Remove this Banner Ad

Analysis 2021 trade thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter dlanod
  • Start date Start date
  • Tagged users Tagged users None

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

One issue we have is our defensive game in the middle when we are not winning the contest. A top defensive midfielder Jack Steele averages 8.5 tackles a game, Lachie Neale just 4.1 per game. Zorko and Lyons both average around 6 per game but in our big wins Zorko is usually over 10 tackles and our losses he can be a low as 2.

In the ruck category Grundy averages 4.2 a game, Shane Mumford 4.8 per game where Oscar is 2.2 and Fullerton 1.75 tackles a game.

My view is we need to look at the defensive aspects around our midfield so anyone we look to bring in should have what we are a bit short on, a ruck that can nullify the tap outs but is defensive or a midfielder that may lacking in other areas but is defensive when we need to stop a momentum change.
 
Clarkythelion said:
One issue we have is our defensive game in the middle when we are not winning the contest. A top defensive midfielder Jack Steele averages 8.5 tackles a game, Lachie Neale just 4.1 per game. Zorko and Lyons both average around 6 per game but in our big wins Zorko is usually over 10 tackles and our losses he can be a low as 2.

In the ruck category Grundy averages 4.2 a game, Shane Mumford 4.8 per game where Oscar is 2.2 and Fullerton 1.75 tackles a game.

My view is we need to look at the defensive aspects around our midfield so anyone we look to bring in should have what we are a bit short on, a ruck that can nullify the tap outs but is defensive or a midfielder that may lacking in other areas but is defensive when we need to stop a momentum change.
Click to expand...
That's a really good point.

Tackling isn't actually that hard if you train for it and focus on it. The easiest solution would be bringing our players who aren't doing it often enough up to speed .

Of course sometimes you only get the opportunities to do it because the opposition is getting a lot of the ball.
 

Log in to remove this Banner Ad

jackess said:
I don't think we need a second ruck.

1. Our current midfield setup gets the ball forward often enough to give us an opportunity to kick goals. I don't think playing Fullarton or Joe or even McStay hurts our midfield that much.

2. Our forwardline is the best in the AFL. I don't want to throw off the structure by playing an immobile ruckman down there.
Click to expand...

This is what I'm confused about. If we get a second ruck it would only be as an inury back up to Oscar.

Once Hipwood is back you can't roll with Joe, Macca, Hippy and 2 rucks.
 
Clarkythelion said:
One issue we have is our defensive game in the middle when we are not winning the contest. A top defensive midfielder Jack Steele averages 8.5 tackles a game, Lachie Neale just 4.1 per game. Zorko and Lyons both average around 6 per game but in our big wins Zorko is usually over 10 tackles and our losses he can be a low as 2.

In the ruck category Grundy averages 4.2 a game, Shane Mumford 4.8 per game where Oscar is 2.2 and Fullerton 1.75 tackles a game.

My view is we need to look at the defensive aspects around our midfield so anyone we look to bring in should have what we are a bit short on, a ruck that can nullify the tap outs but is defensive or a midfielder that may lacking in other areas but is defensive when we need to stop a momentum change.
Click to expand...

While that's not necessarily wrong, it's worth noting that in terms of the stars of this year's grand final teams, Petracca only averages 4.1 tackles a game and Oliver only 5.2.

The Bulldogs aren't much different, with Bontempelli averaging 4.8 tackles a game, Liberatore 5.4, and Smith 3.4.

Looking at those stats, our midfield tackling numbers aren't really that far from the norm at all. Not that it isn't worth looking at, but it's not the glaring problem of our midfield group.
 
PattyKwasagun said:
While that's not necessarily wrong, it's worth noting that in terms of the stars of this year's grand final teams, Petracca only averages 4.1 tackles a game and Oliver only 5.2.

The Bulldogs aren't much different, with Bontempelli averaging 4.8 tackles a game, Liberatore 5.4, and Smith 3.4.

Looking at those stats, our midfield tackling numbers aren't really that far from the norm at all. Not that it isn't worth looking at, but it's not the glaring problem of our midfield group.
Click to expand...


