Preview Where do we go from here in 2019?

HANDSOLO

All Australian
May 19, 2014
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Harmes is a better player

But viney is a figurehead and actually can display on field leadership when he is in decent shape

When he is in poor shape, which has been more often than not, he can’t do it consistently across or during games

So force him to take all the time he needs and get fit. He has been instrumental in many of our biggest wins over the last 3 years

But ol chompers still a better player overall me thinks

I’m awarding you both a partial credit!
 

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gawndog37

Draftee
Oct 18, 2016
15
23
AFL Club
Melbourne
I think we looked at our best last year with our inside combo of oliver, brayshaw, harmes. Viney lacks spread from the contest and hacks the ball forward as soon as he gets it, haltering our ball movement. Also causing brayshaw to play out of position, you'd think goody would think to throw gus back in the guts where he finished 3rd in the brownlow. Would much rather use viney as a trading chip than gus if we were able to get a premium outside mid like a whitfield.

On a side note in the off season what I'd want to see the most is the coaching staff demand to petracca to shed 10kg to play in the midfield. He was drafted to play as a mid not a forward and it's been long enough now there should be no more excuses. If he can't get his **** together he should be moved on
 

Demon bhoy

Team Captain
Oct 7, 2017
418
201
AFL Club
Melbourne
Harmes is a better player

But viney is a figurehead and actually can display on field leadership when he is in decent shape

When he is in poor shape, which has been more often than not, he can’t do it consistently across or during games

So force him to take all the time he needs and get fit. He has been instrumental in many of our biggest wins over the last 3 years

But ol chompers still a better player overall me thinks

I’m awarding you both a partial credit!
Definitely agree that injury has reduced Jacks output and agree he needs to be given the time to get himself right, fingers crossed he can I rate him highly and think people are forgetting how good he was before the foot. Harmes is also a good player no doubt. Thank you for the partial credit
 

Bazza97

Premiership Player
Nov 17, 2016
3,347
3,321
Melbourne
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For the time being, play the best side available. It's been a **** season but I've since readjusted my expectations since a few weeks ago, so I'm actually quite excited of what we make of the rest of the season. I'm hoping for at least an overall improved performance for the 2nd half of the season.

There's still plenty of players who I'm looking forward to seeing return from injury. We haven't seen Hannan at all this year but has now been named in our side, if all goes to plan May and Lever will play together for the first time at AFL level soon and Kolodjashnij has recovered sufficiently to be named in the VFL side. Then there's players like Melksham and Jetta who should return late in the season. I'm also hopeful that fringe players such as Joel Smith and Aaron vandenBerg can return late in the season to press their claims for AFL selection in the VFL.

However, even though we should try to play our best possible side every week for the rest of the year, we do need to keep an eye on our preparation for the 2020 season, which I think is very important considering our last pre-season was heavily interrupted and has impacted on our year so far. If that means a few of our best 22 players need operations then we should do it before the end of the H&A season. I don't think we're going to be in a position late in the season where we will be in finals calculations so I think there is more leeway for some players to have their operations before the end of the season rather than in the post-season which obviously has impacted on our preparation for this year.

We'll see what eventuates, but I can see another benefit of having certain players finish their season early in order to be better prepared for the 2020 pre-season. Younger or fringe players (Sparrow, Baker or Petty for example) would have the opportunity to play more games and as a result should benefit with a little bit more top level experience than they otherwise would, before they go into their next season hopefully improving on what they've done this year.

Haven't gone through everything but this is what has immediately come to my mind. So, hopefully this year proves to be a blip as I believe from 2020 onwards we should be consistently playing finals and contending for premierships in the next few years.
 

Demon bhoy

Team Captain
Oct 7, 2017
418
201
AFL Club
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The point is harmes is a better footballer than Viney
Very much a matter of opinion, and yours and mine are different but both subjective. One thing I did notice is that Viney has A higher disposal efficiency than Harmes, 69% to 68% both not great to be fair. And I tend to think it’s because of where they win the ball and the **** game style Goodwin coaches, but both need to improve.

I should also add Salem to my list of untouchables, big oversight my bad.
 

Topkent

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Aug 29, 2010
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Viney when fit is vital and is heart and soul in the junior McDonald mold,easy in the clubs best few players, most supporters think the club have badly handled his injuries but was huge in the first two finals last year half fit. Harmes is a good player who has got better every year but is maybe 4th best mid.
Harmes is better than Viney at every single aspect of footy except going in a straight line and tackling
 

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Topkent

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This Harmes binge Topkent is going on is reminiscent of his ANB for top 10 in the BNF 2018

I fully expect Harmes to have a very poor 2020, where he's dropped multiple times from the team and struggles with injury
I'm gonna OD on Harmes. Every other player on our list sucks
 

Demon bhoy

Team Captain
Oct 7, 2017
418
201
AFL Club
Melbourne
The fact you think Harmes is not a more versatile player than Viney means you must not watch Melbourne.

