Are we watching a golden age of football?

[psychobrown]

mmm nah, even if we demarcate it to these individual achievements, 300 will become increasingly immaterial considering the number of games played these days. Milestones are nice little trivia for the footy fan but they hardly assure icon status for a player, in fact I doubt most people even care - just have to cast the mind back to people walking out early during Enright's 300th when the Cats lost. As others have said, the game is bigger than the individual, there are some charismatic names mentioned there but the state of the football right now overshadows personal accolade and it's hardly a golden era when you can count the number of classic games in a season on your wife's smooth immaculate toes. I tune into games to watch players take a game apart, not watch teams structure up, so I'm hopeful that the next batch of GOAT entertainers will be promising with Dangerfield, Gawn, James Cameron, Broconelley, etc. and hopefully The Fyfe doesn't come back broken.

 

[FootyJunkie]

Not according to Jacko... just a bunch of false alarmists runnin' around the park these days

 

[Tuco]

'Golden ages' usually go hand in hand with sepia-toned myopia from supporters.

I'm enjoying what we have. Plenty of cracking contests for neutrals.

The professionalism and athleticism of the modern players leaves anything I've seen over the last 30+ years for dead.

All the whining about game styles etc makes me laugh - some people go on as if there were no such thing as issues with footy in the past.

 

[PAFC66]

.

All the whining about game styles etc makes me laugh - some people go on as if there were no such thing as issues with footy in the past.

Always been issues.. never been perfection. However 90s football makes today's game look pretty poor tbh.

 

[guruisatiger]

Watching corey enright run out tonight, makes me think about the pleasure of seeing the greats in action.

Over the last decade - we`ve been watching:
Enright - club games record holder, 3X ...
Ablett- claims at the GOAT
Harvey - games record holder
Goodes - club games record holder
Judd - 2X browlow and sik kent
Pav - club games record holder
Bob murph - maybe not in this league but just a weapon on all accounts
Buddy - only bloke to get close to 1000 goals in the modern era

Apologies if ive missed anyone.

Is this a function of professionalism + inequality in the league, or will we be talking about these blokes in the same way as carey and the gang forever?

No

 

[Ablett2Garland]

2030s will be the greatest decade in Australian football.

 

[guruisatiger]

Can't remember the 80s spent the whole decade in a cauldron of illegal drugs wild orgies and insane drinking games. Can't remember the 90s spent the whole decade recovering from the 80s.. ever since 2000 when they turned afl into an indoor sport for chardonnay sipping theatre goers I've pretty well much don't care

 

[frenchconnection]

Always been issues.. never been perfection. However 90s football makes today's game look pretty poor tbh.

My brother gave Aussie Rules away some years ago as in his opinion today's modern game is not football as he used to know it (and used to play it). Thinks it's now a combination of rugby and soccer. Too many rule changes. Everybody to their own as I still follow it and am a member however there's a bit of truth in the fact there have been too many rule changes over the years. Feel when Demetriou became head poncho and Adrian Anderson was his offsides that the game progressively changed. Some for the better and some for the worse. The game has become a little too congested at times.

 

[frenchconnection]

Don't honestly enjoy this type of football TBH. The 90's were far better to watch. The current game doesn't resemble anything like the game I grew up loving. It's more like a glorified basketball currently with no players having set positions. I do miss the days when players were picked because they were good at football rather than being able to run the 100 in world record time. Probably never going to see another Diesel or Plugger in my time which is a shame

Used to enjoy watching Carey and Jakovuch go head to head against each other. When North were to play WCE the media would be debating as to whom was going to win the duel and really built the game up. You just don't see these kind of duels as much these days.

 

[Tuco]

Always been issues.. never been perfection. However 90s football makes today's game look pretty poor tbh.

Plenty to like in the 90s.

Top end teams were good to watch. But a lot of rubbish was being pumped out as well. And you had just as many top teams struggling to kicking large season tallies as we've had recently.

The middle and bottom tier teams were regularly dire, though.

I don't buy that the aethetics were that much better. Loved my footy then. Love my footy now. But I guess if you want to see an individual kick 30% of a team's entire score for the season every year the 90s was your decade, though.

