Umpires influencing games: Exhibit 1 Car v Fre

[Rich01]

Yeah right, you won the free kick count yet umpires favoured Freo after that finish....

The game was shockingly umpired for both sides. Freo were gifted two goals in the first qtr with incorrect calls.

These should be put into the spotlight just as much as their performance in the last 30 seconds of the game.

 

[Turnover]

Think you should've read a rule book before starting this thread...

The only thing the umps stuffed up was giving the ball to Newnes and not Gibbons.

Lol. Liam Jones throw to Eddie betts????

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

You know who has a chance to influence the game more than the umps? The players. For four quarters. Get over it, umpires make mistakes but they aren't influencing results.

Of course they are influencing results.

Add an extra 5 or 10 Clearances to a team, or change the outcome of 4 or 5 Contested Marks Inside 50 and you almost certainly alter the outcome of the game.

Umpires play an enormous role in the outcome of games.

 

[bzparkes]

Lol. Liam Jones throw to Eddie betts????

The umpire hadn't called time on from memory and Eddie couldn't be there in the first place so he had to call the ball back as it wasn't in play.

It'd be like pinging a player for throwing the ball back to a teammate when they receive a free kick.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

have a look at the replay and then tell me where the ball went out of bounds.. pretty much right over top of the 50m arc and boundary line..

a carlton player (no.40) was right at that point and watched it go out... he even stands the mark thinking it is a freo free kick from there for oobotf..

then when the ump says its a downfield free all of a sudden the mark for newnes’s kick is set 10-15m closer to goal... he shouldve been kicking for goal from outside 50 with a freo player manning the mark on the 50m arc.

its clear as day if you watch the replay.

Aside from the terrible 'down field' free in the first place, that was the poorest piece of umpiring I reckon I've ever seen.

How they worked out that it went out on the full about 35m from Carlton's goal has me stumped.

 

[Turnover]

The umpire hadn't called time on from memory and Eddie couldn't be there in the first place so he had to call the ball back as it wasn't in play.

It'd be like pinging a player for throwing the ball back to a teammate when they receive a free kick.

Fair enough. Can’t understand what was going thru Liam Jones’s mind then.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

For an example If I go to punch a ball and miss the ball and hit a player in the head instead the fact it was incidental or accidental makes no difference it’s still a free kick!

That's not accurate.

The 50m Penalty is a better example. If you commit to a contest whilst the ball is in the air, but collect the player that marks the ball late - you don't get pinged for 'late contact' because you'd already left the ground and can't stop yourself.
So even though the contact is late, it's considered incidental.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Swings and roundabouts. Freo got two unwarranted goals in front of goals in the first quarter.

So just zip it, enjoy the magnificent Newnes game winner (which will win goal of the year) and bask in the return of Carlton as a legit finals contender.

Finally I have to say the salty bitterness from non Freo neutral supporters (I am inclined to allow the venting from Freo Fans, very unlucky) only makes last night's win, all the more sweeter.

WE ARE CARLTON ! **** The Rest !!

 

[Purple Suit]

The game was shockingly umpired for both sides. Freo were gifted two goals in the first qtr with incorrect calls.

These should be put into the spotlight just as much as their performance in the last 30 seconds of the game.

Except they are just poor decisions which happen all game. The ones Freo copped at the end seemed to be against the rules rather than interpretation.

That’s before the AFL changed the rules last year to give umpires the ability to do anything they deemed fit in a game. They are ******* up the sport.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Umpiring was Fremantles way the entire game. Of the first 3 goals to Freo, 2 were as a result of incorrect decisions.

I have not seen anyone suggest the final decisions were incorrect.

Tabener clearly intentionally hits it out of bounds.

Freo player clearly downs Docherty after the kick.

Free kick is awarded down field. Bit of confusion and Umpire gives it to Newnes. Arguments it maybe should have been Gibbons but thats really semantics.

Freo player shouldn't have been a thug and knock someone over after they dispose of the ball.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

That was incredible umpiring, the down field free kick was dubious to begin with, but it shouldn’t have even been paid down field once it went out on the full. It goes back to where he kicks it.

Thats not the case.

 

[AndrewShawble]

Umpiring has never been worse across the league.

Partially the umpires, partially AFL house - they keep tinkering with rules and now we are here.

 

[Turnover]

Aside from the terrible 'down field' free in the first place, that was the poorest piece of umpiring I reckon I've ever seen.

How they worked out that it went out on the full about 35m from Carlton's goal has me stumped.

Yeah not sure why the boundary umpires has to run all the way around to the point post these days. We have a goal umpire and the goal/point review system. Just get the main part of your job correct. Where the ball goes out.

 

[Anja_Nees]

Great kick but one of the worst frees I’ve seen. Would be in meltdown as a Freo fan.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

The down field free was there, but they've officiated it wrong.

If the ball lands out of bounds which it did, by the rules of the game it's meant to return to the player who kicked it, from where they kicked it.
If it had've landed in, it's meant to be returned to the closest player, which was Gibbons.

Fremantle were genuinely robbed by umpires not officiating the rules correctly.

Link? I dont think thats correct.

 

[Fadge]

Finally I have to say the salty bitterness from non Freo neutral supporters (I am inclined to allow the venting from Freo Fans, very unlucky) only makes last night's win, all the more sweeter.

WE ARE CARLTON ! **** The Rest !!

Just a quick dose of reality...

The saltiness has absolutely nothing to do with Carlton, but everything to do with the state of the game - rules that are impossible to consistently adjudicate.

You'll find that many of those up in arms over last night's result, were equally boisterous in defence of Carlton over some of the umpiring during your game against West Coast.

