The big 4 clubs and the AFL's future

Kwality

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 14, 2011
17,879
5,853
Tootgarook
AFL Club
West Coast
Are you actually serious?

The AFL is having one of it's best seasons and none of the"Big 4 are having healthy years nor are they achieving much. Hawthorn are pulling crowds to make even Collingwood jealous these days.

The AFL does not need the so-called "Big Four" to be healthy and the competition is doing fine without them dominating. Look at the EPL - would you say that competition is unhealthy because Leicester won the title and Manchester City didn't?
The dynamics of the State based comp days is SO irrelevant to the reality of the national comp.
 

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bombersfan4000

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 30, 2014
10,170
5,394
AFL Club
Essendon
Are you actually serious?

The AFL is having one of it's best seasons and none of the"Big 4 are having healthy years nor are they achieving much. Hawthorn are pulling crowds to make even Collingwood jealous these days.

The AFL does not need the so-called "Big Four" to be healthy and the competition is doing fine without them dominating. Look at the EPL - would you say that competition is unhealthy because Leicester won the title and Manchester City didn't?
hawthorns case dont you think that 4 grand finals in a row helps that as success will always attract more support. look at the swans, crowds and membership are better than ever, the telling time is when the success stops & years later on how the crowds stack up
 

MarkT2

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 3, 2009
9,758
3,816
Melb
AFL Club
Collingwood
Carlton didnt breach the salary cap in 1995 so what is your point?
Of course you can provide some proof of this and when you cant you can retract that post.
Yes they did. They did every year in that period. Contracts didn't evaporate and materialise in a year.
 

Gigantor

Brownlow Medallist
May 13, 2012
14,575
4,673
AFL Club
GWS
Other Teams
Brumbies, Socceroos
That the AFL can have such a good season with the old big four Melbourne clubs in the bottom third augurs will for the comp.

Obviously that situation won't last, it will get mixed up again - about ten years ago people were writing about the death of Victorian footy after three consecutive premierships with no Victorian team in it.

It's worth reminding ourselves that the biggest drawing round in the history of the comp (which stood for some 17 years), occurred in the final round of 1998 when Carlton, Richmond and Collingwood were out of the 8, and Essendon may have snuck into the 8. The highest drawing game that round was North vs Footscray.

We actually want to see more of that - we want all the clubs being able to draw big crowds in a good year - we don't want to have to rely on a handful of clubs.
 

Dadadadaaaaaa

Cancelled
Aug 24, 2016
792
835
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Melbourne Victory
Are you actually serious?

The AFL is having one of it's best seasons and none of the"Big 4 are having healthy years nor are they achieving much. Hawthorn are pulling crowds to make even Collingwood jealous these days.

The AFL does not need the so-called "Big Four" to be healthy and the competition is doing fine without them dominating. Look at the EPL - would you say that competition is unhealthy because Leicester won the title and Manchester City didn't?
Actually here was an article in the age last week, is it just a coincidence or is the weather too cold?


http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-2016-membership-up-but-crowds-down-20160825-gr1b52.html
 

Keyza

Premiership Player
Sep 12, 2009
4,060
4,060
Melbourne
AFL Club
Carlton
Yes they did. They did every year in that period. Contracts didn't evaporate and materialise in a year.[
Yes they did. They did every year in that period. Contracts didn't evaporate and materialise in a year.
No, There was no breach in 1995 that they were penalized for. The breaches were for under the table payments (something that most clubs did but didnt get caught). No such payments happened in 1995. A poster suggested that Carlton shouldnt be allowed to keep the flag that year and my response was why when they were not punished for anything that year and not just on an assumption that they must have cheated.
 

Dadadadaaaaaa

Cancelled
Aug 24, 2016
792
835
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Melbourne Victory
Are you actually serious?
Look at the EPL - would you say that competition is unhealthy because Leicester won the title and Manchester City didn't?
I will also add that EPL is different because soccer is so big in England most club are able to attract big crowds to matches no matter where the club is placed on the ladder (unless Sunderland or Aston Villa etc), so when Leicester won the title it's not like the crowds were any worse. In AFL (as the article in the previous post stat's), when the historically big clubs are near the bottom, the fans of those clubs drop off and the whole competition suffers because years ago when it was just 4-5 dominate clubs dominating people were bought up to support those teams, do you get my point?
Also the historical big 4 clubs in the EPL are Manchester United, Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea. Not Man City, they have just been very successful in the last 5 or so years.
 

carnthedons

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 12, 2006
8,313
12,484
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
No, There was no breach in 1995 that they were penalized for. The breaches were for under the table payments (something that most clubs did but didnt get caught). No such payments happened in 1995. A poster suggested that Carlton shouldnt be allowed to keep the flag that year and my response was why when they were not punished for anything that year and not just on an assumption that they must have cheated.
Don't bother with the everyone was doing it line, doesn't work with drugs, why should it work with salary cap rorting
 

Heardy_101

Premiership Player
Nov 20, 2011
4,605
3,416
Redhill
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Other Teams
Portsmouth
I will also add that EPL is different because soccer is so big in England most club are able to attract big crowds to matches no matter where the club is placed on the ladder (unless Sunderland or Aston Villa etc), so when Leicester won the title it's not like the crowds were any worse. In AFL (as the article in the previous post stat's), when the historically big clubs are near the bottom, the fans of those clubs drop off and the whole competition suffers because years ago when it was just 4-5 dominate clubs dominating people were bought up to support those teams, do you get my point?
Also the historical big 4 clubs in the EPL are Manchester United, Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea. Not Man City, they have just been very successful in the last 5 or so years.
The crowds dropped for those clubs. To say the whole comp suffered as a result is a lie.
 

Rezza Tiger

Club Legend
Jun 16, 2015
2,042
5,838
Reservoir
AFL Club
Richmond
Other Teams
Collingwood
That the AFL can have such a good season with the old big four Melbourne clubs in the bottom third augurs will for the comp.

Obviously that situation won't last, it will get mixed up again - about ten years ago people were writing about the death of Victorian footy after three consecutive premierships with no Victorian team in it.

It's worth reminding ourselves that the biggest drawing round in the history of the comp (which stood for some 17 years), occurred in the final round of 1998 when Carlton, Richmond and Collingwood were out of the 8, and Essendon may have snuck into the 8. The highest drawing game that round was North vs Footscray.

We actually want to see more of that - we want all the clubs being able to draw big crowds in a good year - we don't want to have to rely on a handful of clubs.
Wrong. Richmond v Melbourne with 76K was the highest drawing game that round. North v Bulldogs was 1v2 final round - that size crowd will never happen again for that matchup even if the same circumstances arise.

upload_2016-8-31_10-33-38.png
 

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Gigantor

Brownlow Medallist
May 13, 2012
14,575
4,673
AFL Club
GWS
Other Teams
Brumbies, Socceroos
^ I stand corrected.

That's an amzazing crowd for those two teams
 
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