Is Patrick Smith for Real ?

[Skooks]

Smith is a slef acclaimed ********

 

[dogsbody]

Patrick Smith brings a breadth of context to his sports analysis and commentary that the vast majority of others, particularly the radio crowd, who restrict themselves to marks-kicks-goals-and-what-a-gun-he-is-,-haw-haw-haw variety of delivery, are incapable of. I also don't agree with everything he says/writes and some of it I don't like but he is one of the best at his craft.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Patrick Smith brings a breadth of context to his sports analysis and commentary that the vast majority of others, particularly the radio crowd, who restrict themselves to marks-kicks-goals-and-what-a-gun-he-is-,-haw-haw-haw variety of delivery.

Is that more Dumbass'style?.

 

[littleduck]

Patrick Smith brings a breadth of context to his sports analysis and commentary that the vast majority of others, particularly the radio crowd, who restrict themselves to marks-kicks-goals-and-what-a-gun-he-is-,-haw-haw-haw variety of delivery, are incapable of. I also don't agree with everything he says/writes and some of it I don't like but he is one of the best at his craft.

Ok I'll accept the point that P.Smith often brings a new angle to each sporting issue/debate, and whether its nonsense or actually has some merit, I'll still argue with you about the manner in which he says it! (which includes an inability to be fair & balanced)

His style of writing is provocative when often there is no need to be provocative.

His style of writing turns people against him even if they sometimes agree with him.

His personality is one of an arrogant p*ick with a superiority complex for himself and his beloved AFL.

His nature is to constantly attack & belittle those with whom he dislikes.

His hatred of 'Rugby League culture' borders on some deep psychological problem.

He is a writer for a national paper but he writes for a southern-states audience.

He perpetuates the Victorian view of national & international sporting affairs.

His writing on non-AFL sports stories always shows a lack of understanding of that sport.

He isn't worth reading.

 

[dogsbody]

Patrick Smith

* AFL Media Association Most Outstanding Columnist in 2002 and 2001.

* Inaugural Walkley Award for sports reporting (horse-racing investigative report)
* Walkley 2002. Best commentary, analysis, opinion and critique for his columns on the AFL.
* ANZ Australian Golf Writers' Association award for best newspaper report on golf 2002

The scores are on the board. I became an admirer during his 7.15 a.m. stints on Sports 927 with Kevin Bartlett and, variously, Sean Cosgrove, Dr Turf and Gary Honey. His comments were often provocative but he recognised the humanity of his subjects and demanded standards of them.

Hatred of Rugby League ? I don't think so although I acknowledge that you might be right, coming from Qld with perceptions that those of us from non-Rugby states might lack. He is justifiably critical of a lot about Rugby League. Its tolerance of thuggery, its insular approach to criticism in comparison to the more enlightened approach of the AFL towards cleaning up the game and social issues. Yet he praises Rugby for its Tribunal set up and condemns the AFL for its unreliable system.

I think he is balanced, critical of what he perceives worthy of criticism praising of what deserves praise.

 

[puddingfactor]

Found this on Crikey's site:
http://www.crikey.com.au/media/2005/01/25-0007.html

A private spray from Patrick Smith

Subscriber email - 25 Tuesday

Further to yesterday's email exchange between Crikey and Piers Akerman, today we have an example of The Australian's Patrick Smith arrogantly dishing it out to a Fitzroy supporter as his club was dying. This is from a now sadly neglected Fitzroy Supporters Group web site and shows Patrick Smith does not distinguish between celebs and plebs when dishing out the sledges.

From: Patrick Smith
Sent: Wednesday, 17 October 2001 7:56pm
To: John Kotsopoulos

John,

Your club is bankrupt of support and credibility. You don't understand football issues. Save your time and mine and don't email me again. There's a good boy. Thank you,

Patrick Smith

From: John Kotsopoulos
To: 'sport@theage.com.au'
Cc: Patrick Smith
Date: Thursday, October 18, 2001 9:07am

No wonder he got the A from the Age

From: Patrick Smith
Sent: Thursday, 18 October, 2001 9:17am
To: John Kotsopoulos

I didn't get the A from anywhere.

But Fitzroy did get the A from football... Now, please, just go away like your club.

 

[littleduck]

My god mate you're an arse-licker.

I couldnt bring myself to quote you fully so I deleted your vomitting of praise for P/Smith.

Hatred of Rugby League ?

Yes. His natural born hatred of Rugby League is obvious.

I don't think so although I acknowledge that you might be right, coming from Qld with perceptions that those of us from non-Rugby states might lack.

He is justifiably critical of a lot about Rugby League.

Find me one fair dinkum critical article thats justified? If you do, I'll find you 10 that are nonsense.

Its tolerance of thuggery, its insular approach to criticism in comparison to the more enlightened approach of the AFL towards cleaning up the game and social issues. Yet he praises Rugby for its Tribunal set up and condemns the AFL for its unreliable system.

