Collingwood's 3rd tall forward

[BEEG]

Now lets say Rocca comes back and stays fit which looks like a strong chance who should be Collingwoods 3rd tall forward behind Rocca and Cloke

Anthony
Looks the goods with his strong marking and great kicking for goal i also think he would play alot better as a 3rd tall with alot of the attention of him could be a 30+ goal kicker a year for us and could also move to the backline if we need him

Reid
Still young and very raw could slot in very nice in a pocket being a leading forward i would say his very strong on the lead but not the best goal kicker but that will all come with confidence i do think 3 years from now he will be one of our starting FF CHF he also could move back or to a flank for team balance

Rusling
Most people golden child on this board is a great lead up forward very kick and not a bad kick for goal problems are with rusling is you need to get a structure happening early can we count on him being fit playing 22games and being able to put pressure on in the forward line and a bit one dimensional cant see any other position for him but FF or FP

Dawes
Could be a real match up problem for teams with 3 massive units in the 50 but also could not be great for our structure and defensive pressure his a strong mark and a good kick and loves to throw his body around could maybe move back or up the ground to CHF

Macaffer
Showed to have some talent againts Richmond before getting injured looked very fast and really did well in keeping the ball in and setting up opportunities for our smalls also could be a massive headache for clubs with him in a pocket and Didak Medhurst on the flanks

What do you all think i dont think we could have any more then 3 Talls 4 just blows the team balance out people might think differently

 

[Heater39]

In order of preference;

1- Anthony
2- Macaffer
3- Rusling
4- Reid
5- Dawes

Anthony and Macaffer are 1&2 as they are imo the best options for 'team balance', both seem ideal 3rd tall options. Anthony is obviously ahead at this stage.

Rusling has talent but is too unreliable with injury and more suited to the primary target at FF imo.

Reid is the least physically developed player and in the long-term will be a KP player but he does have good pace and decent hands.

I rate Dawes, but I have him last as I see him as Rocca's replacement, so when Rocca is in the side, he keeps Dawes out. Also, having Rocca, Cloke and Dawes in the forward line could get us caught out on the rebound.

 

[hotpie]

If you are going to assume Rocca comes back from injury then you have to equally assume Rusling will do the same.

In that case Rusling and Anthony will be "equal third" tall forwards, Rusling more in a lead up role on the flank and occasional CHF in rotation with Cloke, and Anthony staying within the 50 metre arc and playing decoy for Rocca who will spend a lot of time on the bench.

MAcaffer is not a tall under any definition. Reid will be a spare parts player and Dawes wil continue his development in the VFL.

 

[well left]

I'd think at this stage I would order them as follows:

Anthony - the incumbent. Kicks straight and provides a target but still a work in progress. Deserves some more time and will be interesting to see how he goes in the structure once Rocca returns.

Reid - was not really sure where to rate him but I think this is where the coaching staff would have him. Would prefer at this stage to leave him off this list and let him develop at half back.

Rusling - if he can get over his injuries and stay fit I think he could climb to the top of this list. If he can string some good games together at VFL level he has the talent and the faith of the coaching staff to force his way into the team. If this happens it may allow us the luxury of seeing how JA performs down back as we can always switch him forward if we need to.

Macaffer - the wildcard. If we were to play 4 talls he would be the one to come in as he is really a medium that can play tall and small. I don't reckon he is that far away from a game.

Dawes - he's at the bottom of the list as I'd prefer him to be allowed to develop in the VFL this year. May come into the picture if Rocca does not play.

 

[shawthing09]

Depends on what your selecting the team on.

On Readiness I'd go Anthony....Rusling....Maccaffer..Reid.Dawes

On structure I'd go Reid.Anthony...Rusling..Maccaffer..Dawes

On potential / Upside I'd go Ried..Anthony..Rusling..Dawes..Maccaffer.

Based on that and the fact that right now we have to pick the best overall option with all that in mind you'd have to assume Anthony is a shoe in, with Ried (depending on VFL form) playing at every oppertunity he creates for himself / Rocca creates with his absence.

