The off topic thread 4.0

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bok_party

Norm Smith Medallist
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Except Perth is a good example of not needing to lock down an entire state, and Sydney a case study in not even having to lock down an entire city. The argument "better safe than sorry" can be used until people are blue in the face but there's clearly got to be a risk threshold that is met. Otherwise no one should be allowed to drive faster than 20km/h in the name of being better safe than sorry.
Yeah I’m happy for them to do so. Sure it still only resulted in one case but it could have been far worse if it hadn’t had been and people would be complaining we didn’t lock down. I agree it’s not a long term strategy but we’ve basically been living a normal life here in WA. 5 days is nothing.
 

bok_party

Norm Smith Medallist
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Is there an argument to shut down all personal use of motor vehicles? You would definitely stop all loss of life in vehicular accidents. Better safe than sorry.
This is completely different. This is whataboutism to justify your reasoning.
 

Zidane98

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They travelled on the Sunday and it was announced on the what Thursday? So 4 days out in the public. They were told to produce a negative test before they could stop self-isolating. If they had have produced a positive test then it becomes a problem who they have interacted with and contact tracing would begin and either a snap lockdown happens if they've been in many places or if they haven't they contain it.
So they could have been positive in that timeframe before they returned a positive result. In that timeframe there weren't any restrictions on travelling interstate. People could have driven interstate, then passed it onto someone else interstate. They could have then also spread it to another state travelling on planes etc.


Yet there were no snap lockdowns anywhere else.
 

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Zidane98

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This is completely different. This is whataboutism to justify your reasoning.
The only whatboutisms I am seeing here are the claims but what if the virus did spread when a) it hasn't and b) there is no evidence that it was or is.

And this isn't whataboutism. You would stop 100% of vehicular fatalities if you shut down use of motor vehicles completely. That's never going to happen though for obvious reasons.

Consequently there never should be a stage 4 lockdown even considered unless you have direct evidence of mystery community virus transmission.


That alone should be the only reason to drive lockdowns in the future to save false alarms like the one we have just had.
 

jd2010

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So they could have been positive in that timeframe before they returned a positive result. In that timeframe there weren't any restrictions on travelling interstate. People could have driven interstate, then passed it onto someone else interstate. They could have then also spread it to another state travelling on planes etc.


Yet there were no snap lockdowns anywhere else.
Gero has some company
1613530386757.png
 

bok_party

Norm Smith Medallist
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The only whatboutisms I am seeing here are the claims but what if the virus did spread when a) it hasn't and b) there is no evidence that it was or is.

And this isn't whataboutism. You would stop 100% of vehicular fatalities if you shut down use of motor vehicles completely. That's never going to happen though for obvious reasons.

Consequently there never should be a stage 4 lockdown even considered unless you have direct evidence of mystery community virus transmission.


That alone should be the only reason to drive lockdowns in the future to save false alarms like the one we have just had.
You are using the example of motor vehicles as a way to say deaths would be eradicated. Of course there would be no fatalities because there are no cars. It’s a pointless argument.

but the fact remains, if they just left it and the 1-5 cases become 20 or 50 or 200, people would be complaining we should have locked down sooner and why didn’t we just do a 5-day lockdown.

As I’ve said before, there’s numerous reasons why viruses can not spread despite being contagious but people don’t want to delve deeper and just want to criticise.
 

jd2010

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Back down to level 2 at midnight even with another 3 cases over here until Monday. All were close contacts of the first 3 and were self isolating since Sunday. Just crowd limits at venues and religious gatherings to 100. Bit surprised that it's loosened so quick but not complaining
 

Zidane98

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You are using the example of motor vehicles as a way to say deaths would be eradicated. Of course there would be no fatalities because there are no cars. It’s a pointless argument.

but the fact remains, if they just left it and the 1-5 cases become 20 or 50 or 200, people would be complaining we should have locked down sooner and why didn’t we just do a 5-day lockdown.

As I’ve said before, there’s numerous reasons why viruses can not spread despite being contagious but people don’t want to delve deeper and just want to criticise.

You can't base lockdowns of what ifs. All cases were contained to known isolated contacts, plenty of us predicted that when the lockdown kicked in. The lockdown made absolutely zero difference to these cases.


We have contact tracing. We have masks / hand sanitiser + social distancing measures. It is difficult to defend a lockdown based on what ifs and no direct evidence of community transmission.