You identified my perceptions and now I'll identify yours. Both you & PSmith might have such a perception of RL coming from a state who follows a more skilful game, but less physical and testosterone driven game.

Why would you think the AFL has a more enlightened approach towards cleaning up the game and social issues?

Wouldn't it be fair to say that AFL are taking the lead over the NRL on certain issues, but on other issues the NRL has set the lead? I could name many areas where the NRL (formerly ARL) have addressed issues well ahead of other sports, including female board members etc.

As far as cleaning up the game goes, IMO the AFL has gone too far in watering down traditional traits of Australian sport such as showing aggresion and not backing down. The outrageous suspensions and fines for girly slaps and the gay-named shirt fronting is an absolute joke.

So while I agree that AFL might be a leader in watering down the physical aspect of the game, I think theyve gone too far.

On the other hand, thuggery is no more of an issue in Rugby League than AFL in recent seasons.

 

[dogsbody]

Wouldn't it be fair to say that AFL are taking the lead over the NRL on certain issues, but on other issues the NRL has set the lead? I could name many areas where the NRL (formerly ARL) have addressed issues well ahead of other sports, including female board members etc.

Patrick Smith would, and I certainly do, agree with you that it would be fair to say that. I’ll concede that about all I know of how Rugby addresses issues is from Patrick Smith’s articles because he’s the only one who writes and speaks about them. His contemporaries in Melbourne lack his breadth of reference.

There’s not much point in you and I debating which code is the further advanced in addressing issues because I simply don’t know enough about what is happening in Rugby to offer you a meaningful debate and this thread is about the quality of Patrick Smith’s work, not my opinion. My reference to thuggery in Rugby is to punches and fights between players and the tolerance that officials have for that sort of behaviour. Its not about strong aggressive tackling. I’m pleased to see the biff disappear from Australian Rules. There’s nothing particularly brave or edifying about throwing a punch at another player, especially it that other player isn’t expecting it. Patrick Smith would see it similarly because he writes accordingly. Now you might not agree with him, but that doesn’t mean he is an arrogant p*ick with a superiority complex for himself and his beloved AFL, that his nature is to constantly attack & belittle those with whom he dislikes or that his hatred of 'Rugby League culture' borders on some deep psychological problem.

He's a journalist. He makes his living writing newspaper articles and speaking on radio. He's not a crusading zealot.

 

[littleduck]

I’ll concede that about all I know of how Rugby addresses issues is from Patrick Smith’s articles because he’s the only one who writes and speaks about them.

I guess you mean Rugby League and not Rugby Union...

And if your source of information for how RL addresses issues is P.Smith... that would be like some Queenslander drawing their AFL knowledge from the writings of a local RL writer who plies his trade in a national newspaper.

His contemporaries in Melbourne lack his breadth of reference.

Yeah, because he writes for a national newspaper and his reference is national issues. However, that does not mask his lack of understanding of Rugby League. He use to write in a VIctorian newspaper for a Victorian audience (the Age), whereas now IMO he writes in a national newspaper (the Australian) but still writes for a Victorian audience.

My reference to thuggery in Rugby is to punches and fights between players and the tolerance that officials have for that sort of behaviour. Its not about strong aggressive tackling.

I totally disagree that thuggery is rife and officials condone such behaviour.

Rugby League is an intensely physical game with players coming into contact in practically each & every tackle, whereas AFL is a supremely skilful game where player contact is vastly less.

The RL world (players fans & officials) has a strong belief that cheap shots & thuggery and unwelcome and should no longer be part of the game, where once they were in both RL and AFL. However, while the AFL has outlawed anything remotely resembling a confrontation such as shirt fronting or jersey pulling, the RL world continues to believe that a bit of biff is acceptable (ie biff falling short of cheap shots or thuggery). Therefore, I disagree with you that the biff is a negative for RL. It's what the fans want on the odd ocassion. There is nothing better in a State of Origin clash than seeing 2 prop forwards going toe to toe with their opposite number.

Above all, I believe RL could never and should never become as sanitised as the AFL currently is. The nature of the game being more physically confrontational wouldnt allow it.

I’m pleased to see the biff disappear from Australian Rules.

Yes, it's good for AFL that cheap shots & thuggery are mostly a thing of the past.

There’s nothing particularly brave or edifying about throwing a punch at another player, especially it that other player isn’t expecting it.

Yeah, cheap shots to an unexpecting player is cowardly. I would disagree with you that showing your aggression is not brave.

Patrick Smith would see it similarly because he writes accordingly.

Exacty. He largely writes the Victorian view of other sports because that is all he knows. Just like you.

Now you might not agree with him, but that doesn’t mean he is an arrogant p*ick with a superiority complex for himself and his beloved AFL, that his nature is to constantly attack & belittle those with whom he dislikes or that his hatred of 'Rugby League culture' borders on some deep psychological problem.

