List Mgmt. 2023 Trade Thread - Part II

[Winmar2Lockett]

One of the greatest dumb arse moves ever, got Ned Guy in who was Treloar's manager to do list management and he ****ed up their salary cap. Lost Treloar in the fall out.

I heard that the TPP mismanagement was above Guy… he was just the fall guy.

Wasn’t Gary Pert CEO at the time?


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[stavro#4]

It is possible that the Roos take him at 4, almost to demonstrate commitment. But they have 800 top 5 picks they’ve used on mids, so doesn’t really make sense. Aside from that top group, it’ll then be out of Sanders, O’Sullivan (the CHB), and Caddy; maybe Wilson at a stretch. So 7 or 8 prob needed at a min.

The Roos will take Watson or Duursma. They need a different mix then another pure mid.

Lets see what we try and do. Ive said for months that the plan was to hit this draft heavily and that they wanted another first.

lets see how they go about this - my hope is that they pull it off and show some aggression in trying to get better, which they did to an extent having a deal lined up for Elijah Hewitt on draft night

 

[beside the seaside]

You talk about risk v reward.

Tell me what is the reward for trading Coffield? A third round pick in a very shallow draft?

I think we can all understand that you need to give something to get something and I have no issue with trading Howard if the price is right.

I can’t see any reason why we should be trading players for the sake of it though.

We missed the opportunity to get a good price on Clark last year and now the interest seems to have gone anyway so he is another we’d be better off holding onto

The issue is if he's on a long term contract playing footy in the twos. Look at the situation with Billings.

People seem to have it as this no-brainer that Coffield will be a gun once he comes back from injury. If that was a certainty then he'd have a long term contract in front of him.

 

[phantom13]

Duryea must be ancient by now and Crozier seems to have missed as much footy as Coff. I've watched plenty of Dogs games and he never seems to play.

Crozier is 30 odd, Duryea is 32.

I suppose if you look at their backline. Jones, Keath, Bussliner, O'Donnel, Gardner keys. Crozier, Duryea, Richards, Vandermeer, Dale, Daniel, JJ as mid/smalls plus whoever else they have coming through or decide to turn into a half back (Macrae, Smith, Williams etc) i cant say i see a clear cut opportunity there more so than with us?

It is pure opportunity youd assume North, Hawks, Eagles, Essendon and maybe Port would be his best shot.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I'd guess between 8 and 12. Sounds like North aren't getting him but on SEN this morning they said the AFL want to give them a mid first rounder this season and an end of first round pick next year for their effort at poor administration.

I like how they let us sit in our own filth for 10 years but because we slept in our car instead of on a street corner they get given a luxury apartment while we sell our kidney to try to afford to eat still.

It is selling the idea of hard tanking as a model again to clubs that hadn't thought about it for years. Why would you try to stay competitive?

I could never work out how West Coast got a priority pick back in 2010.
Their finishing position from 2007 to 2012 were....
3,15,11,16,4,5.

Jack Darling really the difference between a wooden spoon side and a top 4 side?

 

[ScrappyDo]

Coffield McKenzie Jones and Billings...have all been on very good coin whilst rehabbing....

I reckon they would feel like they need to repay the club for their time not on the field.

Asking to go elsewhere for a new start just doesn't cut it for me....and I reckon they all stay. Between them there is say 400 games experience.

We have delisted 4 players this year and will have to do the same again in 12 months. There is potentially Seb retiring and Alison, maybe Highmore that is when you let a couple of these go...Billings contract is up probably Jones and who knows about Membrey.
Their performance in 2024 will determine their fate.
Other than that there is not a lot to cull.

Trading any of those 4 for a late pick is just silly and unless there is a delisted player better than them which is unlikely they should stay with the proviso perform regardless in 2024 or you are goneski.

Also we said Sincs was underperforming until tried in a new role, same with Battle and Wood even McKenzie. No reason Coff cannot become an on baller, winger or even hhf, has speed, height and can kick.

Hope they all stay around and deliver on their potential and belief from the club.

