Harry O'Brien vs Patrick Ryder

[Winner]

Ryder is a better athlete, footballer, decision maker and is much more versatile.

 

[DoubleO7]

Ryder is a better athlete, footballer, decision maker and is much more versatile.

Yet O'Brien gets better results

 

[bfty]

Yet O'Brien gets better results

BINGO

/Thread

 

[smiddaz123]

Ryder is a better ruckman, forward and probably midfielder. O'Brien is a better defender.

I find it baffling that Ryder isn't used as a ruckman at Essendon personally.....

 

[Silvagnis]

Who would you prefer on your team and why?

Ryder.

Carlton would be a better team with Ryder in the side than O'Brien who will never be an A grader.

Waite could swing forward and alternate with Ryder at CHB.

Ryder has the potential and talent to be the 196 cms plus tall defender Carlton needs to play on the bigger forwards. Koutoufides is proof an athletic type like Ryder can be developed into an A grade footballer if they can mark and kick.

Though I'd probably prefer Petrie ahead of Ryder in a KPP.

Or Trengove for the future if injury doesn't hurt his football career.

Ryder lacks intensity, but is still a great prospect.

Except for Setanta, I wouldn't pick O'Brien ahead of the other backs Carlton played last year.

 

[Jex]

22 people voted for O'Brien, lol

 

[smiddaz123]

Maybe they're going for current output rather than potential?

O'Brien is currently easily a better defender

 

[Kaiser Powser]

Maybe they're going for current output rather than potential?

O'Brien is currently easily a better defender

Or maybe they are all Collingwood supporters. (23 out of 25 are Pies supporters)

AC for PM, Avni, BEEG, bfty, Big Nasty, Cassius_Clay, DoubleO7, Drizt, Dylz48, EasternFooty, Flying_Penguin, Heater39, ktm_306, Lupton Warchild Pittman, Magpie Mick, magpie_militia, mattys123, medhurstISGOD, PieLebo87, pieman123, Rohan25, Shutty05, SteeleBeams, stifler's mom, swiftdog

I would like to see the results without bias support from both teams. That would be a good option for polls, to ban each teams supporters from voting, it would provide far better results.

 

[Claude Balls]

22 people voted for O'Brien, lol

Rest assured the vast majority would be Collingwood supporters.

In response to the question, "who would you rather on your team and why?", I suspect the vast majority of neutral supporters would vote for Ryder.

If your team was apparently on the brink of premiership glory, and needed only some minimal shoring of the defence, you may vote O'Brien, given that was more effective in 2008 in terms of pure defence, however if you were basing your decision purely on talent, and especially for the future, it must be Ryder hands down.

 

[Kaiser Powser]

Mate, watch a game.

Harry's disposal is far ahead of Presti's. Mick worked hard with him over the pre-season in 2008 on running the ball out of defense and spotting up a target (I saw them doing this at training countless times). He really improved in this area, and provides loads of rebound. He's pretty good moving through congestion in the backline too, he backs himself, runs the ball out and kicks long to a target. He had over 90% disposal efficiency from memory. Very impressive for what you consider a mere "stopper". Though it would be easy to think he's just a stopper, after the absolute demolition he put on Lucas... twice.

I'm not comparing Harry's disposal to Presti's. What I was suggesting is that the Collingwood supporter who said that Harry had loads of talent, would probably say the same thing about Presti, and he effectively proved me correct by labelling Presti 'the most underated player ever'.

Harry has increased his run and carry which provides good rebound, but that still does not mean he has natural football ability and any Collingwood supporter that suggests either he or Preti do, are quite delusional.

 

[hellfire]

Maybe they're going for current output rather than potential?

O'Brien is currently easily a better defender

Maybe they're going for value? A rookie vs. a top 10 pick. Not that it matters in these polls.

 

[Bosun]

Brendan Fevola and Lance Franklin the 2nd/3rd best forwards?

Fev kicked bags of 7 and 8 goals on him last year in both enounters, he totally destroyed him. I wouldnt use him as a pro for your O'brien argument.

 

[PieLebo87]

Fev kicked bags of 7 and 8 goals on him last year in both enounters, he totally destroyed him. I wouldnt use him as a pro for your O'brien argument.

I wasn't discussing how he performed, I was pointing out that he DOES play on premier forwards of the comp. You, of all people, would know that with the delivery Fevola was getting both those afternoons, even SOS would've had trouble controlling him. He is also the best positional FF in the competition for a reason.

 

[Palmer Stoat]

It depends what you need. If you want someone to play a KP, you'd take Ryder. If you had the KPs covered, you'd take O'Brien, who's versatile enough to play on Milne or pinch-hit in a KP.

As for talent, yep, Ryder's got a greater ceiling, though he's presently not as good a player as O'Brien IMO -- who's a fine player and still improving.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Harry's a better player.

Ryder is a better long term option.

 

[hellfire]

Fev kicked bags of 7 and 8 goals on him last year in both enounters, he totally destroyed him. I wouldnt use him as a pro for your O'brien argument.

A) Harry shouldn't have to play on Fevola and Franklin, but he can and does. Once Reid and Brown develop more, we'll be better equipped, and O'Brien can play on forwards in his weight class.

B) Fevola was on fire in both matches, getting delivery on a platter after our midfield got destroyed. Any defender would've had at least 5 kicked on them.

 

[Wahooti Fandango]

Harry's a better player.

Ryder is a better long term option.

Exactly my thinking.

Short Term = O'Brien

Long Term = Ryder

 

[Bosun]

A) Harry shouldn't have to play on Fevola and Franklin, but he can and does. Once Reid and Brown develop more, we'll be better equipped, and O'Brien can play on forwards in his weight class.

B) Fevola was on fire in both matches, getting delivery on a platter after our midfield got destroyed. Any defender would've had at least 5 kicked on them.

Fair enough and I agree.

Definately admit that he was getting silver service delivery (would have been nice if we did that against a few more teams), however Im not sure he can handle the first option in the fwd line (Fev, Buddy, Pav) etc.

I do like O'Brien and he would slot in nicely in our backline, however for the poll I went with Ryder, I think he will be a gun, looks very versatile.

 

[Jex]

Exactly my thinking.

Short Term = O'Brien

Long Term = Ryder

Ryder is better now and will be better tomorrow.

 

[Lockyer24]

Harry is our best kept secret. He is better now.

 

[grantyc77]

Ryder is still developing and will be a gun, O'Brien is an honest player but i would have Ryder any day.

 

[Brad Goodman]

I suppose you'd say the same thing about Presti.

Showing your ignorance right there, but thats OK I think most football followers can only accurately describe 4 or 5 players from other clubs due to not seeing enough of them.

 

[smiddaz123]

Ryder is still developing and will be a gun, O'Brien is an honest player but i would have Ryder any day.

And O'Brien isn't still developing?

People seem to be thinking Ryder is the only one with upside left.

O'Brien was very much an athlete playing football at first and is still developing. Plenty of upside left.

 

[thebigboy]

And O'Brien isn't still developing?

People seem to be thinking Ryder is the only one with upside left.

O'Brien was very much an athlete playing football at first and is still developing. Plenty of upside left.

You are probably the only person on here who believes that O'Brien's upside is bigger than Ryder's or have I got the wrong impression?

 

[smiddaz123]

Yeh....tell me where you got me saying O'Brien has more upside from. Thanks.