Hawthorn FC worst nightmare the 2017 Draft

[Blue1980]

Bolton became Coach of the Year favourite after you lot beat GWS. So apparently sometimes a single win matters.

Well that didn't happen, no one was claiming coach of the year.

Overall, it's more based on expectation with us. People thought we would maybe win 3-4 games all year and are similar standard to you guys currently.

Hawthorn were expected to be no lower than a little outside the 8.

 

[Blue1980]

I can confirm that Jack Trengove is one of them

Jack Trengove and Rockliff? Thats sure to push them back into flag contention

 

[threesixpio]

What is this I don't even?

Is your list management strategy to replace outgoing players with guys who aren't as good and you'll still win because Hawthorn?

I reckon Tom Mitchell and Jaegar could potentially be on the same level as Sammy and Lewis. Honestly do.

Burton is a Gibson replacement.

All we need is a Burgoyne and Hodge replacement ...





Um...man ....that's not going to be easy

 

[Pessimistic]

What is this I don't even?

Is your list management strategy to replace outgoing players with guys who aren't as good and you'll still win because Hawthorn?

I'm saying to get into 'pinch a flag' contention like c2008

In contrast the vibe against seems to be 'unless you replace your three/four pete champions like for like you'll spend a few years at the bottom of the ladder.

really theres a huge variation in list strength between those two statements

 

[Pessimistic]

I reckon Tom Mitchell and Jaegar could potentially be on the same level as Sammy and Lewis. Honestly do.

Burton is a Gibson replacement.

All we need is a Burgoyne and Hodge replacement ...





Um...man ....that's not going to be easy

Don't want a huge argument but surely Burton can be a Hodge type

 

[threesixpio]

Don't want a huge argument but surely Burton can be a Hodge type

It's an argument I'm more than happy to lose Pess!

 

[yeahmate]

What does that have to do with Hawthorn's 2016 off-season and the 2017 draft?

Collingwood have made heaps of mistakes recently, and rightly ridiculed for them.

If you want to talk about Collingwood, go post in one of the multiple Buckley threads floating around.

This is the thread where people are discussing how a clubs decision to move on their top two performed players in the BnF for nothing, and giving up an unprecedented amount of draft collateral for a bloke with a huge injury question mark was crazy.

That a club ending up bottom four, but not having access to top end draft talent is a nightmare scenario.

Hawthorn fans believe their club doesn't adhere to the normal cyclical nature of the AFL, because they won 3 in a row you see. They will return to the top again...it is what Hawthorn does.

A top thread.

Moving on Mitchell and Lewis was 100% the right thing to do. Jury still out on the O'Meara deal but still too early to call and the risk is worth the reward. It certainly wont be the massive set back hoped for by the drama queens in this thread even if its a bust. Access to top draft picks is only one part of the equation. It doesn't guarantee success as has been seen time and time again. Player development, good coaching and a good club environment play huge roles in successful clubs. Nothing I've seen suggests Hawthorn has dropped off in those areas so its reasonable to expect the club is as well placed as any to rebuild.

 

[Marc_Remillard]

Jack Trengove and Rockliff? Thats sure to push them back into flag contention

He'll give them more value than Vickery

 

[Pessimistic]

They don't need top end talent.

They can replace Hodge, Burgoyne, Mitchell etc. with lesser players and still win premierships because Hawthorn.

A premiership. single. Im talking a hawks 2008 or sydney 2014 strength side not a Lions, Cats, Hawks 2013-2015 strength side

In 2008 Hodge Mitchell were young so not at the level they got to in 2013-15

Who's to say Tom Mitchell can't have steady improvement until he reaches the best of Sam Mitchell?

Sammy famously had a some big games he was tagged out of (2018 GF)

 

[WWSD]

Jack Trengove and Rockliff? Thats sure to push them back into flag contention

Rockliff is a very good footballer and would greatly improve Hawthorns midfield both in the clearances and contested possessions.

Trengove on the other hand wouldn't make a difference and I highly doubt he's the player Hawthorn are going after. Rockliff who's only 27, would take some pressure off Mitchell. Imagine Rockliff, Mitchell and a fit O'Meara together on the MCG.

C: Shiels, Mitchell, Smith
R: Ceglar, Rockliff, O'Meara

 

[SA HAWK]

I reckon Tom Mitchell and Jaegar could potentially be on the same level as Sammy and Lewis. Honestly do.

Burton is a Gibson replacement.

All we need is a Burgoyne and Hodge replacement ...





