The 2017 Rolling All-Australian Thread

[Forward Press]

What about Supercoach? It's been around much longer and is far superior.

Player ratings use too broad a rolling average. Danger is only top due to last year, Oliver only misses out due to last year.

Supercoach has them both in the top 10 for this season.

Supercoach has a maximum of 3300 for all players in a game (or some figure like that). It also gives heavy weighting to kicking clutch goals at the end, disposal effiency etc which is obviously important but perhaps not as much as SC rates it to be.

AFL Player Ratings is better (if you stick to the 2017 scores) but again the best way is to actually watch the game - hard to do though when there are 9 per round and some are on at the same time.

 

[Scotland]

Robbo reckons Michael Walters should be thereabouts.

Has been excellent the last couple of games but I don't see it. 18 touches and a goal a game doesn't get you in as a mid or a forward.

 

[WCEbrody]

Yeo,McGovern,Kennedy in the mix. Shuey was before the bulldogs game but has spent a heap of time forward and not looked near it the last 2 weeks, suspect he's carrying something.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

50 disposals and couldn't even top the coaches votes. Nope.

But one of those coaches was buckley

 

[Apex36]

But one of those coaches was buckley

Buckley is not adverse to awarding opposition players full points. Keep telling yourself it's all his fault that Mitchell only got 5 votes though.

PS. Pendles got the full 10, so obviously Clarko didn't have him best on ground either.

 

[V9x18]

But one of those coaches was buckley

Dumb comment. Neither coach gave him 5

 

[Halftimehero]

But one of those coaches was buckley

And the other was Clarkson, who also didn't get him 5

 

[Damon_3388]

Robbo reckons Michael Walters should be thereabouts.

Has been excellent the last couple of games but I don't see it. 18 touches and a goal a game doesn't get you in as a mid or a forward.

He's been BOG or close to it in each of Freo's last three games, playing through the midfield. Would have to maintain this form to be in with a shot though you'd think.

Will be interesting to see what happens with Walters when Stephen Hill returns from injury, as Hill's absence is what has opened the door to Sonny getting this time in the middle.

 

[Scotland]

19 coaches votes in the last two games, 5 in the 7 before that IIRC. Really shouldn't be near the 40 at this point.

BigFooty will always BigFooty but it'd be nice if the media didn't follow suit. I'm glad Jason Dunstall shot down some of the Joe Daniher hype. If you switched his performances from rounds 8 & 9 with rounds 1 & 2 no one would be talking about him, but people like Robbo have one week memories at best. Which is why if we roll GWS this week we'll be back in flag contention again.

 

[Bender571]

They aren't perfect but they certainly aren't 'garbage'. They are, by some distance, the most comprehensive measure of a players impact on the outcome of a game.

They shouldn't be the only way we judge players but the quality of discussion certainly isn't helped by ignoring them. Advanced statistics have been embraced globally, particularly in US sports, and it would do no harm for fans of Australian Rules to embrace something more sophisticated than disposal efficiency.

More importantly they don't care at all about reputations or hype and simply measure what happens on the field.

They're massively flawed. A good example was the Freo v Essendon game in round 7. Brand Hill had 37 disposals, 874 meters gained and 10 coaches votes. The player ratings had him the 6th worst on ground, in other words it thought 38 players were better. I don't think a ratings system can be that different from the most important opinions and still retain credibility.

I'd also argue that they don't care about reputations. They are still recorded by people prone to bias, which can come into play with a lot of the more subjective stats. This article talks about that well.

 

[Skipper_]

They're massively flawed. A good example was the Freo v Essendon game in round 7. Brand Hill had 37 disposals, 874 meters gained and 10 coaches votes. The player ratings had him the 6th worst on ground, in other words it thought 38 players were better. I don't think a ratings system can be that different from the most important opinions and still retain credibility.

I'd also argue that they don't care about reputations. They are still recorded by people prone to bias, which can come into play with a lot of the more subjective stats. This article talks about that well.

Ha ha that is pathetic. I can still remember Hill tearing us a new one that day.

 

[Donakebab]

19 coaches votes in the last two games, 5 in the 7 before that IIRC. Really shouldn't be near the 40 at this point.

BigFooty will always BigFooty but it'd be nice if the media didn't follow suit. I'm glad Jason Dunstall shot down some of the Joe Daniher hype. If you switched his performances from rounds 8 & 9 with rounds 1 & 2 no one would be talking about him, but people like Robbo have one week memories at best. Which is why if we roll GWS this week we'll be back in flag contention again.

Walters has 19 votes for the year in total, all of which have come in the past two weeks.

Switch Daniher's rounds 8 & 9 with 1 & 2 (where he still kicked 3 & 3.3) and he's still be leading all forwards and key position players in the coaches votes. If anything there would be more talk surrounding him as he would have been leading the award for a few weeks.

 

[Halftimehero]

19 coaches votes in the last two games, 5 in the 7 before that IIRC. Really shouldn't be near the 40 at this point.