 

[Dogs_Playing_Poker]

Order of Preference
1 Mcaffer - Difficult Match Up
2 Anthony - Move him to the Backline
3 Dawes - Big Body, needs to learn to use it first
4 Reid - Couple of years away still
5 Rusling - Who knows??

Just think Mcaffer would be the best option as I would love to see Anthony thrown back and bring the kid in. Is also a very good kick for goal and does know how to find the sticks! Chases hard and I reckon unlike Anthony, if Mcaffer isnt kicking goals he will still accumulate alot of the ball and set up team mates.

 

[Old Spice]

I can still see a 3rd opposition defender not having too many problems in spoiling Anthony while I think Rusling would be a nightmare. Plus I really want to see Jack's defending work down back and disposal from there.

 

[PieLebo87]

I think people are forgetting Medhurst. He is our 3rd forward when Rocca and Cloke are CHF and FF. Medhurst would be commanding alot more of the footy with the 3rd defender on him.

 

[shawthing09]

I think people are forgetting Medhurst. He is our 3rd forward when Rocca and Cloke are CHF and FF. Medhurst would be commanding alot more of the footy with the 3rd defender on him.

I agree to a point as Medhurst does play tall. I think people are doing this assuming 2 things 1) that Medhurst whilst playing tall is also able to play small, mobile and doesn't make the foward line at all top heavy. 2) That we want to give Medhurst the freedom to play his own role I.E presenting a foward target with the freedom to also play small and also free the half fowardline and as such 3 tall kp targets and Medhurst still work comfortably in the same fowardline.

 

[Trojan82]

IMO the idea of a set forward line/midfield/back line is well dead and buried.

We have to start selecting players based on there ability to push back when necessary and be an effective defender (or hole plugger).

In another thread someone said that with Rocca back and our curent gameplan he would be 1-out in the forward line all the time because there is never anyone there. That's ridiculous, if Rocca went to the forward line and stayed there then that would be a completely different game plan for a start (Plus he would very rarely be 1 out!)

Cloke and Anthony IMO get a game before Rocca. They have a better ability as defensive players and certainly are much fitter (That's not to say Rocca shouldn't be straight back in the side when he can) all this hoopla about Rocca coming back and changing our style of play to suit him doesn't make sense when chances are he is only going to play 12 - 15 games for the year.

1. Cloke
2. Anthony
3. Rocca
4. Rusling
5. Reid
6. Caff and Dawes

JA has an amazing ability to make me feel safe when he has the ball at a set shot at goal. No-one else at Collingwood makes me feel as safe as that. He IMO is an absolute necessity in the forward line more-so than Rocca....

 

[buzzbuzz]

I see Jack Anthony as being the best forward option we've had in 10 years. I rate him as the best forward option in our list, including Rocca. Trav Cloke is replacing Pebbles as the long kicking big CHF, and JA will cement his spot as a good leading FF or FP.

He is the best kick for goal in our team, so why would we move him out of the forward line? He can learn things like structure, and can develop his already good marking, so... I really don't see why you'd want to drop him from the forward line.

 

[Old Spice]

The thing about Rocca is that he is so strong that he is able to stay deep to contest a mark, unlike Cloke and JA who always lead up high to get their marks. I think La Traviata could actually win many a wrestle as he is a beast, but without another bulky man-mountain, he will be double teamed, so circumstance dictates he must lead up.

With Rocca there, defenders are dragged back fairly deep and even if he is double teamed, you expect some opportunist small forwards to swoop on the ball or opposition defence. Space is created for Cloke and Rusling / JA to run into. Even kicking in from one flank, with Rocca deep and a 2/3rd tall leading fruther up in the 50, we have options deep and wide to stretch opposition defences.

Wouldn't expect ROcca to place enormous defensive pressure on oppositions running out, but definitely pressure when the ball is sailing in.

 

[DaVe86]

Anthony has it clearly until someone else demands it off him.

Rusling, Dawes and Reid perhaps have better physical traits, but until they become regular goal-kickers, Anthony has it clearly.