Some over the top comments I'll admit, but I'll stick by my general sentiment that P.Smith is nothing more than a biased Victorian writing the Victorian view of national sporting matters for a national newspaper

He's a journalist. He makes his living writing newspaper articles and speaking on radio. He's not a crusading zealot.

His #1 crusade is to promote AFL. That is obvious to everyone who has the displeasure of reading any of his work.

His radio work is in Melbourne for a Victorian audience where his views would no doubt be welcome. I have no problem with that.

My problem is an alleged national sports journalist writing obvious Victorian-biased stuff in a national newspaper.

 

[dogsbody]

...However, while the AFL has outlawed anything remotely resembling a confrontation such as shirt fronting or jersey pulling, the RL world continues to believe that a bit of biff is acceptable (ie biff falling short of cheap shots or thuggery). Therefore, I disagree with you that the biff is a negative for RL. It's what the fans want on the odd ocassion. There is nothing better in a State of Origin clash than seeing 2 prop forwards going toe to toe with their opposite number.

That’s the issue, Littleduck. What you condone as biff justified because it what the fans want on the odd occasion and there being nothing better than seeing 2 prop forwards going toe to toe, if by that you mean a couple of blokes throwing haymakers at each other, Patrick Smith condemns as thuggery. He says that cheap shots are only part of thuggery. His opinion is that Rugby League needs to eliminate thuggery. So is yours. You and he disagree on what constitutes thuggery, that’s all. That’s what he says and writes. Again, you might disagree with him and accuse him of not understanding Rugby League. That doesn’t mean that he is wrong, or, worse, all those other things you accused him of before. He expresses his views, he puts them clearly. That’s his job. He does it well and better than his contemporaries.

 

[littleduck]

That’s the issue, Littleduck. What you condone as biff justified because it what the fans want on the odd occasion and there being nothing better than seeing 2 prop forwards going toe to toe, if by that you mean a couple of blokes throwing haymakers at each other, Patrick Smith condemns as thuggery. He says that cheap shots are only part of thuggery. His opinion is that Rugby League needs to eliminate thuggery. So is yours. You and he disagree on what constitutes thuggery, that’s all. That’s what he says and writes. Again, you might disagree with him and accuse him of not understanding Rugby League. That doesn’t mean that he is wrong, or, worse, all those other things you accused him of before. He expresses his views, he puts them clearly. That’s his job. He does it well and better than his contemporaries.

You know as well as I do that he slanders League almost on a weekly basis. That only positive RL article anybody can cite is the NRL Judicial Disciplinary system being superior to the AFL shambles.

You would never see P.Smith write a positive story on League such as the recent appointment of a highly competent business woman and Gorden Tallis to the NRL Board as positive steps for the game and the advancement of women in management positions in sporting administration.

Now there is a great story for an alleged national sporting journalist such as P.Smith. The reason he'll never write a positive League story like that is because of his deep dislike of the game and his love of promoting the truly national (sic) AFL competition. That doesnt sound like the normal attitude of a supposed national sports journalist to me. That smells alot like a Victorian slanted AFL promoting journalist to me preaching to the converted southern states audience.

I recognise AFL is what he knows best. I recognise his background is from The Age in Victoria. I have no problem if he writes for a southern states audience in a national newspaper, which includes making the ignorant comments such as "League culture stinks".

My problem is when he passes himself off as a fair & balanced national journalist for a national game writing for a national audience. His credibility in that regard has never left rock bottom.

Quite clearly IMO he doesnt write for a national audience, but merely preaches his AFL-loving/League-hating ways to the converted southern states audience. Why cant he admit that?

What you say above is understandable from a Victorian/southern states perspective, ie a state full of people accustomed to the modern sanitised Aussie Rules game.

If P.Smith could admit his AFL bias and his deep dislike of all things RL then I could possibly read his articles in the manner in which they were intended to be read... ie an ill-informed light-hearted jab at a game he dislikes.

 

[Wojee]

I refuse to read anything the smarmy, vindictive git writes, especially since he implored Blues supporters to not buy a membership immediately after the club was penalised for salary cap breaches. Sure, the club had done the wrong thing but what sort of supporter would abandon their club when it needs their membership dollars the most?

 

[Professional]

You would never see P.Smith write a positive story on League such as the recent appointment of a highly competent business woman and Gorden Tallis to the NRL Board as positive steps for the game and the advancement of women in management positions in sporting administration.

Anyone can put a token woman on a board. How is the biggest thug of all, Tallis, being on the board a positive?

 

[littleduck]

Anyone can put a token woman on a board.

If you knew her background (inc who her husband is), her prior experience at Board level, and the reasons she was appointed, you would not be calling her a token appointment.

How is the biggest thug of all, Tallis, being on the board a positive?

Gorden Tallis is a fine ambassador for the Broncos, Queensland, Australia and the game generally. His appointment to the Board will bring a fresh approach by someone with no past experience at Board level and an insight into the issues most concerning modern RL footballers.