BigFooty will always BigFooty but it'd be nice if the media didn't follow suit. I'm glad Jason Dunstall shot down some of the Joe Daniher hype. If you switched his performances from rounds 8 & 9 with rounds 1 & 2 no one would be talking about him, but people like Robbo have one week memories at best. Which is why if we roll GWS this week we'll be back in flag contention again.

Would that be rounds 1 and 2 where he kicked 3 goals in each game?

 

[andrewb]

19 coaches votes in the last two games, 5 in the 7 before that IIRC. Really shouldn't be near the 40 at this point.

BigFooty will always BigFooty but it'd be nice if the media didn't follow suit. I'm glad Jason Dunstall shot down some of the Joe Daniher hype. If you switched his performances from rounds 8 & 9 with rounds 1 & 2 no one would be talking about him, but people like Robbo have one week memories at best. Which is why if we roll GWS this week we'll be back in flag contention again.

Daniher is one of three key forwards that are probably in contention- Cameron and Kennedy being the others. He might be equal on goals with some others but the difference is that he's been clear BoG in several games and has stepped up in the key moments. Outside of the Melbourne game he has been solid in all his others as well.

Coaches votes tell the story.

 

[Righteo]

Robbo reckons Michael Walters should be thereabouts.

Has been excellent the last couple of games but I don't see it. 18 touches and a goal a game doesn't get you in as a mid or a forward.

I love Sonny but yeah, that's pretty silly. Even if he continued this form for the rest of the year I'm sure the opening 5-6 games will kill his chances.

 

[The Joker]

I love Sonny but yeah, that's pretty silly. Even if he continued this form for the rest of the year I'm sure the opening 5-6 games will kill his chances.

Sorry but if he averages 30 possessions and 1 goal a game like he has over the past 3 weeks he will be the first player selected!

ATM, Robbo is drunk for suggesting Sonny is in the team!

 

[Bollox]

Has Robbie Gray's season so far been AA worthy ?

 

[Damon_3388]

Has Robbie Gray's season so far been AA worthy ?

Has a string chance to make it as a genuine forward this year. Is on pace to register 55 goals and 30 goal assists, which is truly elite by anyone's standards.

By comparison, Eddie Betts is on pace for 68 goals/17 assists, and Toby Greene is on pace for 60 goals/16 assists.

I would say that trio should be the leading contenders for the non-key forward spots, followed by Daniel Mendel, Brandon Matera, Orazio Fantasia and Jeff Garlett, in no particular order.

 

[The Joker]

Has Robbie Gray's season so far been AA worthy ?

3 cracking games, 1 injury assisted shocker, 1 poor effort and 3 'ok' games. Personally i dont think so!

 

[The Joker]

Has a string chance to make it as a genuine forward this year. Is on pace to register 55 goals and 30 goal assists, which is truly elite by anyone's standards.

It depends how many times they play Fremantle, Carlton and Brisbane. If Port get lucky and play them 3 times each this season he is a certainly...

 

[blitzer]

Its an interesting season for All Australian. I honestly don't reckon there's a single player that hasn't put in a few ordinary performances so far this year - not necessarily bad but certainly not AA level or close.

A good example is Sloane - the guy was absolutely dominating and he was (and may yet still be) heading for a brownlow and then suddenly he plays 2 very ordinary games where he gets tagged and doesn't handle it well.

This suggests to me that it will likely be the guys that really put it together after the bye that will get the honours. There's always a bit of recency bias and I think that will exemplified by the inconsistent performances this year. Even guys that rarely ever put in a bad game like Dangerfield, Selwood and Pendlebury have put in a few ordinary ones.

 

[Damon_3388]

I know people were probably "bored" of Ablett years ago, and there's a perception that he had a poor start to the year (which consisted of one average game in Round 2, completely offset by one of his best ever games in Round 6), but the fact that he leads the league in inside 50s, and leads all midfielders in score involvements, while also being top 5 in clearances and top 10 in effective disposals, indicates that he's still one of the best attacking/playmaking weapons in the league.

 

[Forward Press]

I know people were probably "bored" of Ablett years ago, and there's a perception that he had a poor start to the year (which consisted of one average game in Round 2, completely offset by one of his best ever games in Round 6), but the fact that he leads the league in inside 50s, and leads all midfielders in score assists, while also being top 5 in clearances and top 10 in effective disposals, indicates that he's still one of the best attacking/playmaking weapons in the league.

He's still an absolute freak and should be in everyone's rolling AA squad. I'm secretly hoping he gets 10 AA jumpers before he retires.

 

[Halorad]

Has Robbie Gray's season so far been AA worthy ?

He's a strange one. 3 outstanding games in 83,89 and 90 point beltings and 5 others that have been below rather mediocre

Is in the mix for another small forward spot beside Betts, Right now though i'd be giving that spot to a more consistent contributor like Greene or Fantasia, as they have been real factors in 5 games each. Robbie just the 3.

But if he ends up kicking 50 goals, like he is on track to, i have no doubt that he'll find a spot on the team somewhere.

 

[Donakebab]

He's still an absolute freak and should be in everyone's rolling AA squad. I'm secretly hoping he gets 10 AA jumpers before he retires.

another Brownlow would be fitting too.