And if you really do think locking down based on what ifs is reasonable and proportional then really why not declare Stage 4 lockdown for the next 2 years?



Is there any other cases of a Stage 4 lockdown anywhere in the world without any evidence of unknown community transmission?
 

bok_party

Norm Smith Medallist
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You can't base lockdowns of what ifs. All cases were contained to known isolated contacts, plenty of us predicted that when the lockdown kicked in. The lockdown made absolutely zero difference to these cases.


We have contact tracing. We have masks / hand sanitiser + social distancing measures. It is difficult to defend a lockdown based on what ifs and no direct evidence of community transmission.


And if you really do think locking down based on what ifs is reasonable and proportional then really why not declare Stage 4 lockdown for the next 2 years?



Is there any other cases of a Stage 4 lockdown anywhere in the world without any evidence of unknown community transmission?
You’re literally doing that with the motor vehicle scenario.

The guy in Perth went around a few days before he called in sick. How hard is it to comprehend that in the few days before that, he went to ten different locations possibly spreading it? Contact tracing is all well and good but it can spiral out of control very quickly (doesn’t mean it well but it can).

All I see on SM is that people just want to complain because they can’t have a ******* pint this week. Give me a break.

As I said before, it’s not a sustainable tactic but I sure as hell would rather be doing what Oz and NZ have been doing than be anywhere else in the world.
 

Cruyff14

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You’re literally doing that with the motor vehicle scenario.

The guy in Perth went around a few days before he called in sick. How hard is it to comprehend that in the few days before that, he went to ten different locations possibly spreading it? Contact tracing is all well and good but it can spiral out of control very quickly (doesn’t mean it well but it can).

All I see on SM is that people just want to complain because they can’t have a ******* pint this week. Give me a break.

As I said before, it’s not a sustainable tactic but I sure as hell would rather be doing what Oz and NZ have been doing than be anywhere else in the world.
Are you saying you wouldn't want to live in a country that has had 400,000 COVID deaths? Colour me shocked.
 

UnitedWarrior93

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For me, locking down regional Victoria and allowing the Aus open continue did it for me. Essential workers my ******* ass, just say it what it really is which is all about money, that continuing was a risk of spreading COVID, if what Dan says is true about it being so contagious and deadly.
 

jd2010

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For me, locking down regional Victoria and allowing the Aus open continue did it for me. Essential workers my ******* ass, just say it what it really is which is all about money, that continuing was a risk of spreading COVID, if what Dan says is true about it being so contagious and deadly.
I don't get how they could let crowds go to the night session that night. No excuses for that.

For me it continuing during the lockdown was no issue. The players are already there and been isolating etc. So they're no different to those workers who go into an office because they can't WFH
 

Zidane98

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You’re literally doing that with the motor vehicle scenario.

The guy in Perth went around a few days before he called in sick. How hard is it to comprehend that in the few days before that, he went to ten different locations possibly spreading it? Contact tracing is all well and good but it can spiral out of control very quickly (doesn’t mean it well but it can).

All I see on SM is that people just want to complain because they can’t have a ******* pint this week. Give me a break.

As I said before, it’s not a sustainable tactic but I sure as hell would rather be doing what Oz and NZ have been doing than be anywhere else in the world.
The motor vehicle scenario is not a what if. It is a fact that you eliminate vehicular fatalities if one were to shut down use of vehicles completely for a year.

Now we all know that isnt realistic despite the fact that it would definitely save lives.

COVID lockdowns should not be even considered either unless you have unknown community transmission.

And sorry, but the best results from COVID came from countries without severe lockdowns. Sth Korea, Taiwan for example.

Would much rather be doing what they are doing instead of severe overreactions like the one weve seen in Vic.

It also isnt just about having a pint either, thats pretty low on the list. Plenty of kids are / were struggling with the lockdown. People waiting for elective surgery have just seen their surgery put back months (this is my wife who was supposed to have gall bladder surgery this week but has been told to wait until later this year despite suffering chronic pain).

Its the livelihood of businesses that are severley affected by unnecessary lockdowns.

But lets go ahead and continue to shutdown the entire state everytime theres a few covid cases. To hell with everything else.
 

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TubbsFarquhar

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You could make an argument for the lockdown being a neccessary circuit breaker but it's the fact another HQ leak and piss poor contact tracing that led to it yet again. That, and locking down the entire state was completely over the top.