Agree completely.

There is a time and place for everything but do we really want our midfield group spending most of their time racking up big tackling numbers?

If that's happening, the natural corollary is that they are being thrashed at either the hard ball or loose ball gets or maybe even both.

As usual, stats can be manipulated to suit whatever narrative you care to create.

Intuitively, I think that you want a good balance with tackle stats.

Tackle effectively without the ball rather than tackle often and use it well when you have it, rather than over-use it
 
martinson said:
We had Brown ,Lynch and Bradshaw and 2 rucks.

Maybe the game's changed. Dunno.
Click to expand...

Yeah you have to defend now, especially rebounding from defensive 50. I just do not see it personally. Even the 3 tall tall and Oscar set up was debated at the start of the year. We have made our Daniher bed in that regard.

Could bring in an Injury back up though, someone 30+ and not worth much.
 
lioninthesand said:
Yeah you have to defend now, especially rebounding from defensive 50. I just do not see it personally. Even the 3 tall tall and Oscar set up was debated at the start of the year. We have made our Daniher bed in that regard.

Could bring in an Injury back up though, someone 30+ and not worth much.
Click to expand...
I think we've got our forward mix as good as we can get it , especially when Hipwood plays. But we need more defensive efforts from Daniher and Charlie when he's having an off day. Or even on his good days. McStay really improved defensive wise this year .

I don't know why people want to stick Oscar in the forward line. Seems to be on the basis that he kicked a goal or two when he was the second ruck and fresh and able to concentrate on his kicking. Those days are gone imo. He's not that player anymore ,he's a pure ruckman. And it would make our forward line far too top heavy.
 
PattyKwasagun said:
While that's not necessarily wrong, it's worth noting that in terms of the stars of this year's grand final teams, Petracca only averages 4.1 tackles a game and Oliver only 5.2.

The Bulldogs aren't much different, with Bontempelli averaging 4.8 tackles a game, Liberatore 5.4, and Smith 3.4.

Looking at those stats, our midfield tackling numbers aren't really that far from the norm at all. Not that it isn't worth looking at, but it's not the glaring problem of our midfield group.
Click to expand...

McCluggage 3.7, Mathieson 2.6, Berry 3, Bailey 2.8 My point was as a collective group we are the best offensive team in the league, supposedly, but when a momentum swing comes we can't flip into defensive mode. Remember all the speculation about why the Suns let Lyons go and his lack of 2 way running, well right now we seem to have that through our midfield. Yes we can improve those we have and Zorko himself has massive swing from 12 tackles one week to just 2 or 3 another. If we use a "money ball" type theory we can get a lower level ruckman, $ cheaper, that could help in the defensive areas rather than one where we are focusing on their forward work. We could get a midfielder that is being tossed because they don't kick enough goals but tackles like a machine.

Let's not add to our problem and not recognise there is an issue, knowing your weakness becomes a strength.
 
mpal6 said:
Just need to find the next Hickey from scrapheap as cover for a year or two.

I wonder if Sinclair or Ceglar might be a chance.
Click to expand...
I suspect Sinclair would be a chance if you were interested. Think I read there had been interest from elsewhere and we weren't rushing to re-sign him. Granted, he'd probably be in the exact same position as he's in at the moment at the Lions, unless we think McLean or Amartey (both admittedly undersized and probably more suited to pinch-hitting) would overtake him next year.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Clarkythelion said:
McCluggage 3.7, Mathieson 2.6, Berry 3, Bailey 2.8 My point was as a collective group we are the best offensive team in the league, supposedly, but when a momentum swing comes we can't flip into defensive mode. Remember all the speculation about why the Suns let Lyons go and his lack of 2 way running, well right now we seem to have that through our midfield. Yes we can improve those we have and Zorko himself has massive swing from 12 tackles one week to just 2 or 3 another. If we use a "money ball" type theory we can get a lower level ruckman, $ cheaper, that could help in the defensive areas rather than one where we are focusing on their forward work. We could get a midfielder that is being tossed because they don't kick enough goals but tackles like a machine.

