Recommitted Jacob Hopper [re-signed]

[Great8]

I'd trade our pick #2-3 for Hopper & Kennedy, which IF they decide to nominate us, i think would be reasonably fair.

GWS can certainly afford it given how deep their midfield bats and can pick up an elite talent anyway to replace at least Hopper.
Best they could do out of a hypothetical situation both players want out. Spreads their age profile and saves $$$ as well.

Hopper is a top 10 on his own so are you saying you want Kennedy for nothing?

 

[Colonial]

On this one i have no idea..

I hear he is staying and going.

Personally think he is waiting to see if he is cemented in best 22 by end of year.

If he is he stays

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[M Malice]

I'd trade our pick #2-3 for Hopper & Kennedy, which IF they decide to nominate us, i think would be reasonably fair.

GWS can certainly afford it given how deep their midfield bats and can pick up an elite talent anyway to replace at least Hopper.
Best they could do out of a hypothetical situation both players want out. Spreads their age profile and saves $$$ as well.

I'll raise you your pick 2-3 and give GWS our pick 1 for Hopper and Kennedy. Would love to get them on our list, however it is unlikely they would nominate us.

 

[dlanod]

To be fair, the Shiel talk was always very speculative.

Shiel was being reported as a given to leave prior to his previous contract. Treloar leaving that year was the surprise late in the season.

 

[Bic]

If Carlton are involved, I think it would be our 2018 picks up for grabs.

 

[Apex36]

If Carlton are involved, I think it would be out 2018 picks up for grabs.

Whys that? The 2018 draft is being reported as significantly stronger than this years.

 

[Bic]

Whys that? The 2018 draft is being reported as significantly stronger than this years.

Much like last year, we won't be trading our top 5 pick.

Everyone said we would, but we didn't.

I also have a feeling we are targeting a chunk of our rebuild into 3 drafts - 2015, 2016, 2017. I could be wrong.

 

[bird_man]

Whys that? The 2018 draft is being reported as significantly stronger than this years.

I'm pretty sure we hear that every year though, that next years crop will be better.

 

[Apex36]

I'm pretty sure we hear that every year though, that next years crop will be better.

Nah, last year the report was that this year was shallow but stacked with KPP's at the top end. Next year is meant to be more a midfielders draft and stronger and significantly deeper.

 

[F_therest]

Hopper is a top 10 on his own so are you saying you want Kennedy for nothing?

If a second year player was to nominate another club, they almost always go for less than their original draft position...Boyd probably the only exception but the dogs were desperate at the time.

Pick 2-3 is an absolutely premium pick which will get GWS quality...they don't need picks in the teens.
They gave up a lot just to get pick #2 last year for Taranto...have a look at what they traded to get it.

 

[mpal6]

If a second year player was to nominate another club, they almost always go for less than their original draft position...Boyd probably the only exception but the dogs were desperate at the time.

Pick 2-3 is an absolutely premium pick which will get GWS quality...they don't need picks in the teens.
They gave up a lot just to get pick #2 last year for Taranto...have a look at what they traded to get it.

http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/...s-giants-20161006-grwmi8.html?deviceType=text

GWS dropped 4 extra list spots and lost the extra $ from salary cap, hence going as high as possible in draft table was their priority. What they gave up in return is immaterial in GWS point of view, they can't use the draft picks even if they held them all.

But this year, there is no "cutting the list back" for GWS anymore, they are already at 40 players - same as all other clubs. GWS will trade some quality players for high draft picks, but won't on trade picks as madly as they have done in previous years.

 

[MightyTiger]

On this one i have no idea..

I hear he is staying and going.

Personally think he is waiting to see if he is cemented in best 22 by end of year.

If he is he stays

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What type of $ is his current contract and what would he command on an open market?

 

[coniglio_number1]

What type of $ is his current contract and what would he command on an open market?

His first rookie contract

 

[Turbocat]

What type of $ is his current contract and what would he command on an open market?

Honestly..who could answer that..with the numbers that are bing thrown around with the potential raise in SC coming.

 

[MightyTiger]

His first rookie contract

Ah k so he'd be on a base of about $100-110k, so what $ amount would be to much where GWS would say that's to much to pay, and I'm talking about realistic amount, not the ridiculous $9m 9 year North offer for Kelly.

 

[coniglio_number1]

Ah k so he'd be on a base of about $100-110k, so what $ amount would be to much where GWS would say that's to much to pay, and I'm talking about realistic amount, not the ridiculous $9m 9 year North offer for Kelly.

Can't see him commanding much more than $450k at a maximum and 2years at this stage. His exposed form is average to good so he is yet to command Kelly type offers

 

[MightyTiger]

Can't see him commanding much more than $450k at a maximum and 2years at this stage. His exposed form is average to good so he is yet to command Kelly type offers

That's not to bad, has there been any word yet around what type of offer GWS are putting forward for Hopper? I'd imagine your salary cap would be pretty tight.

