"The Great Resignation"

[Poetic Justice]

now you're just taking the piss

Yeah, a bit.

I'd want to take the piss out of people that think that every job should be highly rewarding and satisfying. If that's out of touch, so be it I guess.. boomer is me

That's how it comes across from some..

 

[Brad Goodman]

Yeah but isnt working from home a bit lonely?

My ideal job would involve zero human contact. If I spoke to nobody else except my wife and baby for the the rest of my life I’d cope just fine.

 

[burge13]

Yeah but isnt working from home a bit lonely?

Social life outside of work makes up for this.

WFH full time would be perfect. No commute, sport on tv or music in background, more flexible hours (unwritten but its working), no pointless meetings (of which there are many in my office). Its bliss at home atm!! Wfh arrangements revisited Jan 28th, hope it continues

 

[Brad Goodman]

Social life outside of work makes up for this.

WFH full time would be perfect. No commute, sport on tv or music in background, more flexible hours (unwritten but its working), no pointless meetings (of which there are many in my office). Its bliss at home atm!! Wfh arrangements revisited Jan 28th, hope it continues

I wish WFH meant less pointless meetings for me. Not unusual for me to spend half a day on Zoom and achieve nothing, whereas if those meetings were taking place in person they’d take half the time.

 

[burge13]

I wish WFH meant less pointless meetings for me. Not unusual for me to spend half a day on Zoom and achieve nothing, whereas if those meetings were taking place in person they’d take half the time.

Dont get me wrong, these pointless meetings are still happening. Its just easier to skip them when no one is walking by your desk reminding you to join...

I gave up pointless meetings years ago. If nothing concrete is going to come out of it, i dont go.

 

[Scotland]

this is a bit of a nonsense comparison because no casual gets nice neat fulltime-equivalent hours

aside from this you are also ignoring that casual employees:

• don't have a protected notice period for changes to their roster
• don't have protected hours
• don't have protected time off
• don't have roster patterns
• don't get leave loading
• don't get the deferred tax benefit of holding unpaid entitlements
• have a less favourable calculation of penalty rates
• have a less favourable calculation of overtime loading
• aren't entitled to a paid notice period
• aren't entitled to redundancy pay
• don't accrue service time towards LSL

all of which have a significant direct or indirect monetary value which don't even go close to being met by the ~3.5% difference in your calculation above

this is underlined by the fact that the major touted employee benefit to casual employment ('flexibility') does not meaningfully work in their favour in any industry with significant casualisation. You knock back shifts, your hours get cut.

OK, that settles that then.

I may as well just respond with 'no low paid casual worker ever gets exploited'.

I'm under no illusions that a casualised workforce is the best thing for all concerned, but I don't know why people want to pretend that some actually prefer casual work.

 

[Caesar]

OK, that settles that then.

I may as well just respond with 'no low paid casual worker ever gets exploited'.

I'm under no illusions that a casualised workforce is the best thing for all concerned, but I don't know why people want to pretend that some actually prefer casual work.

Stop being obtuse

casual work is fine for uni students who want a dead-end job, or certain categories of high-demand/high-value workers who don’t want to commit to minimum hours (e.g. nurses)

For everyone else it generally sucks and is mostly used as a form of structural wage suppression by industries who employ workers with poor bargaining power in shitty roster patterns (e.g. hospitality and retail) to ream them on penalties/OT/other benefits

If your only takeaway from that is ‘some people like casual work and some don’t’ then think a little deeper

 

[Gralin]

people seem to equate contracting with casual work as well if we're getting 100k+ examples

 

[craigos]

Those who are upset about having to return to the office, have you gone to your employer and asked for a change in your contract?

I have some people on the lower end of the pay scale who are expecting to be treated the same as senior management. Unfortunately that's not the real world.

 

[Caesar]

Those who are upset about having to return to the office, have you gone to your employer and asked for a change in your contract?

I have some people on the lower end of the pay scale who are expecting to be treated the same as senior management. Unfortunately that's not the real world.

I butted heads with my old boss for about six months in 2020 about WFH, realistically it was a symptom of a work environment that was fairly uninspiring and backwards-looking on a number of levels

I feel like flexible working is now the default for desk jobs, if I have to fight over something so basic then it's a bit of a red flag

Good managers trust their reports to know the best way to get their job done, and focus on clearing blockers

 

[Jimmy_the_Gent]

Found this great Twitter thread that touches on some things being talked about here. It's mainly just a super interesting read.



If you can't access the thread, this should also be it "rolled up" - https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1481797871389351936.html

 

[burge13]

Found this great Twitter thread that touches on some things being talked about here. It's mainly just a super interesting read.



If you can't access the thread, this should also be it "rolled up" - https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1481797871389351936.html

Gee "big tech" sounds an awful industry to work in. What a bunch of twats involved

Im a huge advocate for WFH but I guess when you actually have a social life its easy. People who need work for friends and interaction would really struggle. If thats the case, join a club/team/something. Isnt hard

Spot on regarding weak people wanting misery around them too. Thats true in all walks, not the least covid. If youre not as scared as the eternally fearful you're somehow a granny killer. Humanity is cooked atm but no idea how we get out of it...

 

[Gralin]

Found this great Twitter thread that touches on some things being talked about here. It's mainly just a super interesting read.



