Preview Changes - Rd 16 V Brisbane Lions, Aurora Stadium

[Mervyn Beasley]

Out: shoe, someone else
In: Mitch laddo

browny's forward pressure is great but he showed before he got injured that he is a defender and that's all.

still don't know what to do with rough, the triple m team now call him the pedestrian, describing how he goes about it

special mention to bateman, missed a couple of easy shots which cost us in the 3rd but when they moved him onto ablett after half time ablett only had a handful of ineffective disposals. Thats ablett and stanton now he has tagged and beaten

Cant figure why he wasn't on him earlier.
Cant figure why Brown wasn't in defense for whole game.

Cant figure why I'm not an afl coach either

 

[Kapil Hawk]

Look, Shoey's reaction times are up to AFL standard - that's why he's been playing a vital role in our defence for the last month.

Shoey's reaction time struggled in a high pressure contest against the premier contested ball side in the competition - perhaps ever.

So it's a very valid opinion to suggest Shoey was found out a bit in this particular game but put it into context and enough of the sneering, destructive comments.

Shoenmakers has been found out in four games this year; twice against Geelong and twice against the Dogs (possibly again with Collingwood but bar Hodge the whole team was poo that night).

So whilst you go on about how Shoe should not be the scapegoat for todays game (and imo he shouldnt, the bad kicking and the fact he was selected in the first place considering that there were two backs coming in) you have to think objectively and say are wheter or not we a top 4 team.

And like a lot of people here I think you will say yes and Shoenmakers at the moment is not up to the pressure of top 4 teams and should not be put in the position that he was today in the first place. He is not up to it at the moment as a 19 year old. Correct he looked like a deer in headlights today but like the deer he should not have been there in the first place. And here here to the person who said that just because he is young he shouldn't be open to criticism. It epitomises the one eyed tones of these threads.

 

[Gralin]

While I think the Schoe showed the last two weeks that he is not ready for the pressure of big games with his disposal and decision making, I think that getting experience in those kind of games is the best way to get better.

Look at what Tom Murphy has done since coming back this year, if we can get that kind of improvement out of Schoe that will be great. He wasn't the reason we lost, we still could have won if one kick had gone our way, in games that close though it's easy to point at one player who didn't play great and say, if someone else had his spot and played better we would have won.

 

[bigbuddyboy]

And i'll disagree. Shoey has been in the team in the last 3 weeks and played very well. Pls name the games that shoey was average? i can tell against essendon he had 14 spoils out of a team total of 24?

I will defend shoey, he did not cost us the game, and you should not turn shoey into the scapegoat.

I never once said he cost us the game, or that he lost it for us etc. This is an INS/outs thread, no? I was just giving my opinion that shoey should be out. I'll admit, not in the best way (which I feel bad about and am sorry for lowering my colours) but I was fired up at the time. I won't apologise for suggesting he should be dropped in this kind of thread though.

I'll also add brown needs to play down back in the future. Why he was FF is beyond me.

Again, never once blamed shoey for the loss. I just suggested he should be droped, so I don't see how I'm making him the scapegoat for the loss.

 

[Hawkforce]

I
Again, never once blamed shoey for the loss. I just suggested he should be droped, so I don't see how I'm making him the scapegoat for the loss.

Totally fair enough to suggest he needs a spell, or isn't best 22 for next week. I don't think any thinks Shoey's automatic best 22.

It's the suggestions (not necessarily made by you but by others in this thread and others) that he's "not up to it" that are ridiculous, soft, and kneejerk. As I said - calls made by the same soft poor judges of football who ripped into Tom Murphy like a bunch of Richmond supporters.

This kind of posting needs to be called out for what it is.

 

[macdaddio]

Does anybody know what injuries/reports that may come out of the match, still can't believe we blew it we could of been 9-6 rather than 8-7.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

I want Muston in the team. I think he adds a lot. I think we missed him yesterday. Brown's forward pressure was good but would have preferred him on the backline.

Lewis picked up 2 goals as a small forward, but we didn't have Cyril, Peterson or Brown contribute on the score board. We needed another small forward to step up to match the impact of Stokes at the other end.

 

[buddylg]

B: Guerra - Gilham - Gibson

HB: Birchall - Stratton - Brown

C: Young - Mitchell - Lewis

HF: Burgoyne - Franklin - Bateman

F: Rioli - Roughead - Osborne

R: Renouf - Hodge - Sewell

INT: Ellis - Ladson - Skipper - Murphy

Because mitchell and ladson > schoe and peterson. Schoenmakers and peterson will get better with time

 

[Hawk Dork]

They will need to find room for Ladson, Hooper,Mitchell,and maybe Taylor either this week or next or the one after.
Its getting harder to keep your spot.

 

[Fastback]

While I think the Schoe showed the last two weeks that he is not ready for the pressure of big games with his disposal and decision making, I think that getting experience in those kind of games is the best way to get better.

Look at what Tom Murphy has done since coming back this year, if we can get that kind of improvement out of Schoe that will be great. He wasn't the reason we lost, we still could have won if one kick had gone our way, in games that close though it's easy to point at one player who didn't play great and say, if someone else had his spot and played better we would have won.

Totally agree - we need to persevere with Cobbler. These games are massive for his development. Every time he trains now he'll have in the back of his mind what is required to play finals type footy.
Hopefully it drives him to better things.
If he gets dropped, so be it, but I'd play him against Brisbane and reinforce what's expected - would love to see a confident Schoey for the finals.

