List Mgmt. 2017 Trade/Draft/FA SuperMegaUltra Thread - Post Trade-Period Edition

[Chris_6678]

Really? Our first two draft picks, ever, were Todd Breman at 2 and Peter Higgins at 10.

Have had a few beers with him over the years through work... Quality bloke who loves a beer or 10.

 

[former lurker]

But on the flip side look at Brett Heady and Dean Kemp, all taken later and both from WA.

Those days are long gone.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

But on the flip side look at Brett Heady and Dean Kemp, all taken later and both from WA.

Yeah, we did quite well with taking local kids back in the days when other sides didn't have any WA recruiters. Who'd have thought?

 

[beatlesmith]

Monocle takes Kelly at 27 in the Phantom Draft

Pick 27. West Coast. Tim Kelly. 183 cm 83 kg Midfielder . South Fremantle.

View attachment 435843

Write up to come this afternoon.

Higgins, Bailey and Kelly would be a very nice haul.

 

[former lurker]

Fully Support what liam123 suggested. Would someone make a thread where we make our draft selections each year with a separate accompanying thread to discuss ? Is that possible ?

 

[Feeling Groovy]

I think his evidence is their output. The whole point of recruitment is being able to identify which players will go on to have the best careers. Of course this is not an easy job and recruitment is not an exact science. Quite clearly no recruiter will be right all the time. But to imply that 'who could have guessed Rance and Taylor would have had the careers they did', I mean that is why you pay recruiters and that's their job.

Unfortunately the AFL industry is not the right one to get praised when you do well and not criticised when you make mistakes. Unfortunately in million and billion dollar industries the reverse is true more often then not... that's just a fact of life and what you are expecting from the average pundit is quite frankly ridiculous for anyone who has seen how much of a business the AFL has become, particularly in the past 10 years.

I don't think anyone is objecting to saying we got it wrong on numerous occasions and most agree that our recruitment team could improve. No one is expecting the average pundit to be better either. What people are objecting to is dogmatic statements about a particular draft and how we stuffed it up and basically implying that they knew better and that they would have done something different. Using Masto as an example, there is no doubt he hasn't turned into the player we all hoped such a high draft pick could produce but, at the time, it was seen by most as a good pick. Most experts and probably most on here (hence the point of having your say immediately after the draft as a point of reference).

Overall I think our recruiters have definitely not been the best in the comp at identifying talent (particularly mids) and we have recycled too many players and not used the rookie draft well. But that is not that same as saying they stuffed up a particular draft and should have got it right as their mistakes were obvious at the time to most, which some seem to be doing.

 

[truman]

I don't think anyone is objecting to saying we got it wrong on numerous occasions and most agree that our recruitment team could improve. No one is expecting the average pundit to be better either. What people are objecting to is dogmatic statements about a particular draft and how we stuffed it up and basically implying that they knew better and that they would have done something different. Using Masto as an example, there is no doubt he hasn't turned into the player we all hoped such a high draft pick could produce but, at the time, it was seen by most as a good pick. Most experts and probably most on here (hence the point of having your say immediately after the draft as a point of reference).

Overall I think our recruiters have definitely not been the best in the comp at identifying talent (particularly mids) and we have recycled too many players and not used the rookie draft well. But that is not that same as saying they stuffed up a particular draft and should have got it right as their mistakes were obvious at the time to most, which some seem to be doing.

I think my bone of contention is that you stuffed up a draft based on outcomes! Of course you can go back retrospectively and say you messed up on a draft, regardless of how a player was rated at recruitment! Recruiters are paid to be able to project a players pathway

 

[smilingassassin]

OMG This doesn't happen very often but for once I agree with Garry Lyon.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2017/11/08/even-stars-have-faults-says-lyon/

"Former Melbourne captain Garry Lyon says over-analysis of draft hopefuls can blind recruiters to qualities that could be the making of a player at AFL level."

Lyon rated competitiveness as the most important part of the drafting equation.
“I want a competitor to the death,” he said.

For once Lyon is spot on and I really hope our recruiters are on the same page.

Starcevich is a fierce competitor and a very skilful one.

By the way did anyone ask Garry how Billy's missus is going?

 

[Bleedblueandgold]

OMG This doesn't happen very often but for once I agree with Garry Lyon.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2017/11/08/even-stars-have-faults-says-lyon/

"Former Melbourne captain Garry Lyon says over-analysis of draft hopefuls can blind recruiters to qualities that could be the making of a player at AFL level."

Lyon rated competitiveness as the most important part of the drafting equation.
“I want a competitor to the death,” he said.

