Live Event 2021 AFL National Draft discussion thread

[Strapping Young Lad]

 

[Brishawk]

I don't think height matters in clearance players, maybe in players like the Bont and their ability in the air to go forward or back both resting and floating to help the team. But pure clearance players is more pure power, smarts and that type of thing.

As soon as we included Newcombe and Nash in the side, life became a lot easier for Mitchell to win clearances. MacDonald and Newcombe and maginnes are all a really good size and will make life easier for the likes of ward and butler. It is good recruiting and we are finally addressing the gap in our list of stronger bodies mids. The discussion is about the draft and the players we have taken in the context of our list. You are narrowing down on individuals and their performance and not seeing the wider context in which they perform well, or don’t.

 

[Pessimistic]

We have ‘smaller’ guys but it would be less of an issue if they were impressive kicks. As it is some of our better field kicks are closer to KPP size

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Height does matter, you can't just say "I don't think" if it flies in the face of what is measurable. That's like saying height doesn't matter as a ruckman because ruck work is mostly about ability to jump and tap, it might be true to some extent but there's an inherent advantage to being 205cm tall over 195cm tall in a ruck contest because it's 10cm less you have to jump than your opponent.

It matters insofar as it translates to power, strength and overall size in positive ways, and how it translates to agility, ground ability and acceleration in negative ways. A taller player is likely to be stronger, more powerful and have a larger frame which benefits their bullocking midfield work, but a player that is too tall will start to have diminished agility, ground ability and acceleration which means that they will have more difficulty in contests. That's why, as Bris was saying, there's a sweet spot between 180 - 190 where the best midfielders reside.

You cannot compare a ruck tap to a midfielder, the only advantage to being taller is probably reach, but overall power and actual ability and getting to every contest at a high level is much more important than the height of a clearance mid. Rucks are different because someone who is taller and has better reach (Ned Reeves) for example is a little easier to reach the tap, but then shorter players make up for it with power and strength and jumping. Like Nic Nat.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

As soon as we included Newcombe and Nash in the side, life became a lot easier for Mitchell to win clearances. MacDonald and Newcombe and maginnes are all a really good size and will make life easier for the likes of ward and butler. It is good recruiting and we are finally addressing the gap in our list of stronger bodies mids. The discussion is about the draft and the players we have taken in the context of our list. You are narrowing down on individuals and their performance and not seeing the wider context in which they perform well, or don’t.

As a whole, the whole midfield group needs to be balanced, big bodies, quick fast players and so on. But if you're looking at just one player, there isn't that much of an advantage in being a taller clearance mid rather than a shorter one. Taller mids do different things better or the same. It's just not that much of an advantage. The Advantage comes when a taller mid is able to affect using there height, taking their player forward which makes for a hard matchup and to throw their weight around that a smaller player may not have.

 

[KermitJagger]

You cannot compare a ruck tap to a midfielder, the only advantage to being taller is probably reach, but overall power and actual ability and getting to every contest at a high level is much more important than the height of a clearance mid. Rucks are different because someone who is taller and has better reach (Ned Reeves) for example is a little easier to reach the tap, but then shorter players make up for it with power and strength and jumping. Like Nic Nat.

You've ignored most of my post.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

You've ignored most of my post.

Clearly a mid can't be too tall, but there is no "too small".

I don't think he said what he wanted to say correctly. He said clearance player, a clearance player is different then a whole midfield group and having players around them to use their bodies.

I don't care if the mid is 181, 184 or 188 they'll all have their own strengths, as a clearance player there are strengths that suit. There are also strengths around that player that make them better and it's like a domino affect. 1 Player helps the other, which then helps the other and it goes on til an end domino.

 

[The Chad and I]

I reckon we've got the best overall haul of players vs pre-draft expectations.
Freo have done very well too.

 

[theiaofseed]

I reckon we've got the best overall haul of players vs pre-draft expectations.
Freo have done very well too.

Fremantle have done grand theft auto on the draft.

 

[theiaofseed]

Clearly a mid can't be too tall, but there is no "too small".

I don't think he said what he wanted to say correctly. He said clearance player, a clearance player is different then a whole midfield group and having players around them to use their bodies.

I don't care if the mid is 181, 184 or 188 they'll all have their own strengths, as a clearance player there are strengths that suit. There are also strengths around that player that make them better and it's like a domino affect. 1 Player helps the other, which then helps the other and it goes on til an end domino.

Anything sub 180 is too small thats really just a reality

 

[Blackhawk42]

Anything sub 180 is too small thats really just a reality

Lachie Neale

 

[KermitJagger]

Clearly a mid can't be too tall, but there is no "too small".

I don't think he said what he wanted to say correctly. He said clearance player, a clearance player is different then a whole midfield group and having players around them to use their bodies.

I don't care if the mid is 181, 184 or 188 they'll all have their own strengths, as a clearance player there are strengths that suit. There are also strengths around that player that make them better and it's like a domino affect. 1 Player helps the other, which then helps the other and it goes on til an end domino.

I mean, fairly easy to disprove that a mid can't be too small - average height of an adult male in Australia is 175cm, and the average height of a Hawthorn midfielder (one of the smaller AFL midfields) is 185cm.

