Society/Culture Unionism is holding Australia back
- Thread starter Tas
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- Aug 1, 2002
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Mate the price of freedom is eternal vigilance by workers and their representatives, by women, by people who hate the political class in Australia - I respect what you are saying brother but you seem to be suggesting you want feminism to go away. Are the highlighted passages your idea of an argument - they are the rhetorical equivalent of "when did you stop beating your wife" (or in your case husband)
- Aug 1, 2002
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That is not what I am saying. But when you see so many talented women and then you see the Melbourne Club tossbags that are on fifteen boards you start to wonder if it has anything to do with their gender...and I am not advocating for a quote either
- Aug 1, 2002
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Yeh but Tas is taking it all the way down - women are natural carers you have got to be kidding me!!!!
Are you saying women are not natural carers?
- Aug 1, 2002
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That is the thing about stereotyping masquerading as science - some chicks are some are not
I have experienced said vigilance courtesy of the AWU and MUA - all yours comrade.
I'll stick to the freedom of the jungle.
I'd argue that women sacrifice more than men, if I'm honest. They have to have the child, raise it, and you're complaining because you think feminism might result in women being slightly overpaid. I'd still choose to be a man if I'm honest.
It's harder being a mother. You have to juggle having a job as well as raising a kid. You sound like a cranky father who has suffered at the hands of the famiy court tas.
Time to get different friends tas. The notion that feminism makes men's life hell is absurd.
And they do tas, things like PPL are an attempt to make women's roles in the workforce more secure. More securite for women in the workforce means more money means more responsibility via being able to afford things.
Yeah. You ever had a mortgage tas? They aint cheap.
The battle of feminists is not to overpay women, the battle for feminists is to pay women fairly. I understand that women can have less experience, but experience is not the only determining factor in the worth of an employee, skills matter too and the prejudice against women in the workforce is greater than the prejudice against men. Just look at guys like meds, he wants it legal to be able to deliberately not hire women because they might get pregnant. It seems like some men want the baby but none of the labour pains. If you want women to have kids, you have to protect their rights at work, if you want them to stay at work, you've got to be accomidating when they have kids. Because it's not as if us guys are having them! (thank god)
Family law court. "Justice".
Of course I do. How dare you or anyone else tell me who I can or can not hire.
If, in describing the tyranny of feminism, the worst we can come up with is the family law court, then we really need to try harder. I mean, who amongst us really would like to be a woman, even in this day and age?
Borry
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- Aug 15, 2004
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This country has put its eggs into the pay everyone with a high wage basket. It must stick to that if the economy is going to stay strong.
There are millions of individuals out there that are reliant on borrowing money to help feed, shelter and pay bills as well as other lifestyle choices. There are plenty of businesses that are reliant on individuals borrowing money to stay viable. Get rid of the minimal wage will mean that there would certainly be at least some employers out there that will lower their wages and this will mean banks lose wealth as a result of the decreased ability of an individual to pay borrowed money back to them, which could potentially cause an economic crisis.
There are millions of individuals out there that are reliant on borrowing money to help feed, shelter and pay bills as well as other lifestyle choices. There are plenty of businesses that are reliant on individuals borrowing money to stay viable. Get rid of the minimal wage will mean that there would certainly be at least some employers out there that will lower their wages and this will mean banks lose wealth as a result of the decreased ability of an individual to pay borrowed money back to them, which could potentially cause an economic crisis.
- Sep 23, 2008
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If you feel emasculated by feminism, you don't deserve a seat at the men's table.
Someone steals everything you have under the notion of "justice" and you don't think that is remotely an issue?
I very much doubt that you would hold the same view if it happened to you (plus restraining order and all the other grubby tactics that lawyers use like trying to block access to children).
Meh, I used to hate unions from an ideological perspective too, then I worked at a large company for 10 years. Changed my mind completely over time, I joined the union.
A lot of the stuff in the OP isn't about unions per se anyway, it's about legislated labour market conditions and where the bar should be set.
A lot of the stuff in the OP isn't about unions per se anyway, it's about legislated labour market conditions and where the bar should be set.
CakeEater
Brownlow Medallist
1. We have a High Wage Basket, the problem with having a high wage basket is that a) people don't want their wages to go backwards b)the only real way to reduce labour costs is redundancies/ letting people leave without replacing them, both of which have massive negative impacts on the workforce.
2. Realistically, the amount of Labour Side productivity gains you can make starts and stops at how deep you can cut without toppling the business and killing confidence in the business.
3.Businesses to achieve productivty gains should implement strategies using new technology, which unions should support.
4. Unions should develop the capability to support society can be achieved through the:
- Support of Workers achieving additional qualifications, then actively assisting with finding them a job
- Providing subsidized child care to encourage workers to return to the workforce- would solve some of our Labour problems.
Everything you have? Dear christ. And what about the men who don't get divorced, are they castrated too?
Yes, the law and their silked employees are dirty, no-one's disputing that.