SA's November lockdown was even more ridiculous. It was the entire state (how would you have felt being in Mount Gambier or Port Lincoln) plus you couldn't even go out to exercise. Luckily it was lifted early after the pizza box lie was uncovered but the fact it was that strict in the first place is what was so frustrating.
 

bok_party

Norm Smith Medallist
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The motor vehicle scenario is not a what if. It is a fact that you eliminate vehicular fatalities if one were to shut down use of vehicles completely for a year.

Now we all know that isnt realistic despite the fact that it would definitely save lives.

COVID lockdowns should not be even considered either unless you have unknown community transmission.

And sorry, but the best results from COVID came from countries without severe lockdowns. Sth Korea, Taiwan for example.

Would much rather be doing what they are doing instead of severe overreactions like the one weve seen in Vic.

It also isnt just about having a pint either, thats pretty low on the list. Plenty of kids are / were struggling with the lockdown. People waiting for elective surgery have just seen their surgery put back months (this is my wife who was supposed to have gall bladder surgery this week but has been told to wait until later this year despite suffering chronic pain).

Its the livelihood of businesses that are severley affected by unnecessary lockdowns.

But lets go ahead and continue to shutdown the entire state everytime theres a few covid cases. To hell with everything else.
Except it will never happen so it’s a what if?

we could all just stay in our houses for months and have no one allowed out (I’m talking extreme - not even to shops) and then we wouldn’t have COVID deaths because it couldn’t spread. Same thing as your vehicle nonsense.

I get it’s not just for a pint but it’s five days. Businesses have adapted for the meantime and have found workaround ways to get around it. It’s not perfect and some businesses will struggle of course.

And before you compare South Korea and Taiwan, their people are far more subservient that Australians, Americans or Europeans. They already wear masks in the first place. Plus South Korea just hit a one month high and had 621 cases yesterday.
 

Art Vandelay_

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He can't win whatever he does. People are always gonna complain.
If he was in any way competent people wouldn't complain.
The lockdown was fine, it was just the extent of it.

But hey its over and we move on. Cost me a couple of grand but i can live with that. Got mates its cost 20k+.
Over... Until the next government stuff up locks us down once more.
What will come first. enough of the population getting vaccinations or a Dictator Dan stuff up?
Was thinking how weird it was to be agreeing with SM and Zizou at once.
Dan is a miracle worker bringing us together :rainbow:
 

SM

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Back down to level 2 at midnight even with another 3 cases over here until Monday. All were close contacts of the first 3 and were self isolating since Sunday. Just crowd limits at venues and religious gatherings to 100. Bit surprised that it's loosened so quick but not complaining
Not complaining? Based on the last few pages you should be outraged surely.
 

Bradesmaen

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All of you stop complaining... I'm now into Day 48 of lockdown and well over the 100th day of lockdowns. Quick estimation says it's close to 150 days of lockdown... nearly 365 days of heavy restrictions (i.e pubs have been closed since March 15 last year)
 

moomba

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All of you stop complaining... I'm now into Day 48 of lockdown and well over the 100th day of lockdowns. Quick estimation says it's close to 150 days of lockdown... nearly 365 days of heavy restrictions (i.e pubs have been closed since March 15 last year)
I'd like to know how long we've been in lockdown.

Kids were off school from last March, and went back in September. Things opened up for a bit but I reckon we went back under lockdown at the start of November. Manchester hasn't been out of it since then apart from a few days over Christmas.

But all the days/weeks of lockdown seemed to have rolled into one big lockdown, so I'd be keen to know how long it's actually been.

FWIW I've been lucky, I'm at work most days and I think I'd have gone mad if I wasn't. It's been really hard for the kids though.
 

bok_party

Norm Smith Medallist
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All of you stop complaining... I'm now into Day 48 of lockdown and well over the 100th day of lockdowns. Quick estimation says it's close to 150 days of lockdown... nearly 365 days of heavy restrictions (i.e pubs have been closed since March 15 last year)
Exactly man! In contrast, we really have nothing to complain about.
 

jd2010

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Exactly man! In contrast, we really have nothing to complain about.
Makes it very hard to listen/ready any news from over here when they get hysterical about the govt failings. Ffs we get in this mess because 20-30% of the country uses the QR codes regularly because we forget that there's a global pandemic out there, and we forget because the govt did such a good job getting rid of it for long periods
 

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