Universal Love 2019 Brownlow thread: kicks off 7.30pm, count 8.20pm.

Who will win Chas


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Vdubs

Brownlow Medallist
Jan 1, 2008
29,671
27,962
48 J 09
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Geelong
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These are the rounds Fyfe polled in & match result:

R1: 3 votes, W - 141 def 59, 32 disposals & 1 goal
R2: 2 votes, L - 58 def by 61, 31 disposals & 0 goals (btw, Sexton with 17 disposals, 4 goals & 5 behinds received no votes)
R6: 3 votes, W - 88 def 69, 30 disposals & 1 goal
R7: 3 votes, L - 34 def by 51, 32 disposals & 0 goals
R8: 3 votes, L - 86 def 111, 33 disposals & 3 goals
R10: 3 votes, W - 73 def 72, 26 disposals & 1 goal
R11: 3 votes, W - 79 def 75, 32 disposals & 0 goals
R13: 2 votes, W - 100 def 79, 37 disposals & 0 goals
R14: 1 vote, L - 71 def by 85, 31 disposals & 0 goals (Max Gawn, disposals, 1 goal & 46 hitouts = 0 votes)
R15: 1 vote, L - 75 def by 79, 29 disposals & 1 goal
R17: 3 votes, L - 53 def by 84, 24 disposals & 3 goals
R20: 3 votes, W - 95 def 61, 27 disposals & 2 goals
R21: 3 votes, L - 69 def by 72, 35 disposals & 2 goals

That's 16 votes across 7 matches which Freo lost - I know that the BOG isn't always from a winning team, but to have 4 BOG's in a losing team just seems like a bit too much umpire love
Impressive stats nevertheless in those losses.
GAJ somehow won a GC Brownlow in a season with less wins than Freo had, don't think we had issues about that.
 

Play it Sam

Cupcakes are muffins who believed in miracles
Jun 25, 2013
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These are the rounds Fyfe polled in & match result:

R1: 3 votes, W - 141 def 59, 32 disposals & 1 goal
R2: 2 votes, L - 58 def by 61, 31 disposals & 0 goals (btw, Sexton with 17 disposals, 4 goals & 5 behinds received no votes)
R6: 3 votes, W - 88 def 69, 30 disposals & 1 goal
R7: 3 votes, L - 34 def by 51, 32 disposals & 0 goals
R8: 3 votes, L - 86 def 111, 33 disposals & 3 goals
R10: 3 votes, W - 73 def 72, 26 disposals & 1 goal
R11: 3 votes, W - 79 def 75, 32 disposals & 0 goals
R13: 2 votes, W - 100 def 79, 37 disposals & 0 goals
R14: 1 vote, L - 71 def by 85, 31 disposals & 0 goals (Max Gawn, disposals, 1 goal & 46 hitouts = 0 votes)
R15: 1 vote, L - 75 def by 79, 29 disposals & 1 goal
R17: 3 votes, L - 53 def by 84, 24 disposals & 3 goals
R20: 3 votes, W - 95 def 61, 27 disposals & 2 goals
R21: 3 votes, L - 69 def by 72, 35 disposals & 2 goals

That's 16 votes across 7 matches which Freo lost - I know that the BOG isn't always from a winning team, but to have 4 BOG's in a losing team just seems like a bit too much umpire love
Was thinking same until I looked at your stats. It's not as though they got whomped in their losses. Without knowing who they played I guess that's just the way the cards fall when the other team doesn't have a standout. Only got done by a goal re Melbs, rucks don't poll.
He's got that champion physique and face every mother loves, and umpires must be drawn too, along with the skills and demeanour.
Freaking golden boy.
 

tacopavlich

Premiership Player
Oct 19, 2010
3,058
1,883
perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
What, just because he's a great player? No he doesn't. He would deserve multiple Brownlows if he had legitimately been the best player in the comp in two separate years. Which he hasn't.
The brownlow system is jank but he was legitimately the best player in two separate years, it just wasn't in 2019 it was in 2014/15.
 