 

[Jobe Watson]

We've been pretty blessed with sport in general the last 10-15 years. Gary Ablett, Lionel Messi, LeBron James, Tiger Woods, Serena Williams, Roger Federer, Michael Phelps, Usain Bolt, Sachin Tendulkar all have claims of being in the top handful of players/athletes to ever play their respective sports.

Whether we're in a golden age of football is another thing. Personally I would prefer the years of seeing Dunstall/Lockett kick 100+ goals in a code that wasn't being ruined by constant rule changes.

 

[Hellgood]

'Golden ages' usually go hand in hand with sepia-toned myopia from supporters.

I'm enjoying what we have. Plenty of cracking contests for neutrals.

The professionalism and athleticism of the modern players leaves anything I've seen over the last 30+ years for dead.

All the whining about game styles etc makes me laugh - some people go on as if there were no such thing as issues with footy in the past.

Good post. So much downtrodden dribble from mouthbreathers. I fail to see how any supporter couldn't enjoy watching a fiercely fought contest like last night.

 

[jwint43]

But no, the answer is, the late 1990s through 2000s was the golden age of football

So the period most relevant to your teams success was the golden age?

 

[H2F]

The only negative in the game now is the running required... There are Sam Mitchell's out there not getting drafted.
Tons of them. It's BS and is the real reason we have a talent pool issue. Also we need a real reserves competition so we can stop having teams play half a side of kids just not ready.

In saying all that go watch games from 20 years ago and they are more boring than most today.

Add reserves, increase lists to 80 or so and modify the rules to bring back real footballers who don't need to run 25km a game.

 

[footyfan1978]

Watching corey enright run out tonight, makes me think about the pleasure of seeing the greats in action.
Over the last decade - we`ve been watching:
Enright - club games record holder, 3X ...
Ablett- claims at the GOAT
Harvey - games record holder
Goodes - club games record holder
Judd - 2X browlow and sik kent
Pav - club games record holder
Bob murph - maybe not in this league but just a weapon on all accounts

Is this a function of professionalism + inequality in the league, or will we be talking about these blokes in the same way as carey and the gang forever?

It is a function of any half decent era I would have thought.
I don't feel it is any particularly special than any other time I watched footy.
Lets for example pull out 1983 season and have a look what was going on at the time.
Kevin Bartlett is first player to reach 400 games. Does it in round 19 v Collingwood at the G with crowd around 82 thousand despite Richmond not going to be anywhere near finals.
Bruce Doull is holding most amount of games at Carlton at the time, Gary Wilson doing same at Fitzroy, Ian Nankervis at Geelong and champion full back David Dench at North Melbourne. In fact at the time North Melbourne had games record holder from Bulldogs of Gary Dempsey there with more games plus Brownlow Medallist Keith Greig and champion wingman Wayne Schimmelbusch not far behind Dench chasing down most games in clubs history.
Leigh Matthews at Hawthorn has most games and goals record at his club. In the same year Bernie Quinlan kicks over 100 goals in season and 16 times teams kick beyond 160 points in a game. In 2016 at present we have no one near a century of goals and only 2 scores beyond a team score of 160.

In 1983 you have with 2 or 3 champion full backs all playing at same time in David Dench, Geoff Southby and Kelvin Moore. Champion centre half backs like Ross Glendinning winning the Brownlow and Jimmy Jess also a great high flying centre half back at Richmond. Have the flying dutchman Van Der Haar at Dons, high flyer Peter Knights at Hawks, Trevor Barker at Saints and Kenny Hunter or Buzz sharing mark of weeks regularly from Carlton. You had great wingers like Robbie Flower, Doug Hawkins, Schimma, Keith Greig to excite plus gun rovers like Dale Weightman, Gary Wilson or Jimmy Buckley going around. Gun centre like Maurice Rioli coming off previous season Norm Smith medal. Must say I was anything but bored each weekend following what was going on in footy.

Young guns like Timmy Watson around games 120 at just over 21 years of age, young Paul Roos exciting with Pert and Osborne at Fitzroy and also have young guns on debut like Lockett, Paul Salmon, Capper, Langford, Brian Royal, Steve Wallis and Phil Walsh on debut or Ken Judge from WA kicking over 40 goals in his first season or Krakouer brothers from North kicking over 40 each themselves. State of Origin football is around and you still have veteran rovers like Leigh Matthews kicking 79 goals up forward and you can enjoy the romance of seeing your team play at their traditional home ground knowing at 4 or 5 other venues around Melbourne there are games going on at same time to catch up with on radio and scoreboard. If you look for alternative entertainment than pure gun footballers you could enjoy cult figures like Jacko kick 41 goals in 10 games and do hand stands and jump around like an idiot to Kelvin Moore on him.

