Review R14: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly vs. Hawthorn Hawks

[Milo Cyrus]

Selection gave the Hawks a sniff. "We took the butter knives to the gun fight".

Plan A was also wrong. Tunnel ball away. We didn't protect the ball or ball carrier and we didn't away ground football.
Our ball movement particularly that backwards hand balling shit from in tight was a fail in the conditions. It allowed the Hawks to stay onside, how could we not see this? And why do we persist with such a stupid tactic.
Failed to identify what the problem was or what the solution was. We couldn't spread the Hawks or didn't try to.

You had the perfect opportunity to bring in Dowling/Edwards and tell them to follow Weddle around.
But you decided to choke the forward line with a plodder.
We got slaughtered by Hawthorns rope-a-dope half back plan on the back of that.

We doubled down and subbed out the wrong guy.
Plan B was more of Plan A.

The Good:- Laird worked out after the first fail that hand balling backwards was dumb in the conditions.
The crowd was hostile and we have a chance to reflect on this. It was a grand final pressure crowd, recognize it and let's ****ing go.
The Bad:- Top two is gone.
The Ugly:- Top four door is closing.

Any chance we can sit the ball up to advantage at some point in these conditions?

 

[CrowBloke]

I didnt see it. But its not a surprise is it?

Yes and no.
Yes, because they should keep those conflicts behind closed doors.
No, because people are gonna disagree.

It looked like an angry exchange, but it might have been over post-game pizza toppings, who knows?

Nicks stubborness and refusal to change is going to rub people the wrong way.

It sure rubs me the wrong way .

The question is whether Adelaide will take notice of the coach inadequacies this time and realise we can do better.

The Board (who re-appointed Nicks) will take notice, they will realise they can do better
and
will then sack Davis to appoint someone who agrees more with Nicks.
Anything, but admit they were wrong.

P.S. let's face it, everything they've done since Nicks' 2-year extension has been to make that decision look like the right one. The question is not whether Nicks can "Coach us to play Finals".
With the talent we have brought in (Dawson, Rankine, Keays + ANB, Peatling, Cumming) + the list we now have + Burgess + Davis + Balme behind the scenes, the question is:
Is Nicks a good enough Head Coach to take this group to a Flag, taking into account his strengths and weaknesses?
I think not .

 

[FR0GGY]

How many shots at goal from frees did the Hawks have? Not saying some of them weren’t there but I just can’t ever remember a game where we get so many shots at goal from frees.

Either our defenders need to tighten up or the umps need to be more consistent.

Keane and butts hold just about every time, almost 50/50 for a free against every contest with them.

 

[Crow_Magnon]

wow...just watched the replay, how many easy snaps did we miss! FFS...that was the game...

 

[MRB37]

Early in the year we were getting separation and our forwards were keeping separate, as the year has gone on we are more and more kicking to packs and everyone is flying for the same mark.
Don’t get me started with ROB clogging up an already clogged forward line either.

Early in the year we would leave ROB outside 50 to guard the down the line kick and Tex would ruck inside 50.

Now over the last 4-5 weeks that we've seemingly changed our method inside 50 to try and do nothing but take contested marks it's meant we've pushed ROB inside 50 and Tex doesn't do any ruck work anymore. It's like they went "3 talls worked really well, so logically 4 would work even better!"

 

[1970crow]

Everyone seemed to think Davis was going to come in and fix everything.

Well at the moment he's a flop. Unless his role is to observe, do **** all, and let Nicks make the exact same mistakes as last year.

We're picking the same duds that we know aren't up to it. We're pre-planning subs. We're carrying seniors that are liabilities.

And a response of "Well Nicks probably isn't listening" doesn't pass the pub test. Guy took big dollars to move down here but the coach isn't listening to him and no higher ups are stepping in?

Nicks is still the senior coach and has the final say, it can’t be any other way. Davis, or anyone else, can suggest all they want, but Nicks makes the calls. Don’t forget we’ve still got that moron Adam Kelly running the footy dept and VB as midfield coach. Nicks isn’t the only crap operator in the group.

 

[Geoffa32]

Keane and butts hold just about every time, almost 50/50 for a free against every contest with them.

Agree with this

But.... Thilthorpe has his arm chopped, or held almost every contest as well.

Never gets those frees.

 

[CrowBloke]

Mitchell realised they had to up their pressure at the contest so he matched our extras around the ball. Spread a little more. Denied us space in F50. Our coaches had no counter.

