List Mgmt. 2020 Young Talent time

[Kapow!!!]

How about his game against Port Adelaide's premiership ruck and Ryder where they couldn't get involved in the forth and we ran away with it?

A far better example (mind you I'm not exactly someone who has ever been completely sold on Ryder). I was more amused of the choice of the example given rather than detracting from Darcy.

My only knock on Darcy is if he can ever reach the required fitness to consistently run out games as the number 1 ruck over the course of a season/develop his forward craft to be able to rest forward. Without that he really doesn't free up Lobb to play forward and therefore wouldn't be in my first choice team. If he gets to that point I'll be all for him.

 

[Taylor]

A far better example (mind you I'm not exactly someone who has ever been completely sold on Ryder). I was more amused of the choice of the example given rather than detracting from Darcy.

My only knock on Darcy is if he can ever reach the required fitness to consistently run out games as the number 1 ruck over the course of a season/develop his forward craft to be able to rest forward. Without that he really doesn't free up Lobb to play forward and therefore wouldn't be in my first choice team. If he gets to that point I'll be all for him.

It's a balance with the bigger guys. We can have elite runners come to the club that are skinny as a rake and won't be able to play for years or we have them come to the club with size and try and turn them into runners.

I think from a body sense it would be easier to bulk up the runner than trying to put bigger loads through a larger body starting further back - it might result in less injury for the guy coming over with a better running base, but it might not be possible to get the guy to the physical size for AFL.

One of the big frustrations is getting these players to sleep when they have the chance to, so many will go through the motions in the gym, the diet is right, but they go out late, just drinking water, but only sleeping five to six hours that night before the week starts again.

It's one of the subtle little sneaky tactics at the training base that we have a room full of beds for sleeping.

Long story short, it might be easier to turn the bigger guy into the runner than it is to maybe turn the runner into the man body.

 

[Kapow!!!]

It's a balance with the bigger guys. We can have elite runners come to the club that are skinny as a rake and won't be able to play for years or we have them come to the club with size and try and turn them into runners.

I think from a body sense it would be easier to bulk up the runner than trying to put bigger loads through a larger body starting further back - it might result in less injury for the guy coming over with a better running base, but it might not be possible to get the guy to the physical size for AFL.

One of the big frustrations is getting these players to sleep when they have the chance to, so many will go through the motions in the gym, the diet is right, but they go out late, just drinking water, but only sleeping five to six hours that night before the week starts again.

It's one of the subtle little sneaky tactics at the training base that we have a room full of beds for sleeping.

Long story short, it might be easier to turn the bigger guy into the runner than it is to maybe turn the runner into the man body.

I'm definitely a fan of Darcy in the sense that he was essentially an AFL ready body when he debuted and it's why he competes so well against the best ruckmen in the league even with his inexperience. But I have my doubts over whether we have the right personnel to get his tank right. A fear brough mor sharply into focus by the COVID-19 break and subsequent layoffs

 

[Bigger]

It's not every game you get to ruck against a pair of ruckmen who have just returned from China.

I am a big fan of Bubba Darcy but, FFS, he wants to get fully game fit pretty soon. If I had a dollar for every free kick he's given away because he's leaning all over the oppo ruckman - just catching his ******* breath - then I would have, ooh, at least twenty dollars.

Speaking of Bubba though, is there any chance we can recruit his older brother - the bloke on the left in this pic?

He's about 6 foot a hundred and, from the stains on his hoodie, it looks like he got called in from eating an entire cow for the photo shoot. "Uh, yeah, coming," quick wipe of the hands, "All g."

I don't give a s**t if he can't play. That there is our number 1 ruck and just the sort of bloke you need around the club when it's time to build a fire or kill something.