 

[Pessimistic]

I was just thinking we have played three games in a row at finals intensity. Two against top finals teams and have been in winning positions, or won.

It seems likely we wont make the top 4 so 4 finals wins would be required for a "Bradbury" flag.

Can we maintain the intensity next week ? will be interesting to see.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

Outs: Peterson & Shoey
Ins: Mitch & Ladson/Muston

I disagree with people saying we have to persist with Shoey. The beauty of the way things are going at the moment are we can actually pick our best 22 and look to stick with it. Browny back into Defence, Mitch into the middle, Muston or Ladson back up forward to provide the forward pressure.

Shoey will be a good player for us, but we don;t have to simply play him 'to get games into him' now, we pick our best 22 and go from there.

 

[walhawk]

Let's wait and see how Laddo, musto & co go today at Box Hill.
But Shoe out, someone in at a minimum.
Struth - 2pm already? Better head down to City Oval

 

[Hungry Hawk]

How good was Gilham yesterday. Loved his game.

Peterson was dissapointing for me and looked timid against the bigger bodied cats.

Boy we missed mitchell.

Schoe missed a few targets and did look slow when Geelong went small in the forward line. He was very serviceable though whe Ottens went forward.

Out: Peterson
In: Mitchell

 

[HawkXNtric]

Apparently Lisle has been tearing it up at Box Hill. When will it be time to give the Big Moose a run? From all accounts he will probably move ahead of Dowler in the pecking order.

What about Lisle in for the Shoe?

My concern is that if one of Buddy or Roughy miss, we are really light on for key forwards and the obvious answer is Lisle. He looked ok in the pre-season games and I think that a game in the ones would do him good.

And of course, hopefully Mitchell comes back in.

And most importantly, I hope that Renouf is ok to play because he would be a mammoth loss to the side if not fit (shudders and thinks of North game when we went down to Tassie with NO rucks.......)

 

[Pessimistic]

How much would we be fined if we played Robbie Campbell ?

 

[macdaddio]

I really miss Shhhh, havent heard from him/her/it for a while, i really need some good news to come out of this loss to the Cats, i cant get out of my head how we had those Pussies on toast and let it slip, if there was no injuries/reports to come out of the game then it will help heal the pain, and if the guys are still up and about then im still happy...

 

[walhawk]

Taylor looked a fair way off today at Box Hill. Got reported too.
Lisle was great. Should come in if Renouf or Buddy miss.
For mine, Shoe and Peterson out (neither know how to get involved in the game), Ladson & Lisle in. Whitecross first emergency.

 

[Pharaoh]

Amazed to see people sticking the boots into Peterson. In my opinion he added some mercurial brilliance to our forward line and contributed to numerous forward fifty entries and rebounds, particularly in the third. It's not his fault that others couldn't capitalise on his work. Far more productive than Muston has been so far.

I bet if you asked the average Geelong supporter they would be happy to see him dropped for the next contest.

 

[Brant]

Why would Renouf miss - what happened there?

 

[macdaddio]

Why would Renouf miss - what happened there?

Ankle he did againts the Dogs, well thats what Doc Larkins said after the match but i find that he is mostly wrong about everything he says..

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

From one source, there were less than 25 players in the entire league (out of 700-odd) that didn't either suffer a game-ending injury, miss weeks with injury, miss due to illness, recovery or rehabilitation or were under injury-management.

That's less than two players per team that were "injury free".

Doc Larkins, like many in the industry gets lots of whispers, rumours and suggestions - what he chooses to print/publish relies on as much innuendo as what we put out, just with a more professional polish.

I have no doubt Renouf hurt himself against the dogs, the same as he did a few months back, despite playing out both games, his performance almost immediately dropped away.

We aren't at the levels of the NFL yet (in terms of getting injured players playing), but I don't think we are that far away - careers are made and destroyed on the back of misinformation, and bad medical decisions.

 

[Brant]

Playing sore is one thing, but playing 'injured' & having the injury masked by jabs is another... Be it a reality or not; I would hate to think we were putting Twister at risk.

Is that what is being suggested - that Renoif is injured? Hope I am just reading it wrong.

 

[Ellis2WeightsRoom]

Outs: Peterson & Shoey
Ins: Mitch & Ladson/Muston

I disagree with people saying we have to persist with Shoey. The beauty of the way things are going at the moment are we can actually pick our best 22 and look to stick with it. Browny back into Defence, Mitch into the middle, Muston or Ladson back up forward to provide the forward pressure.

Shoey will be a good player for us, but we don;t have to simply play him 'to get games into him' now, we pick our best 22 and go from there.

Great post.

 

[Snibs]

Totally fair enough to suggest he needs a spell, or isn't best 22 for next week. I don't think any thinks Shoey's automatic best 22.

It's the suggestions (not necessarily made by you but by others in this thread and others) that he's "not up to it" that are ridiculous, soft, and kneejerk. As I said - calls made by the same soft poor judges of football who ripped into Tom Murphy like a bunch of Richmond supporters.

This kind of posting needs to be called out for what it is.

Honestly this is crap. Up until the last month the criticism levelled at Tom Murphy's performance has been warranted and justified. The fact that he is playing good football at the moment does not excuse or make up for his performance for the first 10 odd weeks. If you think his perfomances pre June were acceptable then you are the poor judge of football.