Opinion Why are the interstate teams so bad? How do we fix them?

[Swanssince91]

I think this is reasonable, perhaps go further and do the same for nsw and qld.

I know we would do it tougher than most but I'd be all for it.
The GWS academy zone is really strong and between the two clubs we could make it work

 

[andreww90]

Until we get a more even competition in the terms of travel the vic teams are always going to have a massive advantage, there is no denying it.

So this season Collingwood spend a total of 12 hours on flights for a total of 7300km compared to brisbane a total of 19 hours and a distance of 19 087km and Fremantle with highest for the year of 43 hours on a flight and a distance of 30732km.

Whilst travel between different clubs remains that vast the advantages to certain clubs is undeniable.

 

[Farang83150]

Until we get a more even competition in the terms of travel the vic teams are always going to have a massive advantage, there is no denying it.

So this season Collingwood spend a total of 12 hours on flights for a total of 7300km compared to brisbane a total of 19 hours and a distance of 19 087km and Fremantle with highest for the year of 43 hours on a flight and a distance of 30732km.

Whilst travel between different clubs remains that vast the advantages to certain clubs is undeniable.

You may as well just have posted the article....

 

[Swanssince91]

Until we get a more even competition in the terms of travel the vic teams are always going to have a massive advantage, there is no denying it.

So this season Collingwood spend a total of 12 hours on flights for a total of 7300km compared to brisbane a total of 19 hours and a distance of 19 087km and Fremantle with highest for the year of 43 hours on a flight and a distance of 30732km.

Whilst travel between different clubs remains that vast the advantages to certain clubs is undeniable.

I do remember a stat from years ago showing that teams that travelled to the west lost their next games quite a bit

 

[Pistol Night]

Until we get a more even competition in the terms of travel the vic teams are always going to have a massive advantage, there is no denying it.

So this season Collingwood spend a total of 12 hours on flights for a total of 7300km compared to brisbane a total of 19 hours and a distance of 19 087km and Fremantle with highest for the year of 43 hours on a flight and a distance of 30732km.

Whilst travel between different clubs remains that vast the advantages to certain clubs is undeniable.

This is inevitable unless Vic goes back to having 2 clubs

 

[andreww90]

You may as well just have posted the article....

Go and ahead a post it ? How dare i use information from an article??? You fart gobbler

 

[Swanssince91]

This is inevitable unless Vic goes back to having 2 clubs

Do you acknowledge that it's harder?

 

[Farang83150]

You'd think a very simple and obvious first step would be not fixturing teams from the West to play in Tassie.

 

[Pistol Night]

Do you acknowledge that it's harder?

Of course. Geography is hard to equilise

 

[Grin]

I just wanted a yes or no

You got your answer. Not an excuse for you to wine.
Any chance you might give me the same courtesy and answer mine?

Father son advantages vic clubs that helps them during home and away.

Marquee timeslots advantages vic clubs, that help them retain talent which advantages them during home and away season.

More home ground talent on list makes it easier and cheaper to retain talent. Once again an advantage

Got any evidence that demonstrates that reflects your alleged advantages in the real world? I've asked a couple of times now.

The reason I asked is genuine. As we know, non-Victorian clubs have no net disadvantage in the home and away season. So if you can demonstrate that this is an advantage, there must be advantages going the other way.

 

[Soggy2112]

I just don't think anyone wants to talk about the fact that the interstate teams being quoted aren't that great and have their home and away records pumped up all year, then get found out in finals.

Alright, let’s analyse that and look at their away records. For this I’m not counting “neutral” games (anything at Marvel or MCG for Vic, and anything in the non-Vic club’s state):

2017: Adelaide 6-3-1 (60% win rate), Richmond 4-3 (57% win rate)
2015: West Coast 6-3-1 (60% win rate), Hawthorn 3-2 (60% win rate)
2014: Sydney 9-1 (90% win rate), Hawthorn 2-3 (40% win rate)

If their away performances were in all cases better than their opponents, what supports your claim that these teams had their home and away records “pumped up”?

I guess my question to you would then be, if the non-Vic teams aren’t actually that good, rely on home ground advantage and therefore get found out on GF day, why are they consistently worse and what can be done to improve them?

And if they’re not consistently worse teams, what is the cause of their consistently worse GF performances?

A much bigger contribution that where you slept, or the ground.

You are isolating stats.

Sydney beat Hawthorn.
Brisbane beat Collingwood.
Adelaide beat North.

And those teams all had lost their previous match-up prior to the GF.

So does that then make it 6-4?

It is dramatically watered down.

Yes it does.

It doesnt create a 10 goal belting, that is a team not showing up.

In 2003 Collingwood were the higher ranked team, beat Brisbane in the QF and then were belted in a GF by the seasoned team of veterans who turned the tables on us.

Collingwood played 11 H&A games at the G, to Brisbane's 1.

Collingwood shat the bed and didnt show up, it happens...only losers look to play the blame game.

I’m not looking to play the blame game. We absolutely don’t deserve to be premiers in 2017. Everyone knows the rules and we didn’t show up.

However, when non-Victorian clubs won 8 of 10 premierships from 1997-2006 there were rightly questions asked about why that discrepancy existed and things were done.

We’re now in a situation where Victorian clubs have won 15 of the last 17 premierships. Why does that discrepancy exist. If the answer is the teams are worse than why? And if they’re not, why aren’t they performing on GF day?

 

[go_the_dockers]

You got your answer. Not an excuse for you to wine.
Any chance you might give me the same courtesy and answer mine?

Got any evidence that demonstrates that reflects your alleged advantages in the real world? I've asked a couple of times now.