On SM-S916B using BigFooty.com mobile app

Billings has been told to look around. Dmac is cooked and Jones always injured. No doubt they'll have to wait till after trade season is over as they'll not be getting any interest outside the DFA market.
Coff is bait for draft advancement but may also request a fresh start.
I have little sympathy for any of them. They've all been paid around $1M bucks in the last 2 years for SFA games played.
Time to move on.

 

[crasha301]

Jeez I'm sick of the media nuffies covering up their embarrassing under assessment of our team by saying we 'over-performed" this year.

Get another job - you underperformed - not the Saints.

Been over performing the last couple years apparently lol or maybe, just maybe we are just a middle of the ladder side! Not great but not north either.

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[SaintsSeptember]

The issue is if he's on a long term contract playing footy in the twos. Look at the situation with Billings.

People seem to have it as this no-brainer that Coffield will be a gun once he comes back from injury. If that was a certainty then he'd have a long term contract in front of him.

Everyone from the draft will be getting a 3 year contract. Are they a certainty? If not we should clearly trade our picks on players who will otherwise retire.

 

[phantom13]

The issue is if he's on a long term contract playing footy in the twos. Look at the situation with Billings.

People seem to have it as this no-brainer that Coffield will be a gun once he comes back from injury. If that was a certainty then he'd have a long term contract in front of him.

No thats over simplifying the conversation.

If two years guaranteed on reasonable would keep Coff then wed be mad not to do it, we have to give that to whoever we draft in his stead anyway and its not like were crushed by the cap.

If he wants 3 or more and someone else is offering that then i for one back the club to make the best call if thats keep him or move him on then so be it). If someone is offering 4+ then let the man go.

I dont think anyone is suggesting hes guaranteed of being a gun first up back but exposed form suggests hes alot more likely to become a valuable member of our best 22 than some speculative pick in the 40s which is all wed get for him now.

If the offer was a first rounder for him, or someone else is offering a long term contract then do the deal.

I suspect the truth sits somewhere in the middle.

I can say one thing for sure, i have alot more confidence in the current administration to get this right than i have in the past and if he does go i might be sad or not agree with it (depending on the terms) but ill be okay with it.

 

[saintmike65]

I'm fine with that

I'm not fine with throwing away good players for the sake of change.

Out of Gresh, Howard, Billings, Clark and Coffield, Coff is probably the last one I'd want to see go.

You’re basing this on a guy that played 3 years ago…they’re all dispensable if we get the right return!

 

[BrutThough]

You’re basing this on a guy that played 3 years ago…they’re all dispensable if we get the right return!

And that's the point. What we would get in return for Coffield is poor so a lot of us would rather keep him because his upside is much higher than what is typically available with a 4th round pick.

 

[Mowman]

Barrett: "Someone outside that list is going to be a Saints player."
Which player we haven't heard mentioned yet will be at the Saints?

I wouldn’t pay to much attention to anything Barrett says , he knows f—k all about anything

 

[Oh When the Saints]

Tasmania draft concessions are likely to start from 2026 - they will get some kind of priority access for 2 years prior to 2028 entry into the competition based on the GWS formula.
That means compromised drafts from 2026-2030 most likely (and possibly beyond as a 20th team becomes inevitable).

There are only 3 uncompromised drafts left including this year. We need to hit the draft as much as possible over the next 2 seasons to ensure we have stockpiled whatever talent we can get before the concessions kick in.

You wouldn't want to be absent from the 2024-2025 drafts or it will do longer term damage to your list.

 

[saintmike65]

I think some of the challenge for the club is actually working out what trajectory they are on. I mean in 2013/14 with picks 3 and 1, the mood was buoyant and the only way was up. The club stuck to that path for a long time, it was buttressed in 2017 with picks 7 and 8 and some aggressive trading, new coach etc etc.

It is only with hindsight that you can see when it all falls apart and when the club should have changed tack. It is not too dissimilar now. We have a bunch of young talent that we think is the core of the future, we have made finals. Are we on a path to contender or is it a false dawn. Do we just tweak or do we aggressively turn over players to find the right combination?

I find it hard to decide where to land. But the one thing I keep coming back to is we have some very glaring weaknesses (in terms of being a contender) and I am not sure they can be glossed over with a passive approach to list management. Current list will not win us a flag.