 

[Van_Dyke]

How about his game against Port Adelaide's premiership ruck and Ryder where they couldn't get involved in the forth and we ran away with it?

he was then matching it with Gawn for 3/4 of the game the week after before he got a pretty bad corkie iirc

Can you really have a bad game in the ruck against Geelong? That's kind of like saying he had a really inspiring performance against a tumbleweed.

to be fair from memory the Geelong game was one of the weeks where he was our FF

 

[yyou]

How about his game against Port Adelaide's premiership ruck and Ryder where they couldn't get involved in the forth and we ran away with it?

Darcy certainly came forth in the fourth, with quite a bit of force (It helps if you have a lisp) on that occasion.

 

[Freomaniac]

Not a mention for Acres?

Well.... can you classify him as an outside mid? Yeah the bloke is 190 cm and 90 kg He could play there.

I mean you can count walters too. He rotates on a wing and forward flank and bench and lead Freos goal kicking last year with 40 goals.

 

[Purple_Turtle]

Well.... can you classify him as an outside mid? Yeah the bloke is 190 cm and 90 kg He could play there.

I mean you can count walters too. He rotates on a wing and forward flank and bench and lead Freos goal kicking last year with 40 goals.

I think it depends how things go, but Acres from memory was immediately offered a spot on the wing by J-Lo when we recruited him.

 

[more_of_bito]

Darcy will get chewed up by the likes of Tim English.
I like Darcy but I fear his type of ruck may be superseded by a oversized mid.

Yep you’d hope so the 2016 draft....

Pick 19 English
Pick 38 Darcy

Sam Powell- pepper would chew up Rotham
pick 18 SPP
pick 37 Rotham

comparing them is just plain annoying

 

[Purple_Turtle]

Darcy will get chewed up by the likes of Tim English.
I like Darcy but I fear his type of ruck may be superseded by a oversized mid.

Tim English couldn't chew up anything. "Molested" is the word I heard to describe what Grundy did to him in R1, and the Bulldogs with English have been worst in the league for hit-outs.

Darcy has been really good for his age.

 

[Dockeroo]

The boys on the purple reign podcast made a good point the other day. In Freo history, almost all our gun players have been West Australian. We have had Mundy, Barlow, Pav and that’s about it in terms of interstate A-graders WHO STAYED with Freo. Neale left us. All our other Elite players have been from WA.
Ask yourself honestly - had Freo drafted Dangerfield in 07 or Dusty in 09 or even Grundy in 12, would they still be at the club now?
I think we all know the answer. Even West Coast couldn’t keep Judd longer than 6 years. Had we drafted Judd in 01 he’d have been back in Victoria by 04. Given the significant investment in Victorian high draft picks in recent years, if some of them turn into genuine A graders are we going to have a big problem keeping them? Even if we are going well in terms of winning games?
And should we maybe be looking local in 2020 to at least remove that issue, or provide some respite from persuading lads not to move back to Melbourne if they become superstars.

 

[wahooo]

And should we maybe be looking local in 2020 to at least remove that issue, or provide some respite from persuading lads not to move back to Melbourne if they become superstars.

In before "I'd prefer we go best available"

 

[CapitalA]

The boys on the purple reign podcast made a good point the other day. In Freo history, almost all our gun players have been West Australian. We have had Mundy, Barlow, Pav and that’s about it in terms of interstate A-graders WHO STAYED with Freo. Neale left us. All our other Elite players have been from WA.
Ask yourself honestly - had Freo drafted Dangerfield in 07 or Dusty in 09 or even Grundy in 12, would they still be at the club now?
I think we all know the answer. Even West Coast couldn’t keep Judd longer than 6 years. Had we drafted Judd in 01 he’d have been back in Victoria by 04. Given the significant investment in Victorian high draft picks in recent years, if some of them turn into genuine A graders are we going to have a big problem keeping them? Even if we are going well in terms of winning games?
And should we maybe be looking local in 2020 to at least remove that issue, or provide some respite from persuading lads not to move back to Melbourne if they become superstars.

I'd think the biggest flight risk is Cerra followed by Brayshaw being vic metro kids. Tucker, Sturt, Young and Serong are all country/outer suburbs kids and I suppose Perth would feel less foreign to them being from smaller towns/cities.