He'll kick 35-40 goals this year if he plays 22...if not more. Opposition sides are now starting to actually plan for him, he is becoming our more prominent forward because he kicks goals.


He has downside. I still feel he is not getting into games enough. He is not enough of a presence. He is showing signs of taking more contested marks...but he is not busting packs. He gets very few disposals...thankfully he makes them count.

Rusling in particular would be most people's choice to get the 3rd job because he is simply lightning on a lead. But he'll have to prove himself nad come through the reserves. Anthony has runs on the board now.

 

[well left]

He'll kick 35-40 goals this year if he plays 22...if not more. Opposition sides are now starting to actually plan for him, he is becoming our more prominent forward because he kicks goals.

This will be his big challenge. Teams will start planning for him and he will be getting the best or 2nd best defender whereas last year he would have had the 3rd or 4th.

Rocca may be able to slide him down a rung or two but he needs to continue to develop tools and not rely on kicking 3 goals from 5 kicks.

He kicked 7 in a NAB Cup game against rookies when Essendon had shut up shop. His best haul in a regular season game is 4 against NM last year when he had 4 kicks.

Don't get me wrong here. I am not writing him off. He has however a long way from being a KP forward we can rely on. I'm not sure it is as easy as saying he kicked 25 goals in 12 games therefore he will kick at least 50 this year. It's a big jump. As Dave86 mentioned, I think we should be happy with 30-45 goals from JA for the year.

We still need to find a player capable of kicking 60+ goals if we are to challenge.

 

[Optimax]

It entirely depends on form

Reid, Anthony, Rusling, McCaffer can all be interchanged with whichever one is in the best form.

FWIW i dont think dawes can play in the same side with rocca and trav as well

 

[DaVe86]

This will be his big challenge. Teams will start planning for him and he will be getting the best or 2nd best defender whereas last year he would have had the 3rd or 4th.

Rocca may be able to slide him down a rung or two but he needs to continue to develop tools and not rely on kicking 3 goals from 5 kicks.

He kicked 7 in a NAB Cup game against rookies when Essendon had shut up shop. His best haul in a regular season game is 4 against NM last year when he had 4 kicks.

Don't get me wrong here. I am not writing him off. He has however a long way from being a KP forward we can rely on. I'm not sure it is as easy as saying he kicked 25 goals in 12 games therefore he will kick at least 50 this year. It's a big jump. As Dave86 mentioned, I think we should be happy with 30-45 goals from JA for the year.

We still need to find a player capable of kicking 60+ goals if we are to challenge.

The positive thing is that at the moment he is basically getting the best full back.

Cloke is always going to take the CHB.

Anthony played on Scarlett in the NAB GF. If we have Rocca back next week he'll get Milburn as Scarlett will go to Rocca and Taylor to Cloke.


Big difference.

He will get the 3rd best defender.

No Rocca is having a big impact on whoever we are putting at FF because they are getting the best Full Back. Cloke plays high so takes a different sort of opponent.

If we are really lucky, Medhurst will hit full straps and start demanding the 3rd best defender.

 

[Ickirus]

Anthony has the runs on the board and easily our best forward prospect. Strong hands, speed, defensive pressure, good field kick and the most important, an accurate kick for goal.

Anthony is far far ahead of anyone else, still can't believe some of our supporters want to move him to the backline. Just kicked 2 goals on Rutten who is a quality fullback, 25 goals in his first 12 games in his first season, those result are quality and IMO he has more potential than all the other players mentioned in the OP.

 

[DoubleO7]

John Anthony.

You can't seriously cogitate that other players will take up the third forward option do you? After what Anthony has done in the past half a year, it is highly unlikely the coaching staff will just spontaneously move him into the backline just because some other players are available for selection.

Don't be deluded, Anthony has outplayed our other forward options bar Medhurst.

Anthony has managed to score more goals in one season than Rusling has achieved in his entire career.

Dawes looks lost when ever he is playing in the seniors.

Reid has problems staying on his feet and the experiment of playing him on the backline should continue to develop his game further.

As has been mentioned before, Anthony has kicked goals on notable defenders (Rutten being on of them).

