't they just admit they are happier playing attacking footy without Craig's outdated game plan and expectations!

On that note though, if they want to feel guilty enough to win the premiership next year then guilt away I say!!!

I agree the players have embraced a more free spirited game plan however the truth of the matter is the players are feeling guilty about Craigy falling on his sword and this has been a factor Over the past month

 

[SydCrow]

Subtle difference though.

Neil would play him forward, then drop him.

Bicks is playing him forward and picking him every week.

yes, that's three in a row

the pressure is off the boys for the time being which must help

next year's a different story

ps he also played in Craig's last nine games in charge

 

[BunjiMac]

Subtle difference though.

Neil would play him forward, then drop him.

Bicks is playing him forward and picking him every week.

I think Craig played him forward because he liked pets defensive qualities and wanted him to help hold the ball in the 50, where as Bicks likes his attacking abilities and has asked him to attack and kick goals. Subtle difference in approach massive difference in outcome.

 

[Sloaney]

I agree the players have embraced a more free spirited game plan however the truth of the matter is the players are feeling guilty about Craigy falling on his sword and this has been a factor Over the past month

Im sorry Sloane Ranger but I dont buy into that. The amount of pressure that Craig was under in the final weeks of his tenure was crazy. If the players didnt feel guilty about playing the way they did then, why would they now?

Sure they may feel guilt over the fact that Craig was a top bloke and deserved better from them. But dont think that has anything to do with the way we are playing in the last 4 weeks.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

Im sorry Sloane Ranger but I dont buy into that. The amount of pressure that Craig was under in the final weeks of his tenure was crazy. If the players didnt feel guilty about playing the way they did then, why would they now?

Sure they may feel guilt over the fact that Craig was a top bloke and deserved better from them. But dont think that has anything to do with the way we are playing in the last 4 weeks.

We have to agree to disagree

I do believe that I has been a factor, how big well I'm not sure

 

[jenny61_99]

We have to agree to disagree

I do believe that I has been a factor, how big well I'm not sure

On chatting to some of the boys after the game I asked how they were enjoying bickley as coach. All of them responded - at separate times I might add- that they love playing for bicks and then in the next breath and without prompting said "but I loved playing for craigy too, I don't want that to sound bad" or variations thereof.

 

[cmndstab]

On board with that.

So that's another thing Bicks does that Craig never could. Get Pets to be effectively consistent forward.

This actually seems to happen quite often. A player is put in a position and really fails to make it their own. Finally, they are moved somewhere else where they seem comfortable for a while - and then, upon moving back to their first position, they suddenly are twice the player there they used to be.

I guess it's all part of the process of maturing into a player. Would Petrenko be looking good up forward now if we'd started him down back? I wonder.

 

[Wood_Duck]

On chatting to some of the boys after the game I asked how they were enjoying bickley as coach. All of them responded - at separate times I might add- that they love playing for bicks and then in the next breath and without prompting said "but I loved playing for craigy too, I don't want that to sound bad" or variations thereof.

What exactly were you expecting them to say?

 

[jenny61_99]

What exactly were you expecting them to say?

Didn't expect the added by-line I guess - but they were all very keen for it to be known that they loved the guy. But as Bigfella pointed out - loving him and playing for him were clearly miles apart!

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Didn't expect the added by-line I guess - but they were all very keen for it to be known that they loved the guy. But as Bigfella pointed out - loving him and playing for him were clearly miles apart!

With all due respect Jenny, they would only know you in a particular capacity. A person who helps out around the club whist they were in Queensland, it's not like you are a personal confident who they explicitly trust.

Therefore they'd especially take the party line with someone who could report back to the club any negativity. They would watch what they say and they don’t get caught out with any negative press.

I’m not saying you would, or are even in that position but they may not know that. You are just a familiar face around the club at certain times.

 

[Allefgib]

All good posts since my deliberately provocative post on Pets playing forward.

Can we at least acknolwedge the 'player guilt' is all opinion based and not fact.
Has any player actually said they are putting in more effort out of guilt of Craigy being sacked?

What is a fact is the players have performed better since Bickley took over. He has Petrenko playing better footy when forward compared to what Craigy did. To be honest this could be as much about forward entries than anything else - who knows for sure. The outcomes speak for themselves to a large degree.

Definitely happy to concede next season will be probably more telling than this year in terms of 'sustained changes' - but this thread is about what Bickey has done that Craigy didn't.

I'm definitely of the opinion the mindset craigy had the team approaching games seems to be very different to that of the team under Bicks. That may be a product of the 'release valve' being triggered - but craigy had created the need for the release himself.

Those holding the player efforts to account still... fair enough you have your concerns but the buck had to stop with the coach. Key aspect of coaching is to inspire the team to play the way you want. if you can't do that - get out of the box.

 

[Allefgib]

Can anyone comment on how much time Dougy was in the middle for centre bounces on the weekend?

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

Can we at least acknolwedge the 'player guilt' is all opinion based and not fact.
Has any player actually said they are putting in more effort out of guilt of Craigy being sacked?