Power Raid
We Exist To Win Premierships
The concept of unions is good but the reality is the high profile unions have been infiltrated by criminals and the softer ones like government unions have a sense of entitlement.
All unions should be registered as companies thus bound by the corporations act which should provide better governance.
Further all government services should be outsourced rendering government impermeable to union lobbying.
All unions should be registered as companies thus bound by the corporations act which should provide better governance.
Further all government services should be outsourced rendering government impermeable to union lobbying.
Tas
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TheBrownDog
- Dec 23, 2002
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- #45
Feminism is a broad concept that applies to ALL women. Not all women make sacrifices or have a harder time. Mothers do, mostly single mothers.
If you don't want to have kids then there isn't any difference between being a man and a woman for work in the modern world.
It's harder being a mother. You have to juggle having a job as well as raising a kid. You sound like a cranky father who has suffered at the hands of the famiy court tas.
Nope, don't have any kids (as far as I am aware) and have also helped my sisters to raise their kids, I am very close with my nephews and nieces and my siblings are still married.
My sisters aren't raging feminists though.
Life is harder being a mother but being a mother is a personal choice. Life would be tough being a raging alcoholic as well but I wouldn't expect people to have to employ me and pay me the same as sober people if I chose to live my life that way.
The problem is the lack of compromise. I was still at uni when I was first introduced to a woman who had 'the plan' mapped out for the rest of our lives. Since that day it has just been one after the other with horrible life long plans of servitude. Even prison has time off for good behaviour.
Why would I as a person want to get into a relationship with someone where the relationship has a 75% chance of going to shit because she feels entitled to better and can only come up to that conclusion after she has screwed you over, then lose half my shit and have to pay her for two decades for her poor decision and unwillingness to compromise.
People say this is your lot in life as a guy. I am glad other people find purpose in that, but it just isn't for me. All I see from guys I have known over my lifetime are victims. Some women cop a bad deal, some are abused, but I have never seen an entire gender psychologically traumatised as the male species post feminism.
I've seen time and again women strip men of their dignity, of their self-respect, of the very fiber of their being that made them a man and then have the audacity to say, 'where have all the real men gone?' You've taken Ken and turned him into Barbie and are not happy with Barbie.
18 weeks paid $600 for having a baby, what a joke. Here is an alternative. Save $12k before spitting out a child and pay yourself $600 a week.
I am still waiting for the (TFS) the Tas Ferrari Scheme where the government gives me money every week because I want a Ferrari.
Yet the average house in the USA is around $250k, try finding a house even in Ballarat or Bendigo for $250k.
Supply and demand, it is a harsh reality when it comes to housing.
Maybe we should get the government to cap house price at $250k? On another topic, we have too many people in our capital cities who demand to live in a house when really they don't give a shit about a yard, don't have a large family, where a nice cheaper apartment in a complex would better suit their lifestyle where you only incur a fraction of the cost of the land for your apartment cost.
I'll probably end up moving to an apartment, a nice one near the CBD, they are still a fraction of the price of a house and suits my lifestyle.
I don't want women to have kids though, our education system is abysmal, prospects for young kids are horrendous, employers would rather give backpackers work than young kids here.
Our population from local born vs deaths is going backwards, our population would shrink if we didn't let more immigrants into the country and we would be unable to pay the welfare bill which is increasing exponentially. Even a xenophobe like Abbott wont shut down immigration.
Having kids is a bit like having a Ferrari. It is expensive. It costs a shitload to get one, insurance is very expensive, servicing is expensive, repairs are bloody expensive. Do you REALLY want kids because it is going to be expensive to do the job properly. Most don't have the means to do it properly so are producing ****ups. These ****ups become a net drain on society.
People need to look at their situation, can they realistically afford to have children? We are no longer amoeba that mindlessly reproduce, we need to seriously look and consider our situation before we decide to have kids.
You do not need to be privileged to have kids, but you need to be able to provide for them and ensure they have a good education and are brought up so they have a positive impact on society, most people can not afford it and take short-cuts and as much as I sympathise with the parents who want to have kids, I feel more for the kids they are having who will struggle because they haven't been given the tools they need to excel.
- Sep 23, 2008
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Who would we outsource emergency mental health to? As far as I know the private sector doesn't (and cannot) provide that service. My union is nothing like your two feeble examples
Power Raid
We Exist To Win Premierships
Mental health and education would be no harder to privatise than any other business, Further, given the government would still be the major customer it would remain largely in control of the business outcomes but not be responsible for the employees thus breaking the government union control.
oh and great if your union is not like the two examples.
The majority are, which is reflected in global gender occupational choice statistics. Women tend to be drawn to jobs that deal with people (teaching, nursing), whereas men tend to prefer jobs that deal with things (engineering, building). This occupational gender choice gap stays pretty constant over many different cultures worldwide.
Positive psychological traits like empathy, the desire to avoid danger and the desire to avoid social exclusion (all strongly linked to being 'the carer') are evolutionarily hard-wired into women because women carrying these traits were more successful at continuing their genetic line than women who weren't.
Outliers do not disprove averages.
