NO TROLLS Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed. Part 2

[Wosh]

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NO TROLLS - Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed.

Don’t use this thread as an opportunity to troll North or any other clubs, you’ll be removed from the discussion. Stick to the topic and please keep it civil and respectful to those involved. Keep personal arguements out of this thread. Help moderators by not quoting obvious trolls and use the...

www.bigfooty.com

Link to Hawthorn Statement. - Link to ABC Sports article. - Leaked Report

Process Plan - https://resources.afl.com.au/afl/do...erms-of-Reference-and-Process-Plan-FINAL-.pdf


DO NOT QUOTE THREADS FROM OTHER BOARDS

 

[blackshadow]

Reeves has two problems;

1. He commissioned the report including determining the scope.
2. He was Kennett's man and there is a new president.

It is not really surprising for mine.

Doubt it. He is at the centre of the stuff Clarko is livid about - the running of the process. And there is no love lost between the two.

That’s pretty much what I thought as an outsider looking in to things Hawthorn.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Jeff Kennett

Prized campaigner

 

[Simon Crawshay]

Reeves has two problems;

1. He commissioned the report including determining the scope.
2. He was Kennett's man and there is a new president.

It is not really surprising for mine.

Doubt it. He is at the centre of the stuff Clarko is livid about - the running of the process. And there is no love lost between the two.

I think this is a pretty good lesson in the dangers of stepping outside standards practices.

Plenty of companies run welfare surveys and the like which we have probably all been a part off (you know the accounts department has 65% engagement with our business strategy, that kind of thing).

But to commission what Egan did (which I have heard described as a Truth Telling, Welfare Check, Report, Investigation, take your pick) had such big potential risks.

Never mind hindsight, it was like lighting a fuse. The fact that it named three ex employees and never interviewed them is unforgivable IMOH.

It's a pity in a way because I think Reeves did a lot of good things at the club but boy that was such an error of judgement to commission that report in the scope of it and the way it was executed.

 

[Zebrah]

No it’s not a coincidence at all, you’ve just jumped to a conclusion of how Jackson got the info, and you’re running with it regardless of any proof.

How do you think Jackson got the info? And how did the full report find it’s way into the public domain via the Herald Sun?

Had to be Hawthorn, Egan or the AFL. I doubt it was the AFL.

 

[Redline]

Wouldn't be beyond the realms of AFL possiblity


-AFL wants to close quickly
-Shoulder is tapped
- In turn, AFL closes said investigation and has a scapegoat inhouse

That's my thinking. He is the most expendable. There doesn't even need to be any finding against him, the AFL can just get the media to paint a picture.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

How do you think Jackson got the info? And how did the full report find it’s way into the public domain via the Herald Sun?

Had to be Hawthorn, Egan or the AFL. I doubt it was the AFL.

Doesn’t have to be them at all.

 

[sr36]

How do you think Jackson got the info? And how did the full report find it’s way into the public domain via the Herald Sun?

Had to be Hawthorn, Egan or the AFL. I doubt it was the AFL.

It was a redacted report printed in the Herald Sun. Hawthorn emailed the AFL a redacted report. I doubt that leak is down to Egan

 

[HairyO]

Reeves will step down from the role effective immediately due to the personal toll and the need to focus on his well-being in what has been a very difficult period for the club.

Does this mean he has no reason to provide a version of events or justification of his part in the matter now?

He forgot the first rule: Never commission a report unless you already know the answers. Rookie error from a CEO.

 

[Zebrah]

Doesn’t have to be them at all.

So who else then?

As I understand, only Hawthorn, Egan and the AFL Integrity Unit had access to the report at the time of leaking.

Who else do you think had it?

 

[BIGHAWK23]

Hmm, I don't think so. Damien Barrett has been floating trial balloons re: draft punishments for the past few weeks. I doubt he'd run with that without having some sort of inside word.

I look forward to all the Hawks fans replying with "we followed the AFL process".

Barrett has said on multiple occasions that while he thinks Hawthorn should lose draft picks
He doesn't think it will happen

If Clarkson and Co. are found not guilty, very hard to sanction Hawthorn outside of a monetary sense
But noone knows, so not worth talking about

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Barrett has said on multiple occasions that while he thinks Hawthorn should lose draft picks
He doesn't think it will happen

If Clarkson and Co. are found not guilty, very hard to sanction Hawthorn outside of a monetary sense
But noone knows, so not worth talking about

On a sidebar, I really don't understand the logic of penalising clubs like this.

It's the supporters that you are punishing.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

We are in the middle of Reconciliation Week.

