Prediction Do you think we make finals?

[Southerntakeover]

Agree that Josh’s output matches Betts, but without the mercurial acts. That said, Rachele’s goal from the boundary line was sublime, an in play checkside is more amazing and excites the crowd, but it’s still only 6 points.

If people argue Bett’s crowd excitement has extra value, it really doesn’t, it’s an instant sugar hit. What remains is the crowd’s baseline excitement level, which is related to the state of the match and the current trend. Turned a 5 goal deficit to a goal and its fever pitch, rudimentary goals register max on the excitement meter. Turned a 5 goal advantage into a point and the engagement is high, but the energy is nervousness.

Long way of saying Rach and Betts are equal, per your original post.

Betts actually hit the wall in the back end of 2017 which its easy to forget, but his two years before that are of an elite level of small forward play that has largely not been matched in the modern era. He was a genuine competitor to win the Coleman some years.

He averaged 3.1 goals a game as a small forward in 2016. Insane stuff.

People are underrating what he was.

 

[kirky]

That’s a different discussion, you were comparing individuals against their logical replacements. That’s all I was doing. And I’m not sure that based on ‘body of work’ current side would definitely beat the 2017 side. At least body of work up to and including GF.

It is interesting to discuss given the 2017 got smashed in a number of games (North in Tasmania, Melbourne @ Adelaide Oval) whereas this side is yet to be smashed by anyone.

 

[kirky]

2017 Walker to 2025 Walker, massive downgrade.

2017 Talia to Butts?

Dawson might be where Sloane is that year, we don't have someone having the same success Matt Crouch did.

Claiming Rachelle is equal to Betts, arguably the best small forward ever, is wild.

Well lets wait and see at the end of Rachele’s career - he is tracking very well on all the stats.

And if he wins a flag, then he automatically goes up in the rankings.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Well lets wait and see at the end of Rachele’s career - he is tracking very well on all the stats.

And if he wins a flag, then he automatically goes up in the rankings.

The standard for Rash isn't going to be 640 goals, but you'd also suspect he won't sit in the forward pocket his whole career. None of this is to diminish the year he's having, I'm a big backer.

The premiership comment is asinine.

 

[1970crow]

2017 Walker to 2025 Walker, massive downgrade.

2017 Talia to Butts?

Dawson might be where Sloane is that year, we don't have someone having the same success Matt Crouch did.

Claiming Rachelle is equal to Betts, arguably the best small forward ever, is wild.

Agree Walker.

Talia career wise huge, GF day was carrying a calf and was a liability.

Dawson I have ahead of Sloane because he can be deployed to other roles if inside mid isn’t working. In terms of overall quality, he already has as many AAs and BnFs as Sloane.

Whoever we put up against Mrouch will lose on the surface. But we had Sloane and both Crouch’s dominating possessions to half time and we were behind. Berry is probably the current comparison and I’m happy to concede it’s a loss. But I like the way he’s prepared to take the game on with his legs. I don’t think it’s as big a loss as the stats would suggest.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Agree Walker.

Talia career wise huge, GF day was carrying a calf and was a liability.

Dawson I have ahead of Sloane because he can be deployed to other roles if inside mid isn’t working. In terms of overall quality, he already has as many AAs and BnFs as Sloane.

Whoever we put up against Mrouch will lose on the surface. But we had Sloane and both Crouch’s dominating possessions to half time and we were behind. Berry is probably the current comparison and I’m happy to concede it’s a loss. But I like the way he’s prepared to take the game on with his legs. I don’t think it’s as big a loss as the stats would suggest.

Are we talking about the season, or that one game?

The 2017 Richmond team in the form they were in on Grand Final day would maul this current team. I don't think we should pretend otherwise.

 

[Cromulant]

Rach is averaging 2.3 per game. If it’s about goals, there’s little difference at this stage.

Personally I think Rash has been better at bringing others into the game

Eddie was brilliant but I dont recall him pushing up to the wings and hitting leading forwards with sublime passes.

 

[1970crow]

Are we talking about the season, or that one game?

The 2017 Richmond team in the form they were in on Grand Final day would maul this current team. I don't think we should pretend otherwise.

I don’t know anymore. Butt on Betts v Rach, the latter is averaging the same goals per game as Eddie did in 2017. Most other stats near identical too. If you want to assign value to intangibles, go ahead, I won’t stop you.

 

[kirky]

The premiership comment is asinine.

I disagree and with his current output etc, if he jags you a flag he automatically goes up in the rankings.