Make no mistake, Carlton continue to be completely irrelevant in the grander scheme of things...

 

[abbeorse]

Carlton were the better team and deserved to win, we would've been lucky to hold on. Sometimes calls go your way sometimes they don't and that's footy, but gee whiz you can spot the blokes on this thread that have never played a game of footy. Contact happens front on like that after you kick when someone tries to smother you all the time. Fair enough if Brayshaw came in from the side and took him out but he was sprinting towards him trying to smother it's impossible for players to pull out of that.

Carlton fans you don't have to defend the decision you are allowed to say we got lucky with that call but we will take it, they won't take the 4 points off of you I promise. Better team after quarter time won.

Also ridiculously good kick from Newnes.

 

[Purple Suit]

Umpiring was Fremantles way the entire game. Of the first 3 goals to Freo, 2 were as a result of incorrect decisions.

I have not seen anyone suggest the final decisions were incorrect.

Tabener clearly intentionally hits it out of bounds.

Freo player clearly downs Docherty after the kick.

Free kick is awarded down field. Bit of confusion and Umpire gives it to Newnes. Arguments it maybe should have been Gibbons but thats really semantics.

Freo player shouldn't have been a thug and knock someone over after they dispose of the ball.

How is it semantics, it’s an obvious
mistake from the umpire.

Ignoring the issues with the down field call, why did it become 40m out from goal? Ball crosses the line 60m out, it’s where Freo would have taken their kick in. Why do Carlton get a shot closer to goal where the ball ended up?

Gibbo should have had to take the Kick on the fence, not boundary line if we’re changing rules on the fly.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

This makes no sense to me. So, we're saying it's ok to push a player that is kicking it, but once he's kicked it, that's an issue. It makes no sense.

Its been a rule of footy for the entirety of its existence mate.. have you ever watched or played.

If the contact affected the kick - I.e it was in the kicking motion or prior to the kick, its paid at the point of disposal.

If the contact is after the kick - its downfield.

This is basic stuff.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

in my reading of the rules, it's pretty clearly a free-kick under charging (It could well turn out, if we see it from other angles, that high contact was made)


18.3.2 Free Kicks - Prohibited Contact A field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against a Player when that Player makes any of the following Prohibited Contact with an opposition Player:
(a) executes a tackle that is not legal (refer to the definition of Legal Tackle);
(b) pushes an opposition Player in the back;
(c) makes high contact to an opposition Player (including the top of the shoulders) with any part of their body;
(d) holds an opposition Player who is not in possession of the football;
(e) executes an illegal Shepherd;
(f) Charges an opposition Player;
(g) trips or attempts to trip an opposition Player, whether by hand, arm, foot or leg;
(h) kicks or attempts to kick an opposition Player;
(i) kicks or attempts to kick the football in a manner likely to cause injury;
(j) strikes or attempts to strike an opposition Player, whether by hand, fist, arm, knee or head;
(k) bumps or makes forceful contact to an opposition Player from front-on when that Player has their head down over the football.

Charging is defined as:

Charge or Charging: the act of a Player colliding with an opposition Player where the amount of physical force used is unreasonable or unnecessary in the circumstances, irrespective of whether the Player is or is not in possession of the football or whether the Player is within five metres of the football.

So in this case, Brayshaw is desperately trying to smother the ball, he runs hard to get within distance of maybe smothering the ball, jumps in the direction of the kicker, collides with the player with enough force to put him on the floor and after the player has disposed of the ball.

I don't really see how it's a wrong call, but the AFL might bottle it and say it shouldn't have been paid anyway

Hang on...so you read that, and you think that it WAS a Free kick???

Seriously?

 

[Purple Suit]

It's not the count, it's the bullshit ones and the ones they missed. There were some absolute howlers and a lot worse than the calls in the last few seconds.

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Carlton got some soft ones that ended up as points rather than goals because of poor kicking. Also a rugby pass for a goal.

 

[Fadge]

Its been a rule of footy for the entirety of its existence mate.. have you ever watched or played.

If the contact affected the kick - I.e it was in the kicking motion or prior to the kick, its paid at the point of disposal.

If the contact is after the kick - its downfield.

This is basic stuff.

If that is the case, do you have any comment on the 30 other downfield free kicks that were missed during the game?

 

[Rich01]

Except they are just poor decisions which happen all game. The ones Freo copped at the end seemed to be against the rules rather than interpretation.

Disagree. Believe the mistakes made at the end of the game were interpretation. The umpire decided that the deliberate out of bounds as well as the late hit was there. That’s interpretation. Just like the wrong calls in the first qtr that gifted Fremantle two goals. It was a horribly umpired game, for both sides.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

Should this free kick to Conca who kicked it out on the full with 2:26 remaining been down field?
View attachment 936838View attachment 936839View attachment 936840

No. In the act of kicking. Not afterwards. Free kick paid at the point of contact as it affected the kick.

Basic stuff.

You ever watched footy before or is this your first time? I can link you that AFL video designed for moron Americans if you like.

 

[Underarm]

18.1.2 Awarding Free Kicks Unless otherwise stated in these Laws, a Free Kick can be awarded at any location on the Arena and shall be taken where it is awarded or where the football is at the time, whichever is the greater penalty against the offending Team. For the avoidance of doubt, Free Kicks awarded outside the Playing Surface will be taken at the nearest location on the Boundary Line or where the football is at the time, whichever is the greater penalty against the offending Team.

The fact that this needs to be stickied proves that it's not the umpires that are bad, people just don't understand the rules, and dont try hard enough to educate themselves.