Some serious steps

• Heartfelt apology from Hawthorn to current and former First Nations players aggrieved by cultural insensitivity
• HFC to commit to developing and implementing an A+ quality Reconciliation Action Plan

Some less serious steps

• Jeff Kennett apologises for wasting oxygen, his Golliwog collection, to Clarko and all players and fans of the Hawks
• Kennett agrees to reparations including refraining from public comment on any matter, never attending sporting events as well as mowing the Clarko lawns, washing the Clarko cars for two years
• The Dingley development to be named the Napoleon Centre in honour of both Mitchell and Clarko (two blokes with small man syndrome)

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

He forgot the first rule: Never commission a report unless you already know the answers. Rookie error from a CEO.

With Shaun Burgoyne at the club for so long along with Changa before him, he probably thought he did.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

So who else then?

As I understand, only Hawthorn, Egan and the AFL Integrity Unit had access to the report at the time of leaking.

Who else do you think had it?

Who said they needed the report?

This is a public board, so I won’t be posting anything here regarding who told Jackson where to look.

 

[Zebrah]

Who said they needed the report?

This is a public board, so I won’t be posting anything here regarding who told Jackson where to look.

The actual report was published in the Herald Sun and other publications. How do you explain that? Surely only Hawthorn, Egan and The AFL had a copy?

 

[_Mike_]

PLEASE REFRAIN FROM QUOTING POSTS/THREAD FROM OTHER BOARDS, BAY13 INCLUDED

 

[Gavin Excell]

I'm not sure why Hawthorn needs any sanctions to be honest.

It appears they looked into their past with good faith, and escalated matters to the AFLs attention when those serious allegations were raised. Not sure what else the club can do

 

[Chief]

I'm not sure why Hawthorn needs any sanctions to be honest.

It appears they looked into their past with good faith, and escalated matters to the AFLs attention when those serious allegations were raised. Not sure what else the club can do

Why would anyone follow the procedure if they knew they were just going to get slapped for it?

 

[HairyO]

With Shaun Burgoyne at the club for so long along with Changa before him, he probably thought he did.

Yeah, I assume they very much thought it would be discontent and upset as the emotions shared, rather than the stories which ended up being in there.

But that is always the risk when you scratch below the surface.

Why would anyone follow the procedure if they knew they were just going to get slapped for it?

Exactly. Every other club will be sure to do a half-arsed look at themselves for fear of getting the same sanctions.

Ive said before the AFL needs a Truth and Reconcilliation style investigation in to itself and also the clubs. No blame, no sanctions, just people being free to speak their mind.

If there are serious accusations made they should also be investigated. But actually investigated.

 

[westie]

Yeah, I assume they very much thought it would be discontent and upset as the emotions shared, rather than the stories which ended up being in there.

But that is always the risk when you scratch below the surface.



Exactly. Every other club will be sure to do a half-arsed look at themselves for fear of getting the same sanctions.

Ive said before the AFL needs a Truth and Reconcilliation style investigation in to itself and also the clubs. No blame, no sanctions, just people being free to speak their mind.

If there are serious accusations made they should also be investigated. But actually investigated.

I can't see that working because society feels the need to BLAME someone for whatever happens, right or wrong!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

The actual report was published in the Herald Sun and other publications. How do you explain that? Surely only Hawthorn, Egan and The AFL had a copy?

Think again.

 

[HairyO]

I can't see that working because society feels the need to BLAME someone for whatever happens, right or wrong!

Then the AFL is going to be the one to cop the blame if claims like this happens again. I bet Gil is furious that his last act as CEO was presiding over a failed and flawed investigation in to horrific claims made by former players.

 

[PJays]

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/hawthorn-president-andy-gowers-talks-racism-investigation-compensation-2013-premiership-reunion-jeff-kennett-and-the-ceo-search/news-story/6af05d915ace549ee50a0a7db6e6ab15

Hawthorn might end up paying significant compensation to the First Nations families as part of the AFL-approved deal while Clarkson and Fagan make no admissions over any wrongdoing.

Gowers said the club was open to all options including paying reparations to injured parties.

“Whatever comes out of the investigation, we’re open to sitting down and discussing it. I’ll be as specific and as broad as that. So we’re open to discussions with all parties,” he said when asked about paying compensation.”

Incredibly surprising. No one saw this coming!

So, this is what the indigenous player and his (ex?)partner will achieve:

• Make extremely serious allegations (re forced abortion) that fail the pub test
• Refuse to co-operate with the investigation- even though the AFL bent over backwards to find an independent panel, one of whom has connections with Phil Egan.
• Refuse to be interviewed.
• Refuse to allow documents relating to your own accusations be released to allow mediation.
• Get a significant pay out.

Not a bad outcome for them, is it?

 

[Chief]

that fail the pub test

Your pub test.

 

[Chief]

Think again.

Perhaps we need an FAQ? There seem to be a few "facts" floating around that won't stay corrected.