I am yet to read a direct quote from any player suggesting they 'feel guilty' about the removal of Neil Craig. Happy to be proven wrong shall someone produce a direct quote.

I do get the feeling that a few journalist are using creative freedom with what they are writing and paraphrasing different quotes and that 'player guilt' has taken effect without them actually saying it. That maybe true but I categorically can not say if a player has direly said those words.

 

[Slippery Pete]

I think Craig played him forward because he liked pets defensive qualities and wanted him to help hold the ball in the 50, where as Bicks likes his attacking abilities and has asked him to attack and kick goals. Subtle difference in approach massive difference in outcome.

Bingo.

One word: Attitudinal.

Now that Neil is no longer systematically ruining the playing group, we are starting to see some organic results. They may not be perfect - but at least they're organic. It's a start.

 

[SydCrow]

this is what Pets said:

"When you lose a coach it's obviously pretty disappointing and you realise that you've driven him out of his job.

"You want to make up for it and I've always thought we've underperformed this year."

http://www.afc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/4417/newsid/121717/default.aspx

The increased effort is "making up for" the coach being sacked. Is that guilt?

 

[jenny61_99]

this is what Pets said:

"When you lose a coach it's obviously pretty disappointing and you realise that you've driven him out of his job.

"You want to make up for it and I've always thought we've underperformed this year."

http://www.afc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/4417/newsid/121717/default.aspx

The increased effort is "making up for" the coach being sacked. Is that guilt?

Yes. Can't be much clearer I wouldn't think.

 

[jenny61_99]

With all due respect Jenny, they would only know you in a particular capacity. A person who helps out around the club whist they were in Queensland, it's not like you are a personal confident who they explicitly trust.

Therefore they'd especially take the party line with someone who could report back to the club any negativity. They would watch what they say and they don’t get caught out with any negative press.

I’m not saying you would, or are even in that position but they may not know that. You are just a familiar face around the club at certain times.

Yes, perhaps you are right. Although, I've had some corker comments from various players (and coaches for that matter) over the years. I don't think any of them check themselves - ie. mind what they are saying, because if they did - they aren't doing a very good job!

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

The players are saying respectful things about Craigy. I would hope they'd have more class than to stick the boots in and trample on his grave, even if there were things that frustrated them and even if part of them was glad that he's gone.

Mackay was on 5aa and was pressed on the differences:
- Bickley provides players with just 3-4 key focus points
- At the end of each quarter the slate is wiped clean, mistakes aren't dwelled upon

 

[Allefgib]

this is what Pets said:

"When you lose a coach it's obviously pretty disappointing and you realise that you've driven him out of his job.

"You want to make up for it and I've always thought we've underperformed this year."

http://www.afc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/4417/newsid/121717/default.aspx

The increased effort is "making up for" the coach being sacked. Is that guilt?

Very impersonal comments imo. Nothing specific to himself or craigy. Not convinced he feels guilty. You are?

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

I am yet to read a direct quote from any player suggesting they 'feel guilty' about the removal of Neil Craig. Happy to be proven wrong shall someone produce a direct quote.

I do get the feeling that a few journalist are using creative freedom with what they are writing and paraphrasing different quotes and that 'player guilt' has taken effect without them actually saying it. That maybe true but I categorically can not say if a player has direly said those words.

Rowey asked DMac on AA tonight whetherbthe players felt guilty and his response was that the players did feel responsible and wanted to make up for it

Pets also said "when you lose a coach It's disappointing and you realise that you have driven him out of a job and you want to make up for it"

Without over cooking this, there would be something very wrong at our club if the players failed to take some responsibility for our season, yes the butt stops with CRaigy however hopefully the silver lining out of all this is that the players too will start to take more responsibility for their performances, this is one form of leadership and it's been lacking for the majority of the year

 

[Allefgib]

I'm comfortable with comments regarding the players taking back more responsibility for their own performance. I don't feel that's necessarily a guilt driven thing though.

 

[jenny61_99]

I'm comfortable with comments regarding the players taking back more responsibility for their own performance. I don't feel that's necessarily a guilt driven thing though.

What else would drive it?

 

[Geoffa32]

I doubt that Craigy lost the players.

I think that Craigy lost the ability to get the message to the players. IMO he became stale. It happens to most people when they are in the one job for 7 years. The players (most of) seemed to hang off his every word. They speak fondly of him because he is respected.

I firmly believe Craigy (with some help) identified he had become stale and had to stand down.

It seems to me through hearing different bits and pieces from players and others at the club through the media that the core "gameplan" has not changed much from what Craigy wanted. We just hardly saw it under his tenure since 2009. Just a few tweaks (Walker in, Stiffy playing a differnt role, mids looking where they are kicking to forward targets etc) and IMO the message is coming from a new person with a fresh voice.

It is not untill the preseason we will see drastic changes in the side. Regardless of who coaches.

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

What else would drive it?

Lets just agree to replace "feeling guilty" with "feeling responsible"