The reason I asked is genuine. As we know, non-Victorian clubs have no net disadvantage in the home and away season. So if you can demonstrate that this is an advantage, there must be advantages going the other way.

About which one?

Are you doubting getting top 5 talent for 3rd round picks, is not an advantage?

Are you saying losing top 10 picks after 2 or 4 years, won't hurt a club?

 

[Swanssince91]

You got your answer. Not an excuse for you to wine.
Any chance you might give me the same courtesy and answer mine?

Got any evidence that demonstrates that reflects your alleged advantages in the real world? I've asked a couple of times now.

The reason I asked is genuine. As we know, non-Victorian clubs have no net disadvantage in the home and away season. So if you can demonstrate that this is an advantage, there must be advantages going the other way.

No I don't agree with yours

 

[Grin]

Would you be happy for your club to fly every second week and do you think it has a negative affect on the players?

Would I be happy for my club to play every second week with a home state advantage? Sure.
You're obviously not though. Do you have any evidence that travel and home state advantage every other week results a net disadvantage to non-Victorian clubs.

 

[Swanssince91]

Would I be happy for my club to play every second week with a home state advantage? Sure.
You're obviously not though. Do you have any evidence that travel and home state advantage every other week results a net disadvantage to non-Victorian clubs.

Is it harder to travel 4 times the distance of another club.
Is that the question?

 

[Farang83150]

Would I be happy for my club to play every second week with a home state advantage? Sure.
You're obviously not though. Do you have any evidence that travel and home state advantage every other week results a net disadvantage to non-Victorian clubs.

So in your opinion clubs traveling so much more than others has no adverse affects on players?

 

[Grin]

Until we get a more even competition in the terms of travel the vic teams are always going to have a massive advantage, there is no denying it.

So this season Collingwood spend a total of 12 hours on flights for a total of 7300km compared to brisbane a total of 19 hours and a distance of 19 087km and Fremantle with highest for the year of 43 hours on a flight and a distance of 30732km.

Whilst travel between different clubs remains that vast the advantages to certain clubs is undeniable.

Any evidence of the massive advantage that Vic clubs have. If it is indeed as undeniable as you claim, there should be heaps.
It would obviously be reflected in on field success for a start. I wonder how this alleged undeniable massive advantage explains the 1 flag between all of the 5 Marvel Stadium based tenants this century?

I'm obviously not naive enough to expect a rational, reasoned response.

 

[Soggy2112]

Would I be happy for my club to play every second week with a home state advantage? Sure.
You're obviously not though. Do you have any evidence that travel and home state advantage every other week results a net disadvantage to non-Victorian clubs.

From a sheer numbers point of view I think the added advantage of playing a home match every second week is neutralised by the disadvantage of playing an away match every second week.

The interesting question, and one that probably only a really experienced high performance boss could answer, is to what level does the extra travel effect players fatigue levels and ability to train, prepare and recover, compared to Vic clubs? You’d have to assume it has some impact, however it is largely unavoidable. Limiting the amount of “extra” travel required could be one solution. E.g. Adelaide this year played in Tasmania, Ballarat and Darwin. Could the league look at limiting it so each club only has to make one trip to a country/boutique (whatever you call it) venue per season?

 

[Grin]

About which one?

Are you doubting getting top 5 talent for 3rd round picks, is not an advantage?

Are you saying losing top 10 picks after 2 or 4 years, won't hurt a club?

What I'm trying to do is have a rational conversation. You seem to be intent on having a teary whinge with nothing to support the terrible discrimination you emotionally feel your club endures.

I ask yet again: Do you have any actual evidence that shows that your perceived injustices are reflected in the real world. Trying to wear people down with whinging isn't evidence.

 

[Grin]

No I don't agree with yours

So you accept that statistical evidence that non-Victorian clubs are disadvantaged in grand finals, but reject the much stronger statistically evidence that non-Victorian clubs are not disadvantaged in the home and away season and in finals apart from grand finals.
At least you tacitly admit to being irrational I suppose.

 

[Swanssince91]

What I'm trying to do is have a rational conversation. You seem to be intent on having a teary whinge with nothing to support the terrible discrimination you emotionally feel your club endures.

I ask yet again: Do you have any actual evidence that shows that your perceived injustices are reflected in the real world. Trying to wear people down with whinging isn't evidence.

Why should we provide evidence? Isn't it just common sense?

 

[Grin]

Is it harder to travel 4 times the distance of another club.
Is that the question?

No. The question is: Is there any real world evidence of net disadvantage from travelling and having home state advantage every other week.

I don't expect a rational answer.

 

[Swanssince91]

No. The question is: Is there any real world evidence of net disadvantage from travelling and having home state advantage every other week.

I don't expect a rational answer.

I'm not wasting my time looking for evidence.
It doesn't take Einstein to work out travelling more affects you more

 

[Grin]

So in your opinion clubs traveling so much more than others has no adverse affects on players?

My opinion or how I feel has nothing to do with it. The statistical evidence, over decades now, shows that travel and home state advantage every other week results in no non-Victorian disadvantage. If anything, the evidence and statics indicate a modest net advantage for non-Victorian clubs.

You need to take your emotions, feelings of entitlement and the victim narrative out of the equation, as overwhelming as those things obviously are for you, and present the evidence.

 

[Swanssince91]

My opinion or how I feel has nothing to do with it. The statistical evidence, over decades now, shows that travel and home state advantage every other week results in no non-Victorian disadvantage. If anything, the evidence and statics indicate a modest net advantage for non-Victorian clubs.

You need to take your emotions, feelings of entitlement and the victim narrative out of the equation, as overwhelming as those things obviously are for you, and present the evidence.

No worries Pythagoras