Explain how Viney is a more versatile player?
I personally believe Viney is better and more important than Harmes, I didn’t mention versatility once but I do think it’s incredibly overrated, I’ll take good any day of the week and I think Harmes is good
 

demondavey

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 18, 2005
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I personally believe Viney is better and more important than Harmes, I didn’t mention versatility once but I do think it’s incredibly overrated, I’ll take good any day of the week and I think Harmes is good
Fair enough
 

HANDSOLO

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May 19, 2014
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one thing we need next year is to embrace the concept of coaching. I’m convinced this year has shown us letting the player so whatever they want and not coaching them is not a good approach

Also, for the record, this is way worse than tigers 2016
 

Crusty Demon

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Sep 20, 2009
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Pies will smash us next week. So going into the bye at 3-9 is a complete and utter disaster. And two of those wins were by under a goal and arguably lucky wins. So 1 decent win in 12 rounds?? That is a monumental cluster ****. Oliver and Brayshaw have gone backwards, TMac and Weid combo has been a disaster, zero improvement in regards to converting inside 50s, leadership again found wanting, new recruits also a disaster, and the potential two ruck combo plan surprisingly scrapped after not working.

Salem and Harmes are about the only two who can say they have stepped forward. Hore has been a find, and Baker looks ok. So we're left now with a **** sandwich to either tank it for a top 2 pick(huge drop off after top 2 next draft) and put players on ice and get surgeries done early, or we get our best 22 back on the park and go hard in winning a few games to hopefully gain momentum into next season. Surely it's the latter, but with our lack of decent 18-20 year olds, it is tempting to go after a top 2 pick.
 

Topkent

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Pies will smash us next week. So going into the bye at 3-9 is a complete and utter disaster. And two of those wins were by under a goal and arguably lucky wins. So 1 decent win in 12 rounds?? That is a monumental cluster ****. Oliver and Brayshaw have gone backwards, TMac and Weid combo has been a disaster, zero improvement in regards to converting inside 50s, leadership again found wanting, new recruits also a disaster, and the potential two ruck combo plan surprisingly scrapped after not working.

Salem and Harmes are about the only two who can say they have stepped forward. Hore has been a find, and Baker looks ok. So we're left now with a **** sandwich to either tank it for a top 2 pick(huge drop off after top 2 next draft) and put players on ice and get surgeries done early, or we get our best 22 back on the park and go hard in winning a few games to hopefully gain momentum into next season. Surely it's the latter, but with our lack of decent 18-20 year olds, it is tempting to go after a top 2 pick.
If you think tanking is the answer you are a complete peanut
 

rhaz

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 30, 2008
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It's all about preparing for 2020.

May and Lever to get 10 games together with our backline. No Oscar.

Brayshaw to play inside. Move Fristch to the wing. Stretch and JKH back to the VFL.

Weideman to keep playing seniors.

Make sure one of Sparrow / Jordon / Dunkley are playing in the side each week so we can find a player.

Give Gawn a rest at some point.

Oliver to spend time forward (why haven't we seen it this year??)
 

demondavey

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 18, 2005
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Pies will smash us next week. So going into the bye at 3-9 is a complete and utter disaster. And two of those wins were by under a goal and arguably lucky wins. So 1 decent win in 12 rounds?? That is a monumental cluster ****. Oliver and Brayshaw have gone backwards, TMac and Weid combo has been a disaster, zero improvement in regards to converting inside 50s, leadership again found wanting, new recruits also a disaster, and the potential two ruck combo plan surprisingly scrapped after not working.

Salem and Harmes are about the only two who can say they have stepped forward. Hore has been a find, and Baker looks ok. So we're left now with a **** sandwich to either tank it for a top 2 pick(huge drop off after top 2 next draft) and put players on ice and get surgeries done early, or we get our best 22 back on the park and go hard in winning a few games to hopefully gain momentum into next season. Surely it's the latter, but with our lack of decent 18-20 year olds, it is tempting to go after a top 2 pick.
You don’t tank. FFS you don’t. We were the laughing stock of the AFL for 8 years because we tanked. Anyone advocating that needs to go directly to jail and not collect $200.

The rest of your post I am mostly in line with. We’ve got huge structural deficiencies but given the fact the season is done I’d not be rushing back anyone just yet. May & Lever to play when ready. We will have to persist with Oscar for a bit longer.

And for anyone coming in here to try and make us feel better, we aren’t Richmond of 16. Richmond played finals for 3 years. We didn’t and haven’t. The way we went into this year was really unfortunate, injuries specifically. All we can do is try and get through the second half of the year unscathed to key players, try and pinch another couple of wins, and just get everyone who needs it into surgery and rehab about round 20 with a focus on an additional month recovery.
 

Damon_3388

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Jun 23, 2008
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For longer-term Melbourne fans, does this have a similar feel to the mid-90s? The Demons made the prelim (from 7th place) in 1994 with a similar young-ish squad, got smashed by eventual premier West Coast in Perth, then injuries and general malaise hit in the years that followed, and they won 20 games total in the next three seasons (1995-1997).

I'd like to see how you do with a fit and ready Lever at CHB, and May at FB. This season is a bit of a write-off for those players and the team, though.
 

rhaz

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 30, 2008
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For longer-term Melbourne fans, does this have a similar feel to the mid-90s? The Demons made the prelim (from 7th place) in 1994 with a similar young-ish squad, got smashed by eventual premier West Coast in Perth, then injuries and general malaise hit in the years that followed, and they won 20 games total in the next three seasons (1995-1997).

I'd like to see how you do with a fit and ready Lever at CHB, and May at FB. This season is a bit of a write-off for those players and the team, though.
Thanks for coming here and making us feel better

Appreciated

...
 
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