At half-time I thought, OK, Mitchell is gonna roast his blokes for being second to the ball and being the recipients of pressure instead of creating it.
He'll also tell them that because of our wayward goalkicking they're lucky not to be 5 goals down in slippery conditions and that the Crows have left the door open --- 11 scoring shots to 6, but only 15 points down.
I expected Mitchell to make some changes (he put Watson in the middle and activated their sub) and for Hawthorn to come out breathing fire and waddaya know?
They goaled in the first 15 seconds of the third 1/4.
Game ON.
How did Nicks react? This:

It makes you wonder whether they ever sit down as a group and say "ok, if the oppo do this, we need to do this"

I doubt it. Nicks did sfa in the third when it was obvious the Hawks had come back out to play.

because we sure as hell look rattled every time an opponent doesnt allow us to play the way Nicks wants us to play.

I want a coach who plans to win, not plans to try not to lose.

This!
I don't want us to "play Finals". I want us to win them, at least THREE of them, in September.

 

[Redleg Crow]

Woke up. Angrier about it than after the game.

Just terrible. Selection was idiotic.

Murphy for Peatling. Wut???
Sub off Pedlar, who might not have got many touches but was cracking in hard, rather than Tex (or Murphy) who were clear liabilities, unable to score.

A few players did shit me.

Rachele in the second half did a lot of running around the contest.

Rankine was very poor. One super goal doesn’t make up for every fumble

Defensive structure in the last was shocking. Oh yeah, let’s leave Gunston on his own 20m from goal!!!

Fog is out of form.

TT often misses easy goals. That was not a great shock when he missed in the first quarter. It SHOULD be.

Thought Berry and Soligo were good.

Curtin was excellent in the first half, should have been moved to the forward line with Tex subbed off in the last. (But, see above)

Hinge was god awful… and dumb.

Thought Butts was mostly good.

Keane had his worst for a while

Cummings was good.

Christ how many posters???

The umpiring in the last quarter was beyond shite. This wasn’t 50:50s going the Hawks way; it was utterly favourable to them.

**** it. Dumb sport, should just be a cricket fan only… checks score ahhh ****!!!!

 

[AFCCroweater]

Agree with this

But.... Thilthorpe has his arm chopped, or held almost every contest as well.

Never gets those frees.

Totally agree, but umpires are less likely to pay Thilthorpes those out when we’re bombing it high and long to a congested pack of 10-12 players compared to a 1v1 where the umpires are looking for any excuse to insert themselves

 

[GreyCrow]

Now over the last 4-5 weeks that we've seemingly changed our method inside 50 to try and do nothing but take contested marks it's meant we've pushed ROB inside 50 and Tex doesn't do any ruck work anymore.

Have noticed this a lot . Have even commented in match threads etc

Very frustrating to see.

Tex reminds me of my last 6 months at work. Physically struggled but the mind was willing so all I did was hover around occasionally helping lift something or looking for the simple work - so I can understand his want to contribute but from the outside it looks poor

Great clubman but its time

 

[Mutineer]

Yep the SUN appears to have set on Tex I'm afraid and whilst the conditions didn't suit he was a dead set liability. The problem is FOG seems to be in an extended form slump in recent times which isn't helping. It's getting to the point that Burgess likely offers more than Tex sadly.

Pity Toby Murray went down because he may well have been an option at this point.

 

[Cromulant]

Yep the SUN appears to have set on Tex I'm afraid and whilst the conditions didn't suit he was a dead set liability. The problem is FOG seems to be in an extended form slump in recent times which isn't helping. It's getting to the point that Burgess likely offers more than Tex sadly.

Pity Toby Murray went down because he may well have been an option at this point.

We should just try a smaller setup for a few weeks.

Give Tex a few weeks off

 

[Brookster]

And I think that is where our problem is. We require the magic of a Dawson, Rankine or Rachele.

Coaching structure is not evident - Nicks doesn’t have a clue to solve it and it is why we again just lose a game.

Yep. Overly defensive. That’s all Nix has. In last 1/4 I couldn’t believe how we stood around the contests waiting for something to materialise while hawks got in and worked it. Our centre play is the same…positioning to negate, that’s all.
We looked devoid of structure. Certainly one that might have helped get a win.

 

[Redleg Crow]

On the bright side - no doubts about what Curtin will be. He’s got class.

 

[rocket18]

I wonder when our players have to take responsibility, or is it purely down to the coach ??

If only there was someone at the club that could hold players responsible.

 

[CrowBloke]

This club has never performed well away from home, even in years when we won premierships.

Yeah, but nah.
In 1998 after Melbourne flogged us, we won our next three games AWAY to win that Flag.

This loss, while disappointing, is not worth blowing a gasket over.

People are blowing a gasket because a win would have put a 2-game gap between us and the pack.

Tbh, I'd have conceded the Suns away game and this one, managing some players and blooding others, maybe pinching the AO game vs Geelong post-Suns in the process.
The loss is disappointing and was preventable in 3 ways:
--- not selecting Murphy whose opponent was BoG. Taylor or Draper could not have played worse than Murphy.
--- better goalkicking (on the players, on the day --- the Thilthorpe/RoB/Dawson misses were almost comically bad)
--- making some changes to counter Mitchell's moves after half-time (eg sub off Murphy, get Keays to neutralise Impey, get Tex out of the F50 to play high forward or even sub him out, open up the forward line, change our kick-out patterns ... anything, but not nothing).