cats_09

Moderator
Jun 21, 2011
16,167
28,821
AFL Club
Geelong
Was thinking same until I looked at your stats. It's not as though they got whomped in their losses. Without knowing who they played I guess that's just the way the cards fall when the other team doesn't have a standout. Only got done by a goal re Melbs, rucks don't poll.
He's got that champion physique and face every mother loves, and umpires must be drawn too, along with the skills and demeanour.
Freaking golden boy.
I've updated my post to add the opponent in brackets :thumbsu:

Should have thought of that earlier - but if I'm reading it right, he didn't poll votes against the same team twice this year
 

cats_09

Moderator
Jun 21, 2011
16,167
28,821
AFL Club
Geelong
Geelong leaderboard

2. Patrick Dangerfield — 27

5. Tim Kelly — 24

24. Gary Ablett* — 13

32. Mitch Duncan — 11

70. Tom Hawkins — 5

104. Joel Selwood, Tom Stewart — 3

128. Brandan Parfitt — 2

156. Cameron Guthrie, Gary Rohan — 1
 

Baudolino

Premiership Player
Apr 20, 2011
4,351
10,502
AFL Club
Geelong
The brownlow system is jank but he was legitimately the best player in two separate years, it just wasn't in 2019 it was in 2014/15.
I'm happy to grant that that's closer to the truth than what Vdubs was saying. IMO didn't deserve it in this year but you have a fair case for 2014.

2014 was a weird one because GAJ was so far ahead of everyone else before he did his shoulder that it would have been a one horse race had he played out the season.
 

NitroFan

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 2, 2007
6,071
5,111
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I've watched very little this year but was Selwood really only deserving of 3 total votes?
 

Play it Sam

Cupcakes are muffins who believed in miracles
Jun 25, 2013
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These are the rounds Fyfe polled in & match result:

R1: 3 votes, W - 141 def 59 (North), 32 disposals & 1 goal
R2: 2 votes, L - 58 def by 61 (Suns), 31 disposals & 0 goals (btw, Sexton with 17 disposals, 4 goals & 5 behinds received no votes)
R6: 3 votes, W - 88 def 69 (Bulldogs), 30 disposals & 1 goal
R7: 3 votes, L - 34 def by 51 (Crows), 32 disposals & 0 goals
R8: 3 votes, L - 86 def 111 (Tigers), 33 disposals & 3 goals
R10: 3 votes, W - 73 def 72 (Lions), 26 disposals & 1 goal
R11: 3 votes, W - 79 def 75 (Magpies), 32 disposals & 0 goals
R13: 2 votes, W - 100 def 79 (Power), 37 disposals & 0 goals
R14: 1 vote, L - 71 def by 85 (Demons), 31 disposals & 0 goals (Max Gawn, disposals, 1 goal & 46 hitouts = 0 votes)
R15: 1 vote, L - 75 def by 79 (Blues), 29 disposals & 1 goal
R17: 3 votes, L - 53 def by 84 (Hawks), 24 disposals & 3 goals
R20: 3 votes, W - 95 def 61 (Cats), 27 disposals & 2 goals
R21: 3 votes, L - 69 def by 72 (Saints), 35 disposals & 2 goals

That's 16 votes across 7 matches which Freo lost - I know that the BOG isn't always from a winning team, but to have 4 BOG's in a losing team just seems like a bit too much umpire love
Hmmm. One or two look a bit suss v Suns, Hawks, but I guess when you're disposing that many times right under the umpires long noses.....
Oh well, what do we do, no combined Duncan, Ablett, Kelly, Danger, to pull votes off each other and we're Freo.
 

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Play it Sam

Cupcakes are muffins who believed in miracles
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I personally think the Umps are not immune to the athleticism of a well kicked goal from a mid.
Sooner they bring in Danny's legacy of the golden fist the better.
Trust fish-Gil to put it on the back burner.
 