 

[Magpiemack]

How far away is Rusling from making a return?

 

[DoubleO7]

Apparently he is 1 - 2 weeks away from making a return to footy.

 

[Krueger]

Rusling by a mile if fully fit.

Reid should be groomed for CHB (Presti isnt going to be around forever)and can alternate forward as situations dictate. Dawes for FF once Rocca retires.

On team balance Anthony should be moved to the backline as he is a better backman than Rusling ever will be. He is the only one capable of filling the role the great Jimmy Clement played.

The Anthony scenario reminds me of the filth when they were playing Silvagni at FF when they had no other options as his best work was at FB. i.e. robbing Peter to pay Paul.

 

[burtpies]

Rusling by a mile if fully fit.

Reid should be groomed for CHB (Presti isnt going to be around forever)and can alternate forward as situations dictate. Dawes for FF once Rocca retires.

On team balance Anthony should be moved to the backline as he is a better backman than Rusling ever will be. He is the only one capable of filling the role the great Jimmy Clement played.

The Anthony scenario reminds me of the filth when they were playing Silvagni at FF when they had no other options as his best work was at FB. i.e. robbing Peter to pay Paul.

You must be joking? Rusling by a mile, why, because he can run fast and get injured. Jack is the third tall and should stay that way. You don't get someone who kicks for goal like him very often and the way the game is heading with the zonening you need to make every chance count. Make rusling the backman, he has the closing speed to match the forwards.

 

[DoubleO7]

Make rusling the backman, he has the closing speed to match the forwards.

His direful agility will be his undoing though (the same applies when he is playing as a forward). He will get toweled up by the best.

 

[Soul_Pie]

I think Anthony has been impressive in the games that he's played so far as a forward. He is starting to really grow in confidence, he is taking some really strong marks, he has an excellent defensive side to his game, and he is a dead-eye dick in front of goal. At the moment I would definitely have him as the third tall forward but I think he could also be very useful down back where his class disposal and sure hands could be used to great effect. Either way he should be in our best 22 for the remainder of the season barring injury or a massive form slump.

I think it's worth mentioning, however, that Rusling has an explosiveness to him that makes him very dangerous; when playing at his best he is the very definition of a "power forward". I rate him still as a very good prospect, he impressed me greatly when he began to string games together in 2007, but there are still question marks over his ability to cope with the rigours of AFL footy.

I also wonder whether these past injuries will have some kind of psychological effect on his game. Will he really feel comfortable going full throttle and crashing and bashing given how vulnerable he seemingly is to injury? I guess we'll just have to wait and see. If he does make a strong return in the VFL then we should definitely look into having him as our third tall forward option while Anthony plays a role in defence.

 

[shawthing09]

I can still see a 3rd opposition defender not having too many problems in spoiling Anthony while I think Rusling would be a nightmare. Plus I really want to see Jack's defending work down back and disposal from there.

I have / had this fear too. However his body positioning in a contest has always been pretty good, his hands often let him down in these cases but he has (probably a lot to od with confidence) improved in this area over the off season and is starting to take advantage of being in good position more often. He is actually a strong mark.

He is not lightening on the lead or a monster unit but he is remarkably solid in every aspect of foward play (other then the whole knowledge of teams mates space thing which he will learn.) The other thing about him is he makes every touch count. At the moment he is pretty much the perfect 3rd tall option in that he has enough to cause defenders a headache and when he wins the ball he is going to hurt you. Unfortunately though he doesn't really have a great deal at the moment to create a real target.

The problem is more structural then anything else. With the style of ball movement we have we really need 2 targets one who plays high as a link target like Cloke used too / does and one as a long get out of jail contesting target as Rocca has in the past. Obviously it doesn't need to be an anchored to the goal square target like Rocca but still a nice big guy who midfielders can kick too in a pressure situation. Anthony may improve to a point where he is that kind of target but I am not sure whether he will due to his size. Rusling is never going to be that kind of player. He may have a more damaging weapon in his speed but he is also less versatile and is not the sort of player who is likely to handle the scrappy slow ball movement we tned to have very well.