 

[Ysaye]

The boys on the purple reign podcast made a good point the other day. In Freo history, almost all our gun players have been West Australian. We have had Mundy, Barlow, Pav and that’s about it in terms of interstate A-graders WHO STAYED with Freo. Neale left us. All our other Elite players have been from WA.
Ask yourself honestly - had Freo drafted Dangerfield in 07 or Dusty in 09 or even Grundy in 12, would they still be at the club now?
I think we all know the answer. Even West Coast couldn’t keep Judd longer than 6 years. Had we drafted Judd in 01 he’d have been back in Victoria by 04. Given the significant investment in Victorian high draft picks in recent years, if some of them turn into genuine A graders are we going to have a big problem keeping them? Even if we are going well in terms of winning games?
And should we maybe be looking local in 2020 to at least remove that issue, or provide some respite from persuading lads not to move back to Melbourne if they become superstars.

I think it is much more complicated then this. There is a good chance that those players would have returned if we had drafted them, but that overlooks the potential impact that they may have had on:
(1) Value in a trade - look at many of those teams and you can see that there was often immediate and/or direct consequential improvement after a big name player left;
(2) Value in creating an attracting force to players wanting to join the club - success often attracts success and paradoxically a successful player wanting to return home may create an environment which others want to join. The concessions a returning player is likely to make to go to a successful club are often greater that to got a poor performing club and that player who eventually chooses to go home may still spark some initial club success that creates interest. I think the value gets hidden sometimes because we only have eyes for the big name players rather than the hard grafters who make nevertheless important contributions and wouldn't have been there otherwise.

So if (to take your example) we could draft Judd like West Coast did knowing that we would lose him the same way they did my belief is that we would do it 100% - not only did he significantly contribute to an immediate premiership whilst he was there, his trade value also meant they got Josh Kennedy back out of it, who arguably also contributed significantly to a premiership.

An important question is whether a non West Australian has the ability and mental apptitude to achieve the most out of themselves whilst away. Of they don't, then they will not achieve their value and so in that instance it we are paying a hidden cost potentially depending on which pick is used. Is (for example) Cerra getting the most out of himself, or is his talent significantly suppressed because mentally he can't get up for playing for us? If this was true (and I don't think it is likely but to use him as an example) then his value may be significantly less if he asks to be traded, and we pay that cost.

The other important question is that of creating too much churn of players in and out. But you can (and we do) manage this by looking at the overall mix of local versus non-local players and (particularly with lesser more speculative picks) put a higher bias on local players, and of course a focus on trading for local players to come back to us

So in summary "keeping players" is not as big a consideration as you think it is.

 

[Joao]

I'd think the biggest flight risk is Cerra followed by Brayshaw being vic metro kids. Tucker, Sturt, Young and Serong are all country/outer suburbs kids and I suppose Perth would feel less foreign to them being from smaller towns/cities.

I don't have a firm opinion either way on most of them but I'll happily wager BF accounts that Brayshaw never leaves without a really good reason (ie Beams).

I am genuinely astounded that people could have observed the way he talks in his few years and concluded that he is a flight risk.

 

[Scham]

The boys on the purple reign podcast made a good point the other day. In Freo history, almost all our gun players have been West Australian. We have had Mundy, Barlow, Pav and that’s about it in terms of interstate A-graders WHO STAYED with Freo. Neale left us. All our other Elite players have been from WA.
Ask yourself honestly - had Freo drafted Dangerfield in 07 or Dusty in 09 or even Grundy in 12, would they still be at the club now?
I think we all know the answer. Even West Coast couldn’t keep Judd longer than 6 years. Had we drafted Judd in 01 he’d have been back in Victoria by 04. Given the significant investment in Victorian high draft picks in recent years, if some of them turn into genuine A graders are we going to have a big problem keeping them? Even if we are going well in terms of winning games?
And should we maybe be looking local in 2020 to at least remove that issue, or provide some respite from persuading lads not to move back to Melbourne if they become superstars.

