Autopsy Round 9: Hawks beat up on the Blues

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Rushed_Behind

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Feb 4, 2009
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TBH I'd rather a player that just took the marks. Again TOB had two marks and four kicks for the game. Yes he tries hard, but he's not good enough for a team with any kind of aspirations. Once Lewis is fit and ready with his body then he must come in and replace him.

Not including the game he got injured he's averaging <3 marks and <5 kicks a game.
until Lewis competes he stays out. That Melbourne game Lewis was pathetic. Worse than anything TOB has shown. But the usual haters will disagree.
 

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Hot Diggity

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Jun 19, 2020
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Thought Silk was important particularly in the second quarter when the game was still there to be won - a gentle reminder that he’s not quite ready to shuffle off into retirement.
Agreed, and I love Burgoyne. But the caveat here is we had a 38 year old being the major influence. That's a concern. He will retire one day!
 

OnTheRocks

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TazHawk15

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until Lewis competes he stays out. That Melbourne game Lewis was pathetic. Worse than anything TOB has shown. But the usual haters will disagree.
Absolutely spot on.

I find it funny that the TOB knockers continue with the “when Lewis gets his body right he must be selected before TOB” but the fact TOB was coming back from injury but at least showed Effort does not get mentioned.

The gap between TOB Effort and the Effort Lewis has put in so far this year is beyond measure.

TOB competes in the air but then at least follows up with effort, look at his effort in giving off to Impey to set up that goal and that tackle that also led to his goal.

Sure he dropped a sitter at the end of the 2nd quarter but at least he did not drop his bundle, something that Lewis could take on board.
 

Brishawk

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Jan 17, 2008
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View attachment 925123

Open your f*cking eyes Tim
Now let’s add some context. O’Brien works weitering off the ball and weitering gets a hand to the ball which causes it to deflect high. The ball spills towards goal and Gunston is able to kick a goal. The goal is possible because of O’Brien. But yeah, why not grab a screen shot and post it out of context to try an make a fringe player look bad? 🤷‍♂️
 

OnTheRocks

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Mercy Seat

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You wouldn't like a definite answer to that?
I'm certain Scully, Stratton and Frawley won't get better and won't be part of our next premiership team. I'd rather give those younger boys a chance to prove they suck rather than just assume they do.
Mate, coming into the seniors doesn’t finally give a chance to prove anything. Some of these guys have been at the club for 3 years and they haven’t forced their way into the team for a reason. It’s what they do around the club, on the track, and in the 2s. Not to mention all the data that every player has spit out about them each and every week. The club knows exactly where these players are at and if they are going to make it. Sure there’s maybe the very occasional player who makes a giant leap when they are in the big league but the reality is, 10-20% of who we draft makes it as a regular AFL contributor. Id see where we are in 3-4 weeks before making a call on the year. If we are still a chance for finals then these sort of calls are ridiculous.
 

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Blackhawk42

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Mate, coming into the seniors doesn’t finally give a chance to prove anything. Some of these guys have been at the club for 3 years and they haven’t forced their way into the team for a reason. It’s what they do around the club, on the track, and in the 2s. Not to mention all the data that every player has spit out about them each and every week. The club knows exactly where these players are at and if they are going to make it. Sure there’s maybe the very occasional player who makes a giant leap when they are in the big league but the reality is, 10-20% of who we draft makes it as a regular AFL contributor. Id see where we are in 3-4 weeks before making a call on the year. If we are still a chance for finals then these sort of calls are ridiculous.
They are doing it though. Have you seen the stats Jones and Moore in particular have been putting up in the scratch matches? Jones earnt his debut, played well, then was told he was only dropped for positional reasons but then not played again. Moore won a VFL player of the finals series as an 18 year old, played 7 games in his second season and is now fit after some pre-season injury set backs. I'm most bullish about the prospects of these two and it frustrates me that they aren't getting a decent run.

There is time for Finn and Walker. One is x-factor and those players always take longer. The other is a highly regarded father-son.
 

