Oppo Camp Non-Essendon Football Thread XVII

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Ati Tude said:
They started their autopsy thread at half time and have a thread that started a week ago saying to get rid of Clarko. As dire as we have been at times, we have never been Norf dire.

They do have a ton of talent. If they dont leave, you'd think they have to come good.
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every time they lose they rev up the sack [coach] thread.

like... you dont just become good under a good coach, that's not how anything works. it's immature and disappointing
 

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how many games until Clarkson loses his shit?
 
I'm so intrigued by where Geelong is headed. Sure, this is only North but they've got a lot of the next gen on display.

I'm going to go early on their talls. I doubt we've ever seen a spine put together like this on the run and via the draft, certainly not without NGA and father-son assistance (Footscray I'm looking at you).

Due to the limit on key position spots, the cost of recruiting top end KPPs and the time it takes them to develop you can almost tell who will make it based on nothing more than the circumstances in which they are recruited. That's not to say they necessarily become stars but the combination of investment and opportunity will create a self-fulfilling prophecy (as long as injury doesn't intervene). It's particularly the case with ruckmen, as the prospect has to be appealing enough for the club to be prepared to get nothing out of it for 3 to 4 years but to see enough to justify that investment. Clubs are usually very careful with the ruckmen they take in the national draft. Even great prospects are now falling well down the order.

Anyway, from a side that won a flag as recently as 2022, and which will push into the top 4 again this season, you could hardly ask for a future group already on the list with more raw potential than:

FB: SDK - 204cm, pick 19 (R1), 2019 draft
CHB: O'Sullivan - 198cm, pick 11, 2023 draft
R1: Conway - >206cm, pick 24 (R2), 2021 draft
FF: Neale - 203cm, pick 33 (R2), 2020 draft

R2/CHF?: Edwards - 206cm, pick 32 (R2), 2023 draft


SDK is already one of the better KPDs in the league. At 204cm, with his speed and power he can play on any of the modern key forwards. It also makes him the perfect player to build a defence around. He's 23 / a 5th year player.

At CHB, you've got Connor O'Sullivan 198cm, 92kg pick 11 they drafted 6 months ago. I've not seen anything of him. I put this down to his reputation preceding him. He's going to have James Kelley and Tom Stewart teaching him as he adapts to life with Jake Kolo, J. Henry, T Stewart and SDK around him. It's probably harder not to realise your potential in that context. He's on the list and has 2 to 3 more seasons to learn the craft under no pressure. Maybe he just kicks the door in at the start of year 3 like SDK did.

In the middle there is Toby Conway who is now in his third year. He's a monster of a kid, drafted at 206cm but I understand may now be closer to 210cm. From what I have seen of him, he's Tim English who is a natural tap ruck and for who the physical side of the game comes naturally. I believe he has the natural footy ability to accumulate like English or Grundy can but I don't see him as that style of player in the end - he'll play more of a classic big man game. I would hold this view about Conway if he wasn't a Falcon, wasn't picked in the mid-20s and wasn't likely the guy they were targeting at least 2 years before they could recruit him (i.e. the self-fulfilling component).

I really, really like the look of Shannon Neale, too. I see him as the Hawkins replacement. He's another that is a really big, 203cm and well over 100kgs. He's a powerhouse athlete who clearly has the raw ability to be a top line KPP. The issue there is whether he can develop the forward craft required to lead a forward line (as opposed to being more like Rory Lobb without the spoogey personality or maybe the best version of Josh Jenkins). That combination of size, explosive power and aggression in the air may be the best in the AFL. When you have those tools and can convert you don't need too much else to be very effective.

Draft watchers will tell you that Edwards, a 206cm bean pole, is another of those freakish talls who can play the game as a midfielder and who has the athleticism and endurance to run with them. Frankly, I don't love the style of player as a ruckman. There are obvious issues with putting weight on the bean pole, and whether the rig is one that will carry the weight required. Having said that, from what I can tell, he looks more SDK / Archer Reid than Zach Reid but that's all based on how he looks against other kids. The thing that gets me here is that the Cats were prepared to invest in another of these ruckman 'sliders' when they would already be planning on Conway leading their ruck division from 2025/2026 for at least 10 years. I think they will look to develop him as a CHF - a project that may not be as unlikely as it would otherwise be if he was just a ruckman and not as much of a natural footballer. I beleive Edwards is the player they will try to replace Cameron with when his time's up.

Maybe I give them too much credit. History says you're not going to get a FF and CHF out of 2 guys who have to learn the role, no matter how freakish their athleticism. I do believe this is what they're trying to do. It otherwise makes not sense to have tied up all of that draft capital in 4 guys who will need to play ruck minutes. That's not how lists are put together, not even by us as our worst (at least there are 3 positions on the field at any one time for tall defenders).

It may be that Ollie Henry is the main man who ties things together in the way Stevie J did when the Cats didn't really have a gun key forward (as Tom Hawkins did not become that until after 2011). If anyone is going to be able to pull it off, the Cats will. If they pull it off, well, they might actually start winning back to back flags.
 
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Yoda_ said:
They are statistically worse than Fitzroy, when do the real calls of shutting the doors start?
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Fitzroy were also a financial basket case and the AFL also had a vested interest in seeing a team relocate - there was a financial reward being offered for teams to merge back then and Don Scott had to step in to prevent Melbourne and Hawthorne merging at one point.

that said, there might be an opportunity to move them to Tassie.
 
DERO said:
Fitzroy were also a financial basket case and the AFL also had a vested interest in seeing a team relocate - there was a financial reward being offered for teams to merge back then and Don Scott had to step in to prevent Melbourne and Hawthorne merging at one point.

that said, there might be an opportunity to move them to Tassie.
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helps ease the need for a bye
 
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