Mad_Hatter

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 12, 2015
9,713
18,135
AFL Club
Geelong
Hmmm. One or two look a bit suss v Suns, Hawks, but I guess when you're disposing that many times right under the umpires long noses.....
Oh well, what do we do, no combined Duncan, Ablett, Kelly, Danger, to pull votes off each other and we're Freo.
That hawks game (if it was the one in Tassie) he absolutely deserved 3 votes, stats don't do that game justice, he was brilliant.
 

Play it Sam

Cupcakes are muffins who believed in miracles
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That hawks game (if it was the one in Tassie) he absolutely deserved 3 votes, stats don't do that game justice, he was brilliant.
Fair enough, zoned out of their games. Pretty sure he wasn't expecting early bags of votes though.
I read his lips, and he said - I thought I'd only get one.

Besides, can always pick holes in the votes, whoever wins.
Umps are just froggy mystery bags.
 

rocker_oz33

Hall of Famer
May 15, 2007
38,501
28,491
Rockin in a free world.
AFL Club
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I thought Neale was going to go close to winning it. He had such a great year and bought his teammates into the game while getting a truck load of touches.

Wow Fyfe by six votes didn't see that coming.
He normally polls well early in the year, but got votes all the way though.
 

Sticksman

Club Legend
Feb 7, 2013
1,825
3,540
AFL Club
Geelong
Strip the umpires of the Brownlow vote responsibilities. The votes should be awarded by the opposing coaches (only able to award votes to the opposition players) or ex player experts sitting in commentary positions who can appreciate the role of a full back or a full forward. Umpires are probably the worst people to be charged with this responsibility.
 

Shell

Premium Platinum
Jul 2, 2005
105,531
62,226
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AFL Club
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Again, just wanted to say thanks to all who posted/found odds/found predictors (even tho they turned out to be a fat load of SHIT), and James1970 for their brilliant commentary, etc etc... was a fun night bar the unfortunate result. :):thumbsu:
 

Partridge

Hall of Famer
Nov 12, 2002
36,119
39,223
AFL Club
Geelong
How can anyone support Cripps but not Fyfe? they polled the exact same way, dominate players in a poor teams who don't have anyone to take votes off them.
Yeah I'm a bit nonplussed by the angst. People forgot how good he was in 2015. He's every bit as good as anyone in the competition, and without looking at any stats I thought was BOG against us late in the season. Worthy winner.
 

Back One Out

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 2, 2015
12,963
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G.A.G.F.
My verdict on the worthiness of every Brownlow winner since 2000:

2000: Woewoedin :thumbsdown:
2007: Bartel :thumbsdown:
2008: Cooney :thumbsdown:
2010: Judd :thumbsdown:
2014: Priddis :thumbsdown:
2019: Fyfe :thumbsdown:
:huh:

Coaches Award:
  1. Bontempelli
  2. Dangerfield - 90 votes
  3. Fyfe - 88 votes
  4. Kelly - 86 votes
  5. Cripps, Neale, Grundy - 82 votes
 

Back One Out

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 2, 2015
12,963
21,713
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G.A.G.F.
Lol Fyfe three votes for a 24 possession game in a five goal loss. Never change AFL.
How ******* rigged is that, Freo get pumped yet he gets 3 votes, what horses**t
This is bulls**t. They lost by 5 goals!! Corrupt!! Check umps betting accounts
Lose by 5 goals get 3 votes yeah sure okay umpires
Fyfe single-handedly kept Freo in the game in Round 17 vs Hawthorn
The Hawks won by 31pts and others might've got more possessions, but Fyfe was a class above every player on the ground.

From memory, I had to mute the volume because Dwayne Russell & the other commentators were crapping on about him so much.
Worpel got 10 coaches votes (Fyfe got 8) but I didn't he didn't think stood out that day like Fyfe did.