Let's not add to our problem and not recognise there is an issue, knowing your weakness becomes a strength.
Click to expand...

The tackle count is a fairly limiting metric to determine the defensive capability of the players. From what I have seen, its our ability to cover the spread against quick teams that is a bigger issue and we will often have multiple players getting sucked into the contest. When playing teams like the dogs and dees who can move it very quickly from a stoppage by hand, this is where we are very vulnerable.

Part of that is coaching and the other more important issue I feel is getting more speed onto the ball.
 
Clarkythelion said:
One issue we have is our defensive game in the middle when we are not winning the contest. A top defensive midfielder Jack Steele averages 8.5 tackles a game, Lachie Neale just 4.1 per game. Zorko and Lyons both average around 6 per game but in our big wins Zorko is usually over 10 tackles and our losses he can be a low as 2.

In the ruck category Grundy averages 4.2 a game, Shane Mumford 4.8 per game where Oscar is 2.2 and Fullerton 1.75 tackles a game.

My view is we need to look at the defensive aspects around our midfield so anyone we look to bring in should have what we are a bit short on, a ruck that can nullify the tap outs but is defensive or a midfielder that may lacking in other areas but is defensive when we need to stop a momentum change.
Click to expand...
 
Someone who would/does sacrifice his game to become/is a bonofide tagger......sometimes "backing our system in versus theirs" isnt always best option.
 

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

Wasn't it Ports midfield that got smashed in the Prelim and always seems to get caught out in big games? Finlayson and Dawson not going to improve that.

On another note some on the draft/trade board are saying there's a rumour going around that Charlie Dixon is coming back to Queensland, a Suns return or us?
 
Lazza16 said:
He has taken the bait and wiggling but he is not in the boat yet.
Click to expand...

After so many second place finishes, I am waiting for the ink to dry on a contract before I count it. That being said, we got Corr last year from GWS, but still, we have missed out on a fair few.
 
Two other clubs hold multiple first-round picks: The Giants (Picks 2 and 13) and Brisbane (Picks 14 and either 17 or 18, depending on whether Melbourne wins the flag or not). Gold Coast holds Pick 3 and Pick 19 – the latter pick being a start-of-second-round selection that was handed to them by the AFL in 2019 as part of an assistance package.

Rival clubs are optimistic both the Lions and Suns would be open to offloading their first-round picks for the appropriate deal.
Click to expand...

www.foxsports.com.au

The top prospects, future trade hurdle and clubs who could have the most impact: AFL draft state of play

AFL giant poised to reload after lost year; big victims of rule change: Draft State of Play
www.foxsports.com.au www.foxsports.com.au

Throwaway line I'm sure, but I wonder what we'd offload these picks for.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Similar threads

ZoBlitz
    • Like
News 2025 Trade News Compendium
2 3
Replies
55
Views
7K
ZoBlitz
ZoBlitz
Mr Ripper
    • Like
    • Love
2026 Pre-Season Thread
75 76 77 78 79
Replies
2K
Views
131K
briztoon
briztoon
Mr Ripper
    • Like
2nds 2026 Lions Reserves and VFL thread
16 17 18 19 20
Replies
484
Views
22K
SpecialBruce
SpecialBruce
The Flying Belgian
    • Like
Women's Footy 2026 Brisbane Lions AFLW - General Thread
2 3
Replies
50
Views
3K
Perrip
P
Mr Ripper
    • Like
2025 Club Championship thread
2 3 4 5
Replies
109
Views
5K
MSB ROYS
MSB ROYS
irel
    • Like
    • Love
Chris Fagan Appreciation thread
Replies
12
Views
3K
Sproj
S
briztoon
    • Like
List Mgmt. Back2Back Rorts Baby (aka 2026 draft thread)
25 26 27 28 29
Replies
704
Views
39K
Miller1971
M

Remove this Banner Ad

🥰 Love BigFooty? Join now for free.

Back
Top Bottom