Given our draw we'll probably still finish around 5th, which will be a big step up from last year

Yes, 5th would be a big step-up (remains to be seen) but it would probably result in the Club retaining Nicks who will not take us to a Flag.

and something to build on.

possibly, but only if Nicks was sacked.

 

[1970crow]

If only there was someone at the club that could hold players responsible.

Or some kind of mechanism or process. Just something where if you notice a player isn’t up to it you can choose a different player instead. Similar to a panel type interview where a group of knowledgeable people assess candidates to try and put the most powerful work group together.

 

[1970crow]

We should just try a smaller setup for a few weeks.

Give Tex a few weeks off

Not happening.

 

[OldCrowBloke]

... and Ncks is too dumb to move Keane off Gunston ...

..which was the unwritten part of my post!

 

[VKCrow]

We beat them in every stat except the most important score board. W could have really set us up nicely for the run home. There’s some teams we just can’t finish off

 

[SugarShane]

Yes and no.
Yes, because they should keep those conflicts behind closed doors.
No, because people are gonna disagree.

It looked like an angry exchange, but it might have been over post-game pizza toppings, who knows?

If they're having a disagreement mid game I'd rather it happen there than wait until they're "behind closed doors".

But yes, could've been anything. Nothing to say they were arguing against each other rather than mutually pissed off with what they were seeing.

"Why aren't these clowns executing what we told them?"

 

[CrowBloke]

I am surprised by the strong criticism of Nicks, I live in Adelaide and have a lot of friends for both clubs, and I am a big wrap for the Crows, I think they can contend. I like their game style, not dissimilar to Collingwood, it just takes time to perfect it.

What surpised me about your post is that the condescending smugness of the above is exceeded only by your failure to recognise it, as such.
The exalted Collingwood fan thinks we "can contend" (yeah?) because we're like Collingwood
but
not as good .

For me, the loss was simply not capitalising on a very dominant first half, I know it is a should have been moment, but if it was 50 points up at half time the game is over.

Your Maths is deficient.
If we'd kicked 11.0 instead of 4.7, the most we could have been up by is 39 points, not 50.
HINT: use your fingers.

I put it down to the conditions, it would have been very wet underfoot and slippery.

Yeah? None of us noticed that. Thanks.

Thilthorpe has no excuse 20 metres out straight in front however, you cannot miss those shots and expect to win games against good opposition.

So, what was it --- conditions, or poor execution? You want it both ways.
The conditions do not account for Thilthorpe's first shot at goal, nor O'Brien's panicked kick from 3m out to go ootf, nor Dawson hitting the post in the last.
ALL were poor execution.

I know the umpires got involved late, but the game should have been iced earlier.

Collingwood would have, right?
If only we had the time to perfect it, as Collingwood have (see above: "I like their game style, not dissimilar to Collingwood, it just takes time to perfect it") .

The game turned in the third quarter when Hawthorn upped the pressure, two dropped marks for 2 goals got them back into it. And then the last quarter was much the same, Crows dominant for much of the quarter early but couldn't score, and Hawthorn got free kicks to score. I wouldn't be worried, I think this team is a genuine top 4 team, a lot of learnings from this loss.

It's clear you're not worried. Collingwood are the team to beat.

Out of the contenders, only Geelong and the Crows are capable of beating us when it matters, time will tell.

By "the contenders" you mean the teams who will challenge Collingwood for the 2025 Flag, right?
So, not Hawthorn, who beat us-who-are-capable-of-beating-you?
Not Brisbane, who won last year?

I guess it is a costly loss in terms of top 4, would have been a 2 game break to 5th spot.

If only the Crows were as good as Collingwood, good enough to create that 2 game break... <<vomit>>

Keep the faith, it is a long season and a lot of footy to be played yet.

Likewise, right back atcha.
Please take your patronising analyses to your own Board who will appreciate your assumption that the Comp. has been reduced to who will play Collingwood for the Flag.

We'll worry about us, ok?

 

[SugarShane]

We should just try a smaller setup for a few weeks.

Give Tex a few weeks off

Almost seems like we've promised him 300 regardless of what happens. If that's the case, I'd much rather give him another year under the condition that we'll play him 5-6 times to get him there rather than continue to blow up this year.

We can carry him for a few games, not a whole season.

 

[Southerntakeover]

It deserves its own thread, but the biggest red flag that we currently have is that we've been unable to get our key forwards into the game for basically a month and a half. We're playing a tall structure, and generating basically no scores from them.