Mercy Seat

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They are doing it though. Have you seen the stats Jones and Moore in particular have been putting up in the scratch matches? Jones earnt his debut, played well, then was told he was only dropped for positional reasons but then not played again. Moore won a VFL player of the finals series as an 18 year old, played 7 games in his second season and is now fit after some pre-season injury set backs. I'm most bullish about the prospects of these two and it frustrates me that they aren't getting a decent run.

There is time for Finn and Walker. One is x-factor and those players always take longer. The other is a highly regarded father-son.
I’ll give you those guys, but it has to be positional. You can’t sub Frawley and Stratts for Walker and Finn. Scully is the most obvious one to make way, of which I guess any of those 4 could come in, however, I can’t see that happening if the club still thinks we can make finals.
 

PenAndPaperJosh

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They are doing it though. Have you seen the stats Jones and Moore in particular have been putting up in the scratch matches? Jones earnt his debut, played well, then was told he was only dropped for positional reasons but then not played again. Moore won a VFL player of the finals series as an 18 year old, played 7 games in his second season and is now fit after some pre-season injury set backs. I'm most bullish about the prospects of these two and it frustrates me that they aren't getting a decent run.

There is time for Finn and Walker. One is x-factor and those players always take longer. The other is a highly regarded father-son.
Tbf X factor players generally show their ability immediately
 

Blackhawk42

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I’ll give you those guys, but it has to be positional. You can’t sub Frawley and Stratts for Walker and Finn. Scully is the most obvious one to make way, of which I guess any of those 4 could come in, however, I can’t see that happening if the club still thinks we can make finals.
That is sort of my point here. Even if we can sneak into finals we aren't a genuine premiership contender. And this list won't suddenly be better next year because that growth from beneath isn't coming through like a Brisbane, Port Adelaide, St.Kilda or Gold Coast.

I agree 100% about positional needs though. I wouldn't be making those immediate swaps. However, you realistically could play Big Boy down back again, remove Frawley, Stratton and Scully and then bring in Jones, Moore and CJ. I was calling for that two weeks ago before CJ was upgraded but now we are back on the winners list i'm not convinced that my wishes are realistic anymore.
 

lethalselbow

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"Worst possible result for the Hawks future" according to Kane "the list Sam Mitchell inherits will be worse as a result"
He really needs to qualify the comment with what Clarko does for the rest of the season and the trade period. If Clarkson continues to play the older brigade and doesn't blood kids, then Cornes is right. It's up to Hawthorn to get games into kids and start to shift out the older players.

If the side is winning and younger players are coming in, it's the best thing.
 

Mercy Seat

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That is sort of my point here. Even if we can sneak into finals we aren't a genuine premiership contender. And this list won't suddenly be better next year because that growth from beneath isn't coming through like a Brisbane, Port Adelaide, St.Kilda or Gold Coast.

I agree 100% about positional needs though. I wouldn't be making those immediate swaps. However, you realistically could play Big Boy down back again, remove Frawley, Stratton and Scully and then bring in Jones, Moore and CJ. I was calling for that two weeks ago before CJ was upgraded but now we are back on the winners list i'm not convinced that my wishes are realistic anymore.
I guess this is where we differ. Or at least the club does. I think Clarko genuinely believes we can pinch it, still. And to be honest, don’t blame him. This is a crazy year. Who knows we may have another 8 week break in the middle of this that changes everything. Our form was awful, but so was west coasts a few weeks ago and now they are flag favs. I’m not saying we can or will win, but I think we should wait until we are genuinely out of it until pulling those triggers.
 

Freshmeat

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Jul 21, 2013
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What do people think of Breust as Captain? He's a quiet unassuming type, but he speaks really well and has some of the best footy smarts in the team.

Everyone talks of Gunners, Mitchell, O'Meara but I reckon Breust would go alright.
I wouldn’t want to add the pressure of being captain on him. I could see it affect his game as it’s done with Ben Stratton. A smaller role in the leadership group is where I see him.
 

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