In fact I believe there would have been close to over 20 players in season kick over 40 goals for their clubs.
I reckon in 1983 we just seeing end of Kevin Bartlett, Gary Ablett gone bush from Hawks, Blight gone back to SANFL to coach, Leigh Matthews in his twilight years at Hawks and some of great wingers like Robbie Flower, Keith Greig and greatest full backs ever playing all at same time. Might even have best kick ever in Superboot for Fitzroy bagging the ton. Lockett is just about to start his career and Gazza will turn up at Geelong and Dunstall to Hawks.
Fair bet this is the golden era right there. To borrow some of your own words..
...claims at the GOAT., Matthews, Ablett or Bartlett, take your pick..games record holder.. Bartlett- many club games record holder
Greig - 2X browlow
Nankervis , Dempsey, Doull, Wilson - club games record holder

I am sure when Bob Pratt and Laurie Nash were around it felt just as golden then.
Or when Haydn Bunton or Dick Reynolds ran around.
Or Polly Farmer and Barry Cable.
Or Matthews, Hudson, Hart and Jezza
Or Carey and Voss,
Or Dangerfield and Rioli.
It is always happening in whatever era the NOW is.

 

[Sausages]

So, we have a collection of relativists (ie, golden age is comparable relative your team's success), subjectivists (golden age subjective to what's 'golden') and a few absolutists (this was better than that, finish).

Embrace nihilism people (my team was/is/always will be rubbish and we are all going to die).

*Input welcomed TheBrownDog

*edit

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

We are focusing exclusively on the players here- not the essendons and hawthorns of the football world..

If we're focussing purely on players then you either have the early to mid 80s or the early 90s.

Matthews
Ablett
Dunstall
Lockett
Williams
Bartlett

You have the games record holder who was also an out and out champion. Matthews, Ablett and Williams who are all in the TOtC, the all time leading goalkicker and the 2nd all time leading goalkicker (who'd probably have the record if his knee didn't blow out). The player voted Player of the Century and 2, Ablett and Matthews, who are regularly in the conversation for the GOAT.

or
Carey
Ablett
Dunstall
Lockett
Williams
Tuck

Same as above but just swap Bartlett for Tuck and Matthews for Carey in the GOAT debate.

 

[Topkent]

Late 90s early 2000s was the peak of the curve that is AFL footy .. Its not the same sport I grew up watching as a kid and I dont think its changed for the better
Too much defensive play and too much focus on athletic ability rather than footy nous
I hate watching goals where the zone falls apart and someone just walks the ball over the goal line... thats not footy thats ******* soccer where you beat the offside trap and have an easy chance

 

[footyfan1978]

the bringing in of the suns and giants has massively diluted the quality of football IMO, just imagine the likes of cameron, patton, sheil, greene, whitfield, kelly, hopper, coniglio, smith, scully, davis, lynch, wright, prestia, swallow, miller, martin, saad, may, hall etc. spread over the other 16 clubs.

i know the lions would be a lot more competitive with a lynch and a davis in the key positions ATM.

have only been following AFL since the late 90s so my personal golden age was from round 1 2001 to preliminary final day 2004.

To borrow your own phrase but changing the year of which new clubs increased the number of clubs but diluted the talent in actual teams...
"the bringing in of the eagles and bears has massively diluted the quality of football IMO"

The game is at its worst and if something doesn't change soon we will have the 3rd ranked football code in Australia. The interchange needs to be dramatically reduced to a very low number so the game opens up.

Interchange going from 2 to 4 has caused more harm to game than just about any other change I seen to game in all my time following.

Let's see.
- Lack of personalities
- Rarely see one on one duels for a whole game
- Not as many key forwards getting to 100 goals in a season
- The game is pretty much a rolling scrum for 4 quarters
- High marking is all but lost to the game
- Forget about the bump
- Tackling now means jumping on a player and holding the ball in
Oh yeah, it's great

As for the game, yeah it's not as good, for several reasons already stated. Ask yourselves how much you enjoy watching games when your team isn't playing, compared to yesteryear.
Reducing the interchange may be the last chance.