Who are all these elite WA players that you talk of? Fyfe, Hill, Haselby....? Bell? That's one more than the interstaters.

 

[Square Peg]

Who are all these elite WA players that you talk of? Fyfe, Hill, Haselby....? Bell? That's one more than the interstaters.

And Sandi!!
But yeah I agree. We have had a lot of misses regardless of origin.

 

[yyou]

Who are all these elite WA players that you talk of? Fyfe, Hill, Haselby....? Bell? That's one more than the interstaters.

I'd put Walters onto that list & McPharlin as well, at least

 

[Dockeroo]

Who are all these elite WA players that you talk of? Fyfe, Hill, Haselby....? Bell? That's one more than the interstaters.

Something like 19 of the 25 players in the 25 for 25 team were West Australian. There’s also been plenty of under recognised talent that played for freo that would be stars if they played in Vic.

 

[Van_Dyke]

I don't have a firm opinion either way on most of them but I'll happily wager BF accounts that Brayshaw never leaves without a really good reason (ie Beams).

I am genuinely astounded that people could have observed the way he talks in his few years and concluded that he is a flight risk.

there’s probably more chance that Brayshaw gets his brother over here than Andy leaving (without a Beams like reason)

 

[Scham]

I'd put Walters onto that list & McPharlin as well, at least

Yep, I shamefully missed a few. Sandi, Walters and McPharlin. Maybe Jonno too? I still wouldn’t say “nearly all” but just a poor choice I guess which we’re all guilty of.

Considering we’re one of two WA teams we should have a majority being from WA, that’s a given. Should’ve had McGovern on the list too. As SP said, we’ve had plenty of misses regardless of region and drafting predominantly from WA or having a strategy in place to draft predominantly from WA is just not good practice.

 

[arsesmart]

The boys on the purple reign podcast made a good point the other day. In Freo history, almost all our gun players have been West Australian. We have had Mundy, Barlow, Pav and that’s about it in terms of interstate A-graders WHO STAYED with Freo. Neale left us. All our other Elite players have been from WA.
Ask yourself honestly - had Freo drafted Dangerfield in 07 or Dusty in 09 or even Grundy in 12, would they still be at the club now?
I think we all know the answer. Even West Coast couldn’t keep Judd longer than 6 years. Had we drafted Judd in 01 he’d have been back in Victoria by 04. Given the significant investment in Victorian high draft picks in recent years, if some of them turn into genuine A graders are we going to have a big problem keeping them? Even if we are going well in terms of winning games?
And should we maybe be looking local in 2020 to at least remove that issue, or provide some respite from persuading lads not to move back to Melbourne if they become superstars.

No one left of note that they want to keep in the 2012-2016 years. Contention is retention.

Some other notable non-WA inclusions from the top of my head are Heath Black (ok he left but came back pretty quick), Clive, Creepy. Sure you're under pressure to keep the absolute cream, especially if they're recruited interstate, but that's the way it is for most clubs (see above).

 

[Purple_Turtle]

Family ties pull Draft hopeful towards Saints

Logan McDonald has St Kilda royalty in his bloodlines so it’s rather fitting that they were the first club to visit the hot WA draft prospect this year.

thewest.com.au

 

[Van_Dyke]

2 of his great uncles played for them, one of them in the 1966 premiership (Ian Cooper and Gary McDonald), Saints visited him earlier this year (Dogs had to cancel). The relevant quote - "It would be pretty special to play for them (St Kilda) given a couple of family members already have.”

 

[Purple_Turtle]

2 of his great uncles played for them, one of them in the 1966 premiership (Ian Cooper and Gary McDonald), Saints visited him earlier this year (Dogs had to cancel). The relevant quote - "It would be pretty special to play for them (St Kilda) given a couple of family members already have.”

Yeah. It's probably not taking too seriously. Draftees with stronger family connections to clubs than a great uncle have snubbed them.