And I don't think we are two years in. To be honest this is still a Richo/Ratten era team. This list is still carrying the ramifications of 2013 - 2017. RTB is a year in and it IS a new plan.

The list holes won’t be filled in one trade and draft year…it’s a starting point

 

[Bertha]

Not counting academy kids hes in the 5-8 range.

North aren't getting access which is nice.

They are gonna get pick 11 though and will probably trade that up to the Suns for pick 4 and take Sanders anyway.

I would love to see North trade pick 11 and something for pick 4 and then with pick 2, 3 and 4 pick each of the Suns academy players, bahahaha, it would be a beautiful thing to watch the Suns points be burnt up so quickly - it reminds me of the parable about the frog and the scorpian

 

[beside the seaside]

No thats over simplifying the conversation.

If two years guaranteed on reasonable would keep Coff then wed be mad not to do it, we have to give that to whoever we draft in his stead anyway and its not like were crushed by the cap.

If he wants 3 or more and someone else is offering that then i for on back the club to make the best call if thats keep him or more him on then so be it). If someone is offering 4+ then let the man go.

I dont think anyone is suggesting hes guaranteed of being a gun first up back but exposed form suggest hes alot more likely to become a valuable member of our best 22 than some speculative pick in the 40s which is all wed get for him now.

If the offer was a first rounder for him, or someone else is offering a long term contract do the deal.

I suspect the truth sits somewhere in the middle.

I can say one thing for sure, i have alot more confidence in the current administration to get this right than i have in the past and if he does go i might be sad or not agree with it (depending on the terms) but ill be okay with it.

I actually completely agree with you. Id like to keep Coff but if he gets a longer term deal else where I think he's gone.

 

[Bertha]

The reason i asked where he would go, was because it was mentioned to me as we were trying to find a later top 10 pick for him.

If we got an end of 1st round compo for Gresh, could we not use that with pick 12 for the Suns pick 4?

 

[stavro#4]

The list holes won’t be filled in one trade and draft year…it’s a starting point

Next year for Free Agency

 

[Mowman]

I actually completely agree with you. Id like to keep Coff but if he gets a longer term deal else where I think he's gone.

Dogs and lions both keen

 

[stavro#4]

Dogs and lions both keen

Lions not so much - More of an interest

Dogs yes

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Billings has been told to look around. Dmac is cooked and Jones always injured. No doubt they'll have to wait till after trade season is over as they'll not be getting any interest outside the DFA market.
Coff is bait for draft advancement but may also request a fresh start.
I have little sympathy for any of them. They've all been paid around $1M bucks in the last 2 years for SFA games played.
Time to move on.

McKenzie? $500K? surely not.

 

[Dr Spaceman]

I wouldn’t pay to much attention to anything Barrett says , he knows f—k all about anything

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[puppy_dog7]

That seems even worse for him. They are stacked with mid sized defenders VanDerMeer, Richards, Crozier, Duryea then Dale and Daniel (who are both former AA).

Don't know how much you know about the dogs but VanDemeer is a forward, Richards can play up on the wing as well as HB and Crozier and Duryea are not really in their teams going forward.

If he went to dogs he's up against Dale, JJ and Bailey Williams and he'll be the youngest of the 3.


At saints, he's currently behind Battle, NWM, Stocker, Webster and possibly Sincs and Windy depending on where they play next year.

I still think there's a spot for him as long as his defensive stuff can improve a bit. He's potentially our best interceptor if fit and at his best. He just needs a run at it and if he does get back to his best it gives us the flexibility of moving NWM, Windhager and Sincs to more midfield time.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

The issue is if he's on a long term contract playing footy in the twos. Look at the situation with Billings.

People seem to have it as this no-brainer that Coffield will be a gun once he comes back from injury. If that was a certainty then he'd have a long term contract in front of him.

He didn’t look anything special of the games I saw him play in the vfl toward the end of the year.

 

[bergholt]

Barrett: "Someone outside that list is going to be a Saints player."
Which player we haven't heard mentioned yet will be at the Saints?

Hah what a ****stick, he's just saying something vague that no-one will remember in a month and that can't be falsified