Even Lachie Neale, your poster child for undersized midfielders, is slightly above average height for an adult male in Australia. He's also an outlier the same way that Cripps is an outlier in the opposite direction.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

I mean, fairly easy to disprove that a mid can't be too small - average height of an adult male in Australia is 175cm, and the average height of a Hawthorn midfielder (one of the smaller AFL midfields) is 185cm.

Even Lachie Neale, your poster child for undersized midfielders, is slightly above average height for an adult male in Australia. He's also an outlier the same way that Cripps is an outlier in the opposite direction.

Athletes seem to be taller, like average or just above. Obviously dependent on sport. Saying Short in Footy terms is more 180cm which is short ish for an AFL player

 

[The Chad and I]

Fremantle have done grand theft auto on the draft.

I really like their first two picks.
Not really sold on Johnson.
Astounded people were actually considering him over Ward for our first pick.

 

[Bugs1977]

Yep I think your right.

And I think Frost might be a bit of a horses for courses player whereby he needs the right match up to be guaranteed a game. It will be a good sign for our sides development and for the state of our injuries if Frost isn't getting games.

The other factor in his selection is where Sic plays. Does he go forward...would be great to see him play a season in the fwd half channeling Dermie.

Hartigan a lock for mine as the no.1 key defender. Very good with the younguns too is valued for that.

I've always kind've felt that Sicily should've gotten the #23. Everything about the way he goes about his football screams Dermie.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Anything sub 180 is too small thats really just a reality

174cm Morrish Medalist, Flynn Lakey, reported to be headed to Box Hill.

 

[H00t]

I mean, fairly easy to disprove that a mid can't be too small - average height of an adult male in Australia is 175cm, and the average height of a Hawthorn midfielder (one of the smaller AFL midfields) is 185cm.

Even Lachie Neale, your poster child for undersized midfielders, is slightly above average height for an adult male in Australia. He's also an outlier the same way that Cripps is an outlier in the opposite direction.

To add to this the only two really good centre square mids I can think of under 180cm are Neale and Serong. But both happen to be able to play at 85 kg.

One of the biggest advantages of being taller is being able to play with extra weight. Taller=bigger=stronger. It’s why Mitchell dines out on the pies but finds Saints (Steele) and Roos (Cunnington) a tougher match up to effect the contest.

 

[JaegarTime]

McGrath and Merret destroyed us in the middle a couple years back. Wouldn’t say they’re ‘tall’. Height is a number, talent is what matters.

 

[Changa10]

Magnificent.

View attachment 1288347

Who are these kids Strapping Young Lad ?

 

[Bugs1977]

Who are these kids Strapping Young Lad ?

Ward and Long

 

[eldorado]

Fremantle have done grand theft auto on the draft.

Hopefully, after Richmond smashed 2004 with Deledio and Tambling, we all know no-one has stolen anything until we see how they turn out in a few years

 

[Judd2Sewell]

We have a great range of size in our midfield unit.

Inside Mids:

• Nash - 197cm | 93kg
• Long - 192cm | 88kg
• The Duke - 186cm | 85kg
• Worpel - 185cm | 85kg
• Mitchell - 182cm | 84kg

Inside / Outside Mids:

• Howe - 191cm | 91kg
• Maginess - 187cm | 80kg
• MacDonald - 185cm | 83kg
• Wingard - 183cm | 85kg
• Shiels - 183cm | 84kg
• JOM - 183cm | 82kg
• Ward - 183cm | 77kg

Outside Mids:

• Phillips - 187cm | 79kg
• Day - 187cm | 70kg (can't be correct?)
• Downie - 185cm | 82kg
• Bramble - 182cm | 75kg
• Morrison - 180cm | 79kg

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

 

[Mojo]

We have a great range of size in our midfield unit.

Inside Mids:

• Nash - 197cm | 93kg
• Long - 192cm | 88kg
• The Duke - 186cm | 85kg
• Worpel - 185cm | 85kg
• Mitchell - 182cm | 84kg

Inside / Outside Mids:

• Howe - 191cm | 91kg
• Maginess - 187cm | 80kg
• MacDonald - 185cm | 83kg
• Wingard - 183cm | 85kg
• Shiels - 183cm | 84kg
• JOM - 183cm | 82kg
• Ward - 183cm | 77kg

Outside Mids:

• Phillips - 187cm | 79kg
• Day - 187cm | 70kg (can't be correct?)
• Downie - 185cm | 82kg
• Bramble - 182cm | 75kg
• Morrison - 180cm | 79kg

Probably the wrong thread to ask this question, but I wonder what the year has in store for Phillips?

Do we see further improvement from him? Are players like Downie, Bramble, Ward, Maginess, Butler, McDonald, Duke, etc, likely to force him out of B22?

 

[CaptainWorpedo]

Probably the wrong thread to ask this question, but I wonder what the year has in store for Phillips?

Do we see further improvement from him? Are players like Downie, Bramble, Ward, Maginess, Butler, McDonald, Duke, etc, likely to force him out of B22?

Yes it does! Phillips, Morrison, Howe and Nash are all on notice after that draft haul.

 

[MrPremiership]

174cm Morrish Medalist, Flynn Lakey, reported to be headed to Box Hill.

SSP