If you can't access the thread, this should also be it "rolled up" - https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1481797871389351936.html

Jesus Christ what a w***er

Everyone had layoffs in tech over the last two years

It wasn't a rock solid no stress place to work, it never is

 

[Gralin]

Lol this dude is of the charts cooked

 

[edgie]

Gee "big tech" sounds an awful industry to work in. What a bunch of twats involved

Im a huge advocate for WFH but I guess when you actually have a social life its easy. People who need work for friends and interaction would really struggle. If thats the case, join a club/team/something. Isnt hard

Spot on regarding weak people wanting misery around them too. Thats true in all walks, not the least covid. If youre not as scared as the eternally fearful you're somehow a granny killer. Humanity is cooked atm but no idea how we get out of it...

For some people joining stuff like that is actually hard. Not everyone likes sports.

Work is a default social club for many.

Sent from my Nokia 7.2 using Tapatalk

 

[Caesar]

Found this great Twitter thread that touches on some things being talked about here. It's mainly just a super interesting read.



If you can't access the thread, this should also be it "rolled up" - https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1481797871389351936.html

Seems like mostly nonsense with a healthy dose of a political agenda

 

[Nuggs Bunny]

Yeah, a bit.

I'd want to take the piss out of people that think that every job should be highly rewarding and satisfying. If that's out of touch, so be it I guess.. boomer is me

That's how it comes across from some..

Yeah, this doesn't make sense at all. If you're not working in a job that's highly rewarding and satisfying and somebody offers you a job that is highly rewarding and satisfying, why wouldn't you accept it and more importantly why would you begrudge anybody for doing it either?

I can't fathom how people can be miserable for years in a shitty job they hate for being underpaid and overworked in in the hope that they might be promoted to a position that's probably still underpaid and will see them being just as overworked as before. Do you actually build character from being taken advantage of like that?

 

[Poetic Justice]

Yeah, this doesn't make sense at all. If you're not working in a job that's highly rewarding and satisfying and somebody offers you a job that is highly rewarding and satisfying, why wouldn't you accept it and more importantly why would you begrudge anybody for doing it either?

I can't fathom how people can be miserable for years in a shitty job they hate for being underpaid and overworked in in the hope that they might be promoted to a position that's probably still underpaid and will see them being just as overworked as before. Do you actually build character from being taken advantage of like that?

I didn't imply they shouldn't take a better offer, of course someone should

There's also the concept of the grass being greener though to consider..

I see your point that people should not settle for something that doesn't make them feel good and happy but is that legitimately possible for every person out there?

 

[Nuggs Bunny]

I didn't imply they shouldn't take a better offer, of course someone should

There's also the concept of the grass being greener though to consider..

I see your point that people should not settle for something that doesn't make them feel good and happy but is that legitimately possible for every person out there?

There should be a balance of course, I think anyone weighing up whether to change jobs should seriously consider whether the reasons they want to change places are specific to their workplace or generic to the industry or just an inherent part of working in general. I think people who change jobs frequently and only last a year or so at each place do not do themselves any favours when being considered for promotions etc. But I've worked with and known too many people that were just totally miserable at work to the point where they became insufferable to be around both inside and outside of working hours. If your job is that bad that it's starting to bring your whole life down, I would think the right thing to do is take control of the situation yourself and find a solution; maybe that entails getting a new job.

 

[Scotland]

Stop being obtuse

casual work is fine for uni students who want a dead-end job, or certain categories of high-demand/high-value workers who don’t want to commit to minimum hours (e.g. nurses)

For everyone else it generally sucks and is mostly used as a form of structural wage suppression by industries who employ workers with poor bargaining power in shitty roster patterns (e.g. hospitality and retail) to ream them on penalties/OT/other benefits

If your only takeaway from that is ‘some people like casual work and some don’t’ then think a little deeper

It's hard to respond too deeply when you frame the discussion by discounting any scenarios where casual work is beneficial.

'Casual work sucks for casual workers who want to be full time and aren't'. Yep, no argument there.

If you view casual work only through a lens of it being a tool of bosses vs workers warfare then nothing I say is going to change your mind so I'll leave you be.

 

[Scotland]

Those who are upset about having to return to the office, have you gone to your employer and asked for a change in your contract?

I have some people on the lower end of the pay scale who are expecting to be treated the same as senior management. Unfortunately that's not the real world.

I have plenty of freedom when it comes to WFH (even though I am not a huge fan) but haven't looked at my contract for a while. My main place of work or whatever the wording is is the office address. It's a funny one because if a company argues 'the office is here, you don't get to decide to WFH because it suits you' the counter argument is that most employees never asked to WFH in the first place and had it thrust upon them due to covid.

I work closely with 5 or 10 people and then less closely with another 20 or so. If everyone worked from home all the time it would be a logistical pain in the nuts.

 

[Caesar]

It's hard to respond too deeply when you frame the discussion by discounting any scenarios where casual work is beneficial.

'Casual work sucks for casual workers who want to be full time and aren't'. Yep, no argument there.

you are prosecuting an irrelevant point

people who have the power to benefit from casual work are a tiny minority of casual workers (or spend a relatively short period of time in the casual workforce), and largely aren't the people that laws around casualisation need to protect

If you view casual work only through a lens of it being a tool of bosses vs workers warfare then nothing I say is going to change your mind so I'll leave you be.

if you don't understand that this is how it is generally used then you are either ignorant or disingenuous

 

[Kram]

It's hard to respond too deeply when you frame the discussion by discounting any scenarios where casual work is beneficial.

'Casual work sucks for casual workers who want to be full time and aren't'. Yep, no argument there.

If you view casual work only through a lens of it being a tool of bosses vs workers warfare then nothing I say is going to change your mind so I'll leave you be.

Can't half tell you want to be Coles CEO mate!

 

[Scotland]

Can't half tell you want to be Coles CEO mate!

Not with all those CBAs m8.

 

[Marcel Proust]

New York restaurants have bugger all staff apparently