Um...man ....that's not going to be easy

Neither of those 2 will get anywhere near the level as Sammy one of the smartest most skilful players I have seen.

 

[threesixpio]

Neither of those 2 will get anywhere near the level as Sammy one of the smartest most skilful players I have seen.

Sure - but not every flag winning team needs a player as good as Sammy. Let's just say that both could become elite mids. I reckon Tommy is already there

 

[Blue1980]

Rockliff is a very good footballer and would greatly improve Hawthorns midfield both in the clearances and contested possessions.

Trengove on the other hand wouldn't make a difference and I highly doubt he's the player Hawthorn are going after. Rockliff who's only 27, would take some pressure off Mitchell. Imagine Rockliff, Mitchell and a fit O'Meara together on the MCG.

C: Shiels, Mitchell, Smith
R: Ceglar, Rockliff, O'Meara

Rockliff would take the pressure off Mitchell yes

The JOM is obviously a big if

 

[Blue1980]

He'll give them more value than Vickery

Damning with very faint praise

 

[SA HAWK]

I can confirm that Jack Trengove is one of them

Certainly hope not.

Feel sorry for him a promising career cut down by injury.

 

[HairyO]

Well that didn't happen, no one was claiming coach of the year.

Last week it was Bolton and Hardwick. Now not so much Hardwick.

 

[HairyO]

He'll give them more value than Vickery

Vickery was a 1 year while Ceglar repairs. He was always a backup.

Were any other experienced ruck/forwards available last year and willing to have a 1 year chance?

We had to go 2 years to get Richmond the compensation they wanted, and will stretch it to 3 so each individual year is not a huge hit on our cap.

 

[Scotland]

I'm saying to get into 'pinch a flag' contention like c2008

In contrast the vibe against seems to be 'unless you replace your three/four pete champions like for like you'll spend a few years at the bottom of the ladder.

really theres a huge variation in list strength between those two statements

A premiership. single. Im talking a hawks 2008 or sydney 2014 strength side not a Lions, Cats, Hawks 2013-2015 strength side

In 2008 Hodge Mitchell were young so not at the level they got to in 2013-15

Who's to say Tom Mitchell can't have steady improvement until he reaches the best of Sam Mitchell?

Sammy famously had a some big games he was tagged out of (2018 GF)

Sam Mitchell and Luke Hodge were 130+ gamers in 2008, not kids. They were both B&F winners and Hodge was an AA.

If you don't replace the players you have with players as good, you won't be as good. That's how footy works. I'm not personally relegating you to years of wooden spoons, but I've seen first hand how hard it is to replace genuine stars of the comp.

Do you want Hawthorn to get back to being Hawthorn 2013-2015 or would you be happy being West Coast 2007-2017? We've never replaced Cousins, Judd and Kerr and have consequently never been as good. We've been lucky that Mackenzie and now McGovern have been almost as good as Glass, Kennedy has been a star and Naitanui while very different to Cox has given us a damaging ruckman but our midfield is still ordinary and we've been pretty average most of the last decade.

Tom Mitchell is a good footballer, but if he is your best player you won't be winning flags.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

Yeah I think he has played well this year and can go on another year at this stage

good for you

 

[estibador]

Well you bent them over in that deal, with Croad heading back 2? seasons later

McPharlin turned out to be a great Freo player but not #1 value

Get outta here.

Riewoldt and Hodge aside, McPharlin compares favourably to any #1 pick in history. He flew under the radar over here for much of his career, if he'd played for a high profile Vic club he'd be held in much higher esteem. Any club would be happy to get a player of that quality with the first pick.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

I can confirm that Jack Trengove is one of them

High draft pick with injuries? Yep, sounds like a hawthorn target

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Get outta here.

Riewoldt and Hodge aside, McPharlin compares favourably to any #1 pick in history. He flew under the radar over here for much of his career, if he'd played for a high profile Vic club he'd be held in much higher esteem. Any club would be happy to get a player of that quality with the first pick.

like that pavlich guy that flew under the radar all those years, and fyfe - freo players just never get any hype or recognition

 

[estibador]

like that pavlich guy that flew under the radar all those years, and fyfe - freo players just never get any hype or recognition

Some do, some don't. McPharlin and Roger Hayden are two who didn't get the recognition they deserved.

 

[Scotland]

Defenders generally don't get a lot of recognition. Glass was AA 4 times and wasn't really talked about until 2012 when he was the AA captain.

McPharlin was every bit as good as the top key defenders of the 2000s.

 

[Kram]

Defenders generally don't get a lot of recognition.

Unless their name is Rance..