 

[F_therest]

http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/...s-giants-20161006-grwmi8.html?deviceType=text

GWS dropped 4 extra list spots and lost the extra $ from salary cap, hence going as high as possible in draft table was their priority. What they gave up in return is immaterial in GWS point of view, they can't use the draft picks even if they held them all.

But this year, there is no "cutting the list back" for GWS anymore, they are already at 40 players - same as all other clubs. GWS will trade some quality players for high draft picks, but won't on trade picks as madly as they have done in previous years.

That is true but i think my point and hypothetical trade is still valid.

From GWS' perspective, IF hypothetically Hopper & Kennedy both approach them and say they want out i think something like pick #2 in the draft is as good a deal as they can get in that situation and reasonably fair.

They would rather something like that i think than say, pick #12 for Hopper & pick #18 for Kennedy in separate deals...they want the absolute elite talent.
I understand #12 & #18 are both slight unders but it is quite realistically what they'd get for them.

Their midfield bats so deep losing those 2 wouldn't even be that big a loss, besides they could draft the best mid in the draft with pick #2 to replenish their stocks and spread their age profile further.

 

[Orange Agent]

Ah k so he'd be on a base of about $100-110k, so what $ amount would be to much where GWS would say that's to much to pay, and I'm talking about realistic amount, not the ridiculous $9m 9 year North offer for Kelly.

$300k pa would be my max for him if I was doing contracts. Take out his u/18 reputation and draft pick number, other than his debut match he has struggled a bit with the pace of AFL so far. Think he has a long way to go, if he wants to take a short cut and cash in at age 20 then he is getting some pretty poor advice.

 

[bmaurizio]

$300k pa would be my max for him if I was doing contracts. Take out his u/18 reputation and draft pick number, other than his debut match he has struggled a bit with the pace of AFL so far. Think he has a long way to go, if he wants to take a short cut and cash in at age 20 then he is getting some pretty poor advice.

Fair point, he really hasn't set the world on fire. Certainly has the physique and potential to develop, a pick 15 to 18 would be fair given the uncertainties.
If he nominates a club then that will the range I reckon.

 

[Bokonon_]

That's not to bad, has there been any word yet around what type of offer GWS are putting forward for Hopper? I'd imagine your salary cap would be pretty tight.

I doubt we would know until Kelly in particular is sorted. If we lise Kelly, and I suspect we will sadly, then anyone wanting guys oije Devon Smith or Hopper will be relying on them knocking back good offerrs from us.

 

[MightyTiger]

$300k pa would be my max for him if I was doing contracts. Take out his u/18 reputation and draft pick number, other than his debut match he has struggled a bit with the pace of AFL so far. Think he has a long way to go, if he wants to take a short cut and cash in at age 20 then he is getting some pretty poor advice.

Surely if Kelly goes you guys would have the cap room to sign him on a decent contract, hasn't done much at the level yet but he's had injury issues and as a young player was always going to find it hard to adjust without completing preseason unhindered, I rate the kid highly, midfielders his size are hard to come by and he's shown he can do some special things.

 

[Orange Agent]

Surely if Kelly goes you guys would have the cap room to sign him on a decent contract, hasn't done much at the level yet but he's had injury issues and as a young player was always going to find it hard to adjust without completing preseason unhindered, I rate the kid highly, midfielders his size are hard to come by and he's shown he can do some special things.

Im only guessing but I dont think Dylan Shiel, Toby Greene, Jon Patton would of been on near $500k for their third season. If any young player comes through asking for more than what those guys were on when coming off their draftee contract, then they should probably look elsewhere.

 

[mpal6]

That is true but i think my point and hypothetical trade is still valid.

From GWS' perspective, IF hypothetically Hopper & Kennedy both approach them and say they want out i think something like pick #2 in the draft is as good a deal as they can get in that situation and reasonably fair.

They would rather something like that i think than say, pick #12 for Hopper & pick #18 for Kennedy in separate deals...they want the absolute elite talent.
I understand #12 & #18 are both slight unders but it is quite realistically what they'd get for them.

Their midfield bats so deep losing those 2 wouldn't even be that big a loss, besides they could draft the best mid in the draft with pick #2 to replenish their stocks and spread their age profile further.

Possibly - but I'm leaning towards the other hypothetical - I am expecting them to go after more well spread first round draft presence than chuck all in for one top pick this year.

Previously GWS had excess spots to play with and they could gamble easily by throwing away multiple picks to get to top end of draft. Another way to look at it - they could stack one additional KPP, one utility, one inside mid etc and keep hedging due to extra spots.

Now - they have 40 and if they delist 3 + trade 3-4, drafting "multiple players from first round" rather than "one player from top 3" would spread the list talent better. This is similar to GC going after 4/6/8/10 in last draft.

Hopper for first rounder this year and another club offering 2018 first rounder for kennedy will be a far more attractive deal for GWS.

 

[DopeMaster]

There was a bit more to that deal than just picking pies over tiges, list quality etc. id be looking at treloars missus and her current job eddie got her.

Didn't this just turn out to be an urban legend? Happy to stand corrected if you can point me to any sort of verification of course.