For once Lyon is spot on and I really hope our recruiters are on the same page.

Possibly part of the reason we didn't pick SPP, Venables could end up as competitive and do just as well or better than him, but iirc there was a knock on SPP's kicking and decision making, and DV was probably highly rated in that regard. SPP really likes to take the game and take risks, that's the main reason why I wanted us to pick him up.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

OMG This doesn't happen very often but for once I agree with Garry Lyon.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2017/11/08/even-stars-have-faults-says-lyon/

"Former Melbourne captain Garry Lyon says over-analysis of draft hopefuls can blind recruiters to qualities that could be the making of a player at AFL level."

Lyon rated competitiveness as the most important part of the drafting equation.
“I want a competitor to the death,” he said.

For once Lyon is spot on and I really hope our recruiters are on the same page.

Patrick McGinnity likes this post

 

[Feeling Groovy]

I think my bone of contention is that you stuffed up a draft based on outcomes! Of course you can go back retrospectively and say you messed up on a draft, regardless of how a player was rated at recruitment! Recruiters are paid to be able to project a players pathway

That is true to an extent. If you recruit players and they don't come on as expected, it is a miss. And in hindsight we can agree that we shouldn't have drafted them. But that is not the same as saying that at the time others would have done it differently. There have been players in the draft that all teams and all experts have unanimously rated highly, who have failed at AFL. So being paid doesn't really impact on that. Recruiting isn't a science and there are also other issues at play such as development, injuries, players losing the desire once they turn professional and outside influences. Recruiters can't be held accountable for all failures. Again, I would agree we have under-performed in our recruiting, although I am hopeful we have turned a corner on that now.

 

[Doashuey]

Monocle takes Kelly at 27 in the Phantom Draft

Higgins, Bailey and Kelly would be a very nice haul.

That would be nice however going back through a few videos I reckon there is knocks on the kicking of Higgens and Bailey.
Higgens seems to loop his kicks a fair bit, didnt see many flat passes.
Bailey has terrific speed, hands and lateral movement but from the footage I've just been looking at he butchers the ball by foot, especially kicking at goal.

 

[Dark Sharks]

Bailey has good everything, favourite player in this whole draft TBH

 

[Prochard123]

Hey guys I'm organising a trade and draft game and is looking for players.

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/prochards-trade-game.1181954/#post-53368815

If you're interested please leave a message in the comment section

 

[liam123]

I am sure most football followers could pick a few good picks out of their rectum, the trick is doing it consistently and with your allocated picks.

Yep we can do the thread every year with the allotted picks. Over the next five years or so we will gather a bit of info

 

[liam123]

Fully Support what liam123 suggested. Would someone make a thread where we make our draft selections each year with a separate accompanying thread to discuss ? Is that possible ?

That's fine I'll create the thread as soon as the draft is done. That way we will see which players we missed out on and everyone can agree or disagree with each pick.

 

[WCErevival]

Bailey has good everything, favourite player in this whole draft TBH

Didnt you say that about Lamb back in the day

 

[Happy Mastenator]

You can name any team in the league and I can go back over their drafts over the last 10 years and find plenty of misses.

Even with us, go every Masten at 3 we have a McGovern at 44 in the Rookie draft.

 

[Avalor]

Didnt you say that about Lamb back in the day

To be fair, we were all excited by the selection of Lamb. Pleased by the fact that we were prepared to take a risk and not go for Mr. Safe.

 

[Eagle Wrath]

You can name any team in the league and I can go back over their drafts over the last 10 years and find plenty of misses.

Even with us, go every Masten at 3 we have a McGovern at 44 in the Rookie draft.

Gold Coast, GWS. - Don't have 10 years of history.

I do agree with your comment though.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

I think the fact we haven't nailed every draft pick since the turn of the century has cost us at least a dozen premierships.

Heads should roll.

 

[Doashuey]

Bailey has good everything, favourite player in this whole draft TBH

I like the look of him otherwise and am working with a limited data set but looking at the below vid, dont try to tell me that kicking is anywhere near good...

 

[amazingjoshy]

^^ I'm certainly not one to write off a kid after a couple of min video.....but disposal efficiency in that game must've been under 20%

 

[eagles rule]

I like Bailey a lot but needs to fix a few little things , once he gets to Wce ..


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[new breed]

Zac Bailey's break away speed and contested ball winning is very good and has something about him , BOG in the Allies v Vic Metro game says a lot about his ability .

Kicking as they have said is generally good but has his odd poor kicking game but his upside is so good .