Autopsy Round 10 - West Coast v St Kilda

[Klaatu]

Part of our issue is the promo of Enright & putting Rivers in charge of defence, we leak goals easily & the ruthless discipline attitude is gone.

 

[westernsainter]

Player Ratings and other key stats

 

[Saints TV]

 

[beside the seaside]

I'm a bit miffed about the list management position we are in. We lost Battle and got a good return for him but didn't replace him. Now we are throwing Keeler and Caminiti all over the place and this week we pick McLennan. It's just genuinely bizarre. At the same time we seem to have decided that Heath isn't good enough. If that's the case then why did we offer him an extension?

Pretty confident we go bottom four from here and when you look at the deficiencies in every area of the ground it's not surprising, but jeez it's frustrating.

Just in this game I thought Owens was terrible. From the first clearance when he was trailing his man and allowed a rebound goal, to his awful misses. Collard was also terrible. The forward pressure was pathetic all round.

The backline which was such a strength for years is now an utter shambles.

If it ends up a bottom four year and we can re-sign Nas then so be it, but if we lose him as a result then we are really going nowhere. It's all well and good to be young but we need to be winning.

 

[BrutThough]

Part of our issue is the promo of Enright & putting Rivers in charge of defence, we leak goals easily & the ruthless discipline attitude is gone.

You dont think could potentially be more personal driven than coaching at the moment?

 

[CaptainRisky]

Took a day off work and went for a swim to forget about the footy and all the bad decisions we make and Jack Billing’s here to tell me there’s no escaping this misery lol

Just remember you're the sick puppy with the phone in the sauna taking pics LOL

 

[AirWinmar]

Yeah but swap Keeler and Heath. Keeler worth persisting with as a forward because he does pretty things occasionally and he's so strong in the contest, and if Heath is any good at all then he can quickly adjust to playing AFL-level key back even though he's never played back there ever before.

Keeler needs to build confidence back up for a little while in the 2nds imo. I feel his confidence took a fair bit of a hit after his 1st 3 games and form got worse, then played worse for Sandy too. He is building back up now with a better game against Werribee. Heath I don't know why they haven't selected him or have put a line through him. He had another good game against Werribee and some of his tap work is very good. He done a sublime over the back tap straight to Boxhall which setup a goal.

All the same whether we will delist Heath or not, he is the best performing forward ruck at Sandy and we really need one in the 1s.

 

[borderbarry]

In the one game when WILKIE was captain, I remember seeing him communicating with other players during the game, Which is something I have never seen JACK Steele

9

Jack Steele

Age

29

Ht

187cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.9

5star

K

8.7

3star

HB

12.2

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

6.8

5star

CL

3.6

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

16.8

4star

K

5.0

2star

HB

11.8

5star

M

2.6

3star

T

6.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

do.

 

[LuckyBounce!]

I’d bring in heath for height in the forward line . Clark and Bo hall as they’re both natural mids . Jones as sub . Give Garcia and collard a rest . Mclelland out. Maybe one of the runners in Wilson or Byrnes .
We need to blood the young players slowly into a winning culture and standards not getting smashed week in week out . Get some structure back in the side so players know their proper role

What’s this winning culture you speak of?

 

[StCicatriz]

Probably need the supporter base to harden up a bit.

you're kidding right. geeze.

 

[HeavenlySources]

In the one game when WILKIE was captain, I remember seeing him communicating with other players during the game, Which is something I have never seen JACK Steele do.

Don't need to be captain to do this.. Also plenty of times we see Jack Steele communicating with the players, Phillipou after the first quarter, the start of every game etc. I think Steele should be released from captaincy to improve his individual game and allow him to be dropped to get some form back. Still lets not pretend like he doesn't do this kind of thing at all.

 

[bergholt]

Keeler is worth persevering with but I don’t recall him being strong at the contest in the games he played. Quite the opposite in fact. We have a list hole here, especially with King out (who isn’t the strongest at the contest yet either), that we can’t fix without more cattle. Perhaps the mid season draft? That’s probably too optimistic though.

Haha yeah I was being a smart arse in both parts of that post

 

[Klaatu]

You dont think could potentially be more personal driven than coaching at the moment?

Coaches bang on about system not player personnel, system down back is now nonexistent.

 

[BrutThough]

Coaches bang on about system not player personnel, system down back is now nonexistent.

A system is only as good as the weakest player in it. And when we've had to change half of the preferred backline we've been rolling out for the past 2 years, that system is not going to hold up the same regardless of who the line coach is.

Rivers likely isnt as strong and developed as Enright is as a coach but he's also currently working with half the talent and he's had one experienced key pillar for the majority of the season. Of course we've gone backwards in the defence based on that alone. It's way too early to be reading anything into Rivers as a coach given what he is working with.

 

[bergholt]

Basically true. That's the experienced core who should be playing at their peak and driving performance consistently. Currently:

28: Butler (injured), Cordy (cooked)
27: Boyd (1 gamer)
26: Higgins (great), Clark (injured)
25: Dow (injured), Stocker (injured)
24: King (injured), Sharman (ok)

There's not enough in that group; and of the ones we have we're literally getting two of those on the park at the moment. So we're relying on mostly cooked veterans like Steele and Hill, and still inexperienced kids like Nas and Owens and Byrnes.

Past list management failures still hurting big time.