Now players like Keating etc, only playing 6 games, don’t get any more browny points for being a premiership player given he had no career (he was in the right spot at the right time).

 

[AFC979810]

Betts actually hit the wall in the back end of 2017 which its easy to forget, but his two years before that are of an elite level of small forward play that has largely not been matched in the modern era. He was a genuine competitor to win the Coleman some years.

Not really - Just became a lot more selfless.

First 12 - 34 goals, 10 goal assists.

2nd 12 (including finals) - 23 goals, 19 goal assist.

His showdown performance in rd 20 was amazing.

 

[AFC979810]

Seedsman was better. Call it even.

2017 Seedsman wasn't better than Hinge.

Now 2021 Seedsman you would have an argument.

 

[Freomaniac]

Squiggle ladder predictor has us finishing 3rd (behind Geelong and Collingwood) on 17 wins.

So 17 wins , 6 losses and 0 draws from 23 games? Nice.

I actually thought Crows vs Brisbane was gonna be a draw on Friday night.

Still 16 wins, 1 draw and 6 losses is still good

 

[MrBarry]

It isn’t based on being better on a given day, it is about over a body of work.

Our current side would beat our 2017 side.

Agreed and I believe if you put this side in that game in 2017, they beat Richmond.

I feel the personalities and talent that bats much deeper, are better equipped.

 

[clinto69]

Just think about this for a moment, if we weren't robbed of a free kick against GC round 1, we'd be sitting top of the AFL ladder right now.

 

[kirky]

Just think about this for a moment, if we weren't robbed of a free kick against GC round 1, we'd be sitting top of the AFL ladder right now.

Until Collingwood played tomorrow - can’t see Melbourne winning tomorrow with their goalkicking blues.

 

[Mattrox]

Just think about this for a moment, if we weren't robbed of a free kick against GC round 1, we'd be sitting top of the AFL ladder right now.

While seeing the growth in our group and our list improvements, we have a soft draw this year.

That would be wall papering over the cracks.

While a high ladder position may be achievable from here, we are not serious flag challengers this year.

We need to beat Collingwood leading into finals before the lid lifts.

 

[Cromulant]

Agreed and I believe if you put this side in that game in 2017, they beat Richmond.

I feel the personalities and talent that bats much deeper, are better equipped.

Massive call.

The 2017 side was very very good, this one isn't there yet

 

[Hobbes]

This is my newly adjusted predictor. On track for the usual rumblings from Cats fans about home finals at the G.


View attachment 2336984

Are you predicting another draw for Brisbane?

 

[NSolis]

Massive call.

The 2017 side was very very good, this one isn't there yet

Frankly an astonishing call. This team finished bottom 4 last year, the 2017 team finished on top of the ladder and absolutely hammered the third best team of the year in a prelim. We've improved from last year for sure but still haven't demonstrated a consistent ability to beat good teams, win on the road, or deliver for a whole season. There's miles to go to reach the level of 2017, and I say that as someone who is very optimistic about this group.

 

[imagifED]

My expectation is that we get to 17 wins with losses only against Hawthorn and Bulldogs away. We should beat contenders at home.

 

[1970crow]

Are you predicting another draw for Brisbane?

I use draws for games I think are 50/50. Suns, Pies and Freo away I have as draws.

 

[Scorpus]

Frankly an astonishing call. This team finished bottom 4 last year, the 2017 team finished on top of the ladder and absolutely hammered the third best team of the year in a prelim. We've improved from last year for sure but still haven't demonstrated a consistent ability to beat good teams, win on the road, or deliver for a whole season. There's miles to go to reach the level of 2017, and I say that as someone who is very optimistic about this group.

The difference between whether the team is better (obviously and categorically not) or whether the individual players are better (not as far apart)

 

[kirky]

My expectation is that we get to 17 wins with losses only against Hawthorn and Bulldogs away. We should beat contenders at home.

Including Collingwood two weeks before finals. Interesting.

 

[Cleric]

We will obviously make finals this year, but I'm not sold on how far we will go in them.
We are only just coming into our window, and with the majority of the team coming into the peak powers over the next 5 years, we will be challenging for a flag very soon.

We still have issues to fix with our midfield.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Agreed and I believe if you put this side in that game in 2017, they beat Richmond.

I feel the personalities and talent that bats much deeper, are better equipped.

After a grand total of one win against a likely finalist this year we certainly deserve to be described as better than the beginning of one of the greatest modern dynasties.