Champion Data:
154 Nat Fyfe - 24 disposals, 16 contested, 3 goals
126 Ricky Henderson - 25 disposals, 654 metres gained
111 Shaun Burgoyne - 17 disposals, 9 contested
109 James Worpel - 33 disposals, 15 contested, 580 metres
105 Bradley Hill - 37 disposals, 553 metres
102 Ben McEvoy - 13 disposals, 38 hitouts
100 Mitch Lewis - 16 disposals, 3 goals
_99 Luke Breust - 12 disposals, 3 goals
_93 Jaeger O'Meara - 23 disposals, 14 contested


Fyfe's best not enough to stop Hawks' Tassie triumph

In a scrappy affair, the Hawks shot out to an early lead before being reeled in by the Dockers
Fremantle desperately needed to find a way to drag itself back into the contest following a disappointing opening quarter when it went goalless.

Of course, it was superstar Nat Fyfe that broke the streak, midway through the second.
That had seemed unlikely just minutes earlier after he left the field with a right shoulder complaint

Fyfe wasn't going to let his side's finals hopes slip away that easily though.

Returning soon enough sporting strapping, the skipper put the team on his back, his overhead marking proving influential.
The skipper bagged three goals for the term, including this magnificent effort in congestion.



 
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Back One Out

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 2, 2015
12,963
21,713
AFL Club
Hawthorn
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G.A.G.F.
Strip the umpires of the Brownlow vote responsibilities
It's nothing to do with the umpires. It's the 3-2-1 scoring system for 198 games.

Some games aren't worth giving many votes for, but you have to give 3 to somebody.
Other games, you'd like to give 3 votes to 4 players they were all so good, but you can't.

Umpires get a lot of help with their Brownlow votes. The votes these days are very uncontroversial.
There used to be some howlers in the old days. Not any more.

The votes should be awarded by the opposing coaches (only able to award votes to the opposition players) or ex player experts sitting in commentary positions who can appreciate the role of a full back or a full forward. Umpires are probably the worst people to be charged with this responsibility.
The coaches already had their award and their leaderboard looked pretty similar to the Brownlow. Not a lot of appreciation for the full backs or full forwards.

It's just the way it is. Midfielders are always involved in the game. It's harder to appreciate the performances of the best defenders and forwards when they don't see as much action in every quarter. e.g. Alex Rance was clearly BOG in the 2017 Grand Final when the game was there to be won, but he didn't have much to do in the second half, so he was stiffed in the Norm Smith Medal voting.


AFLCA Champion Player of the Year Award
1. Marcus Bontempelli (107)
2. Patrick Dangerfield (90)
3. Nat Fyfe (88)
4. Tim Kelly (86)
5. Patrick Cripps (82)
5. Brodie Grundy (82)
5. Lachie Neale (82)
8. Luke Shuey (76)
9. Jack Macrae (75)
10. Josh Dunkley (72)
11. Ben Cunnington (71)
12. Dustin Martin (71)
13. Max Gawn (70)
14. Scott Pendlebury (68)
15. Travis Boak (67)
16. Elliot Yeo (67)
 
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fpm84

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 7, 2005
11,176
25,398
Melbourne
AFL Club
Geelong
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Dallas Mavs, West Ham
Umpires get a lot of help with their Brownlow votes. The votes these days are very uncontroversial.
There used to be some howlers in the old days. Not any more.
In that case, what did you think of an ineligible Patrick Dangerfield finishing three votes behind Dustin Martin in 2017?

In round 22 that year we beat Collingwood at the MCG. Dangerfield was already ineligible for the medal but he had 32 possessions and scored 2 goals.

He was named BOG by every media outlet.

"But with Patrick Dangerfield piecing together another brilliant best-on-ground display, Geelong flexed its muscles to win by 11 points, running out 10.10 (70) to 9.5 (59) victors," said the AFL website.

Dangerfield got a perfect 10 votes in the AFLCA award in that game.

Here are the Brownlow votes from that game.

3: Duncan
2: Menegola
1. Adams

Now the fact Dangerfield was ineligible is irrelevant.

It was clear as day that the umpires were worried about the 'optics' of him potentially polling the most votes, or tying with Martin (which he would have done if the 3 votes were awarded).

The only other explanation is that the umpires didn't deem him to be in the best 3 players on the field - despite Nathan Buckley, Chris Scott and every media outlet deeming him BOG.

"Uncontroversial" votes? I don't think so...
 
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