I wrote this in the main board thread.

Look at how many of our core we're getting on the park right now.

Is it really surprising we're not consistently competitive?

 

[Leap of Faith]

Have given it a bit of time after that embarrassing drivel. Even now, the St.KFC can still go and get f*****. Am totally over it. Not getting my money any more. Enough already.

 

[thekizzler]

Early in second quarter from a Sinclair kick in:

How in f***'s name was this not a free kick for unrealistic attempt?

Absolute joke of a decision. Happened in an area where all umpires could see clearly too.

 

[thekizzler]

Review over - moved on!!

Out - Collard, Garcia, McLennan, O'Connell, Byrnes

In - Clark, Jones, Keeler (defence) Heath (Fwd), Boxshall

Sub - Travaglia


B Webster Caminiti Wilkie

HB NWM Keeler Sinclair

C Hill Macrae Wood

HF Higgins Sharman Hall

F Philipou Heath Owens

Fol Marshall Steele Clark

I/C Windhager, Jones Boxshall Wilson

Sub Travaglia

Not sure you watched the game properly if you are dropping O'Connell?

You are also dropping three players who play often as small/mid-sized defenders and replaced them with no one in that role.

Suns have Ben Long, Malcolm Rosas, Ben Ainsworth and Bailey Humphrey will spend time in attack also.

 

[beside the seaside]

How in f***'s name was this not a free kick for unrealistic attempt?

Absolute joke of a decision. Happened in an area where all umpires could see clearly too.

Farcical non decision. That and the deliberate against Nasiah two of the worst you'll see.

 

[Diehard Saint]

As many others have mentioned, the squad is physically weak compared to other clubs. Yet there is no evidence of this so-called superior running capacity reaping any reward.

Have to be able to actually stick a tackle and win the ball before you can run…

How about we bring them back for the extra day they currently aren’t at the club and stick them in the gym?

Simple.

 

[bakes10]

Not sure you watched the game properly if you are dropping O'Connell?

You are also dropping three players who play often as small/mid-sized defenders and replaced them with no one in that role.

Suns have Ben Long, Malcolm Rosas, Ben Ainsworth and Bailey Humphrey will spend time in attack also.

There's no way I'm dropping O'Connell for the same reason I wouldn't have dropped Boxshall. They show intent.

I'm getting these players in because they have a dip: Boxshall, Hastie, Stocker (when fit). O'Connell stays.

Collard needs a rest. Hill needs a rest.

I don't want to be the harlem globetrotters and go from end to end without getting a fingernail laid on us. I just wanna win and I don't care how !

 

[jumperfan]

In: Keeler, Heath, Jones, Boxman, Travaglia into the 22

Out: Hill, McLennan, Collard, Garcia, Wilson

I wouldn't be opposed to giving McLennan another week but it's probably inevitable he gets dropped. Hill has to be dropped and we might as well see what Heath can do - at worst he's just another Boyd and gets cut at the end of the year, at best he fills that forward/ruck role that Owens has had to play for ages. Wilson and Garcia need a spell like Pou had last year. I know Sandy are crap but if they drop back and get 25+ it'll be better for them than getting smashed in the ones again.

Anyone know how Macrae's scans went?

 

[CaptainRisky]

Obviously there's no need to play them all at once BUT why would we play Brad Hill for the 2nd half of the year? Why not give those games to Arie or Hastie or Trav?

If Steele is hurt, why keep pushing him? Get Box and Windy and Owens and Pou and Jack Carroll in for a few games each.

Why play a half fit King? Give Keeler and Dodson and Boyd a look at FF. Rotate them ruck with Roma as it's probably what we plan to do with him at TDK anyway.

Would you bring Howard back or give Barrat and Taurus half a dozen games each?

We've seen enough from Collard and Hall to know they are worth keeping on. So why not rest them for a couple of games each and give Patrick Said a month to see what the level is like?

We might get pumped by 100 in a few games. We might shock a few teams and snag some upset wins. We might also find a couple of solid players, ala Garcia.

One thing is for sure though: There's no point rolling out this team week after week for games to be essentially decided on 'effort'.

We need to find players with skill, ASAP, because it's going to take a few years at least to build the bodies needed to play this way week after week after week.

Rest Collard , what do you think he has been doing for the past 6 or so weeks ,,that's right resting and you want to give Said a game after his 4 disposals effort on the weekend ?
I'm as p1ssed off as anyone on here ATM but play all the kids you want to play and its going to break them getting flogged every week , Some senior plays need to made an example of this week as they need to be leading not jogging around out there with a smile on their face , yes you Brad Hill

 

[thekizzler]

Farcical non decision. That and the deliberate against Nasiah two of the worst you'll see.

In regards to NAS deliberate, Bailey Williams was more blatant later in the game and was no free kick.

It's just incompetent and it feels like we are on the wrong end of the stick too often.

 

[Diehard Saint]

People on here bang on about the Fixture- Draw well our selection is in the same boat at times= Bull sh1t

100% combination of all three.
But the last is in our hands and we need to do better. For a must win game we needed to select the experience we have available. I don’t care what anyone thinks of Jones and Clark, they needed to be there. Time enough for all the youngsters.

It’s not only that we got pantsed, but the fact of who beat us. Was an arrogant team selection imo. Hope it stings the whole lot of them.