NFL 2021 — NFL Pre-Draft Discussion

[Exe Gesis]

 

[Exe Gesis]

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Surprised Jones isn't #1 honestly. He throws a very underrated deep ball for a bloke everyone says has a weak arm.

 

[Exe Gesis]

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

No mention of the Feleipe Franks.

 

[nobbyiscool]

He doesn't remember a combination of Shanahan and RBs getting them to the Superbowl last year?

I'm not huge on Jones, and I'm outraged that Fields is dropping according to experts, cos it's down to race and stereotypes - but Jones isn't going to be a make or break QB. I think they like him cos of the options available at 3, he probably has the lowest ceiling, but the highest floor. He's going to be your very mediocre, 10-15th ranked QB and it's the coaching and play-calling that will make or break Shanahan, cos that's what Jones' success will rely on.

I'm thinking guys like Andy Dalton or 49ers Alex Smith - they won't win you too many games on their own arm, the aim is to build around them to the point that success isn't entirely reliant on them.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

He doesn't remember a combination of Shanahan and RBs getting them to the Superbowl last year?

I'm not huge on Jones, and I'm outraged that Fields is dropping according to experts, cos it's down to race and stereotypes - but Jones isn't going to be a make or break QB. I think they like him cos of the options available at 3, he probably has the lowest ceiling, but the highest floor. He's going to be your very mediocre, 10-15th ranked QB and it's the coaching and play-calling that will make or break Shanahan, cos that's what Jones' success will rely on.

I'm thinking guys like Andy Dalton or 49ers Alex Smith - they won't win you too many games on their own arm, the aim is to build around them to the point that success isn't entirely reliant on them.

I don't buy the race and sterotype stuff sorry mate, I'd go as far as to say that it's nonsense. If it was true how do explain Trey Lance being a top 10 pick?

 

[Exe Gesis]

I've still got about 40 QBs I'm still analyzing, but so far here's my rankings...

Ist Rounders....gotta be happy with nabbing one of these.....
Justin Fields
Mac Jones
Trevor Lawrence
Zach Wilson (fears of drew lock floor, but aaron rodgers ceiling)

Late 1st to mid 2nd....
Trey Lance
Kyle Trask

Chance of a mid-late round sleeper a la Brady....
KJ Costello
Peyton Ramsey
Shane Buechele

Forget the rest....
Davis Mills
Kellen Mond (locks on badly, no pocket presence, analysts be pissing on your back about him)
Ian Book
Sam Ehlinger
Jamie Newman
Feleipe Franks

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

I've still got about 40 QBs I'm still analyzing, but so far here's my rankings...

Ist Rounders....gotta be happy with nabbing one of these.....
Justin Fields
Mac Jones
Trevor Lawrence
Zach Wilson (fears of drew lock floor, but aaron rodgers ceiling)

Late 1st to mid 2nd....
Trey Lance
Kyle Trask

Chance of a mid-late round sleeper a la Brady....
KJ Costello
Peyton Ramsey
Shane Buechele

Forget the rest....
Davis Mills
Kellen Mond (locks on badly, no pocket presence, analysts be pissing on your back about him)
Ian Book
Sam Ehlinger
Jamie Newman
Feleipe Franks

I've heard people talk up Newman recently.

I don't see the Drew Lock comparison with Zach that a lot of people make. Explain it to me.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

I'd say his floor comparison is much more Sam Darnold. (Strangely enough)

 

[Exe Gesis]

I've heard people talk up Newman recently.

I don't see the Drew Lock comparison with Zach that a lot of people make. Explain it to me.

Newman is being talked up because hes a specimen, over 6'3 and 220 or so, some mobility. The guys being talked up are all specimens, protypical olden days 6'3 220 type guys. But Newman sucks. I think Franks probably has more ceiling than him. And Franks is pretty erratic.

Drew Lock comparison, in the way he slinks and gets a little cute, bad reads, or a slave to the play-design, boxed in to it. Jeckyl and Hyde to him, because then he shows Rodgers like play, vision and touch. He's very inconsistent and only 2020 of real production. Go to 2019 games and his accuracy etc was pretty bad. There's a risk of inconsistency or his game falling apart if the team he goes to struggle with play-calling, play-design, and replace OC end of the season.

Guys like Jones, Fields and Lawrence (despite his flaws), are far more rock solid, consistent.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Newman is being talked up because hes a specimen, over 6'3 and 220 or so, some mobility. The guys being talked up are all specimens, protypical olden days 6'3 220 type guys. But Newman sucks. I think Franks probably has more ceiling than him. And Franks is pretty erratic.

Drew Lock comparison, in the way he slinks and gets a little cute, bad reads, or a slave to the play-design, boxed in to it. Jeckyl and Hyde to him, because then he shows Rodgers like play, vision and touch. He's very inconsistent and only 2020 of real production. Go to 2019 games and his accuracy etc was pretty bad. There's a risk of inconsistency or his game falling apart if the team he goes to struggle with play-calling, play-design, and replace OC end of the season.

Guys like Jones, Fields and Lawrence (despite his flaws), are far more rock solid, consistent.

I wouldn't read too much into 2019 after having shoulder surgery, other than he is an injury risk.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Drew Lock to me has a far slower processor than Wilson. The play book had to be dumbed down for him this year also apparently. Won't be any such issues with Zach.

I get it from a turnover perspective . But I think they really aren't anything like each other.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Guys like Bouchele and Ramsey are total studs, but because theyre 6'0 and run a 4.80 or so, get talked down and people dont hear about them. But I'd almost even put them above Lance, and Trask above Lance. Lance has tools, but he faced very mediocre competition and had some really awful play. He gets talked up because hes a specimen with upside but very inconsistent, needs work, etc. Kinda like a Deshone Kizer.