If they ever change interchange back to 2 I will be more excited at any change to game I seen in decades
Instead they are simply looking at cutting back on of the extent of abuse of interchange system that turned it into a game of 22 players trying to out run and out zone the other team of 22.

Yep.

Basically there are too many teams. As it stands each team has 22 players per game which is a lot. 18 teams is a lot.
It makes for watered down talent and difficulty building a list of you are not so great; and following on from that it means coached have to mitigate by playing very defensively.

I do think there is hope though. Reduce the interchange, and start paying holding the man as a free again and the game will look a lot better.

One of better threads I read in some time as far as thoughts on game spectacle overall.

Can't remember the 80s spent the whole decade in a cauldron of illegal drugs wild orgies and insane drinking games. Can't remember the 90s spent the whole decade recovering from the 80s.. ever since 2000 when they turned afl into an indoor sport for chardonnay sipping theatre goers I've pretty well much don't care

I suspect this all started moments after 1982 grand final for a Tigers fan

 

[Farm Boy]

We are not in a golden age. We are in the performance enhanced era.

 

[Ando727]

Doggies fans yearning for the return of mid-50s footy.

I could go for a bit of that myself...

 

[footyfan1978]

We are not in a golden age. We are in the performance enhanced era.

4 clubs have lost 10 games or more in a row this season.
Never happened before in all the seasons of league history.

 

[M Malice]

To borrow your own phrase but changing the year of which new clubs increased the number of clubs but diluted the talent in actual teams...
"the bringing in of the eagles and bears has massively diluted the quality of football IMO"

was not a follower of the game back when the bears/eagles came into the competition so can not make too much of a first hand comment other than if going by what i have heard happened at the time i don't think the bears and eagles got the same start up concessions re player signings as the very generous ones offered to the giants and suns. the result of those start up concessions continue today IMO with the glut of first round picks they have had they can move up the draft order very easily by trading out excess very good talent.

i propose that the giants and suns continue to compromise the draft even now.

 

[threesixpio]

Yup. 4 Hawthorn flags in a row, GWS, a Brownlow medalist found guilty of doping...

"Golden age"

Remove the GWS bit and I would post this without sarcasm

 

[footyfan1978]

was not a follower of the game back when the bears/eagles came into the competition so can not make too much of a first hand comment other than if going by what i have heard happened at the time i don't think the bears and eagles got the same start up concessions re player signings as the very generous ones offered to the giants and suns. the result of those start up concessions continue today IMO with the glut of first round picks they have had they can move up the draft order very easily by trading out excess very good talent.

i propose that the giants and suns continue to compromise the draft even now.

Yeah, that is a side matter in itself about compromised draft. Do not disagree about that.
However for this actual thread topic the fact that two new clubs means more talent spread far and wide whether it be from 12 to 14 clubs, from 14 to 16 clubs or from 16 to 18 clubs means the level of player quality in best football teams has been further and further eroded for several decades now as more clubs get added whilst at same time the salary cap started up in mid to late 1980's.

For mine nothing I seen from the better teams has allowed as much talent in the top few teams as we could see in early to mid 1980's before new clubs came along and salary caps forced best teams to not keep adding more talent.

The last off season where best teams kept adding talent for mine was from 1985 to 86 which was before salary caps, drafts and expansion clubs stopped that trend of better teams increasing their list talent. All the best teams can do since then is try to hold onto whatever talent they got for as cheap as they can contract their stars. It eventually reeled in Essendon, Hawks and Carlton from the super sides that won premierships from 1981 to 1989 and spread the talent across more clubs and therefore many more different clubs winning premierships.

Seven different clubs in league won premierships from 1990 to 1997.
Incredible stat after 5 clubs shared all the flags from 1967 to 1989 and just Carlton, Hawks and Essendon all the flags from 1981 to end of 1980's.
1980's was the golden era of super sides battling out for the premiership.'
1990's was the golden era for diluted sides battling it out to share the premierships around the league.
2000s was the golden era of league manipulative polices helping clubs from non-traditonal states finally get premierships.
2010's will be the golden era of compromised drafts stopping teams that were struggling in late 2000's bridging the gap to the clubs that were best before GWS and Suns have time to mature into what they were designed to become.