Trask unfairly slammed too. He's good. His arm aint that s**t. I like guys (Jones, Trask, Bouchele, Ramsey) who show real alertness in the pocket, going thru their reads very quickly, not dance around a lot, and can make a decisive decision to throw the ball to a one-on-one, after going thru a bunch of reads. They sort of swivel about in the pocket left and right and back left then right.

Mond for instance, I was shocked how s**t he was in the pocket. He locks on to one read and has zero awareness around him, doesnt even read pre-snap defense, no protection calls, no idea of whos blitzing or making hot reads and alerts etc. Hes got a nice arm, and legs, but he sucks.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Guys like Bouchele and Ramsey are total studs, but because theyre 6'0 and run a 4.80 or so, get talked down and people dont hear about them. But I'd almost even put them above Lance, and Trask above Lance. Lance has tools, but he faced very mediocre competition and had some really awful play. He gets talked up because hes a specimen with upside but very inconsistent, needs work, etc. Kinda like a Deshone Kizer.

Trask unfairly slammed too. He's good. His arm aint that sh*t. I like guys (Jones, Trask, Bouchele, Ramsey) who show real alertness in the pocket, going thru their reads very quickly, not dance around a lot, and can make a decisive decision to throw the ball to a one-on-one, after going thru a bunch of reads. They sort of swivel about in the pocket left and right and back left then right.

Mond for instance, I was shocked how sh*t he was in the pocket. He locks on to one read and has zero awareness around him, doesnt even read pre-snap defense, no protection calls, no idea of whos blitzing or making hot reads and alerts etc. Hes got a nice arm, and legs, but he sucks.

Trask just has no upside , that's why I think everyone is low on him. There is nothing to look at and say "that's pretty special" other than his size. His arm is weak for someone as big as him and his footwork can be a mess at time quite frankly.

Low end starter material or career backup. Will never be a top 10 QB.

 

[Exe Gesis]

Trask just has no upside , that's why I think everyone is low on him. There is nothing to look at and say "that's pretty special" other than his size. His arm is weak for someone as big as him and his footwork can be a mess at time quite frankly.

Low end starter material or career backup. Will never be a top 10 QB.

The amount of truly special QBs is very rare. Nothing wrong with getting a decent 5 year starter by drafting a guy like Trask. There's no upside except good solid QB play, like say Kirk Cousins. He isn't special but he's good, solid. Was a 4th rounder. Trask could do well at say the Bears, drafted 2nd round. If what he gives you is what he gave the Gators, nothing wrong with that.

 

[Exe Gesis]

My complete QB Rankings....the Sleepers and Super Sleepers are especially where my interest lies....

---Franchise QBs---
Justin Fields
Mac Jones
Trevor Lawrence
Zach Wilson

---Potential Franchise QBs---
Trey Lance
Kyle Trask
Kellen Mond

---Sleepers--- (most wont amount to anything but could rise a la Minshew/Romo/Warner)
KJ Costello
Peyton Ramsey
Shane Buechele

---Super Sleepers--- (possess some extraordinary talent or skill or ideal height/arm element, but from small schools etc)
Cole Kelley
Kato Nelson
Armani Rogers
Eric Berriere
Drew Plitt
Colin Hill
Davis Cheek
Ross Bowers
Kevin Thomson
Jack Abraham
Felix Harper

---Probably won't amount to anything but not without talent---
Jamie Newman
Ian Book
Davis Mills
Sam Ehlinger
Feleipe Franks
Rogan Wells
Brady White
Zach Thomas
Brady Davis

---Next to no chance---
EJ Perry
Aqeel Glass
Bailey Zappe
Sawyer Smith
Grant Breneman
Mike Collins
Daniel Smith
Chris Ferguson

 

[Exe Gesis]

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

I've still got about 40 QBs I'm still analyzing, but so far here's my rankings...

Ist Rounders....gotta be happy with nabbing one of these.....
Justin Fields
Mac Jones
Trevor Lawrence
Zach Wilson (fears of drew lock floor, but aaron rodgers ceiling)

Late 1st to mid 2nd....
Trey Lance
Kyle Trask

Chance of a mid-late round sleeper a la Brady....
KJ Costello
Peyton Ramsey
Shane Buechele

Forget the rest....
Davis Mills
Kellen Mond (locks on badly, no pocket presence, analysts be pissing on your back about him)
Ian Book
Sam Ehlinger
Jamie Newman
Feleipe Franks

Truly hysterical stuff

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

The only negative about Chris Simms is that he takes away the enjoyment of the draft and analysing QBs. There's simply no point anymore. He's laid it all out for us already

 

[Exe Gesis]

The only negative about Chris Simms is that he takes away the enjoyment of the draft and analysing QBs. There's simply no point anymore. He's laid it all out for us already

Dunno why you anchored yourself to Simms. Thats the amazing thing

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Dunno why you anchored yourself to Simms. Thats the amazing thing

Because he's right every time, simple

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Dunno why you anchored yourself to Simms. Thats the amazing thing

It's very strange indeed. Almost like after the Josh Rosen disaster LA decided his own thoughts were no longer good enough.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

It's very strange indeed. Almost like after the Josh Rosen disaster LA decided his own thoughts were no longer good enough.

Should've followed Simms for sure on that one. I remember too when I was a Simms hater but now I feel so silly. Specifically I remember following 2013 his list of the top 5 QBs having Peyton 4th and Brady missing. I thought he was so *ed but over time you grow to realise he was correct. Stats and teammates are irrelevant

 

[Exe Gesis]

It's very strange indeed. Almost like after the Josh Rosen disaster LA decided his own thoughts were no longer good enough.

Some people want it easy, not have to think for themselves, or even question the opinions/analyses of others. Never thought LA would become one of those