Prediction Future of Josh has gone to the Dogs.

[Rally]

AFTER 18 GAMES
Schache - 8.7 disposals, 3.9 marks, 1.0 goals/1.0 behinds
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Lynch (GC) - 10.8, 5.5, 0.89/0.4
Kennedy - 8.3, 4.3, 1.0/0.3
Hawkins - 10.6, 4.6, 1.4/0.8
Cameron - 9.9, 4.8, 1.8/1.0
Franklin - 10.7, 3.8, 1.0/0.7

 

[carnthemlions]

I think while you cut him some slack for being young and playing in a very poor side it's just difficult to see him becoming the forward we were hoping for when we selected him with pick 2.

Tom Lynch probably had a worse start to his career in a struggling Suns team and is probably the type of forward Schache to aspire to play like.

We have to be patient on one hand but on the other hand he's yet to do anything much better than Jordan Lisle did over his career. The only wow moment I can remember is a big pack mark on the goal line last year.

This makes no sense to me. Schache (two games into his second season) probably won't become the player we want him to but plays like Tom Lynch who had a worse start to his career but is also like Jordan Lisle. Good post.

 

[jackess]

This makes no sense to me. Schache (two games into his second season) probably won't become the player we want him to but plays like Tom Lynch who had a worse start to his career but is also like Jordan Lisle. Good post.

Your comprehension skills might need a little work.

You can't rule out anything. You cut him some slack. Tom Lynch is the type of forward he aspire to play like, aspire.

What it comes down to is he has played poor-average in his 19 games. If he was 23 and a pick 30 you'd say he could be delisted.

The difference between him and Hipwood is that Hipwood has shown that he has the talent to win a game off his own boot despite being even more raw. At the same time his weaknesses are greater and may end up similar to Jack Watts

 

[bungalow_bill]

AFTER 18 GAMES
Schache - 8.7 disposals, 3.9 marks, 1.0 goals/1.0 behinds
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Lynch (GC) - 10.8, 5.5, 0.89/0.4
Kennedy - 8.3, 4.3, 1.0/0.3
Hawkins - 10.6, 4.6, 1.4/0.8
Cameron - 9.9, 4.8, 1.8/1.0
Franklin - 10.7, 3.8, 1.0/0.7

In terms of goals/behinds ahead of Lynch,Kennedy,Franklin and not far behind Hawkins and Cameron. Tracking very nicely

 

[BRAB]

Schache ran heaps last year, think he lead contested marks as well from memory.


Kicked plenty of goals and should have had even more in all honesty.


His role has gotten even harder this year, last year he least Walker was the hard body in defence (albeit Schache still had the number 1 defender) but last night he was playing as the main target. Still managed 12 disposals and a couple of shots at goal.


He looks weak at ground level because he is. He doesn't have the athleticism of Hipwood because barely any young player in the competition does. He's got a large frame that he hasn’t filled out yet and no significant amount of speed to compensate for it. When there's a turnover in the forward 50 there's usually 2 or 3 faster players running it out of defence and people seem to get angry that Schache can't shut them down.

Our forward structure just wasn't good enough last night. We had so much space that we weren't utilising. Hipwood needs to be instructed to lead up the ground and Schache needs to lead into the space that Hipwood creates. At the moment we're using them both as gorilla targets with the way the forward line is set up and it's simply not sustainable.

Schache is worlds beyond what you expect a 2nd year forward to accomplish. In an ideal world he is playing as the 3rd target in a forward line with an established key forward, he just doesn't get that luxury.

His ground work is such a small aspect of what makes a good key forward. He leads well, he marks well, he's smart enough to create separation and he's good enough to leave the forward line and take contested marks up the ground. His limiting factors are all influenced by his age, his tank and his confidence that will all come with time.

I'm not concerned at all about Schache and it's completely unfair that he's basically expected to already become the player that he will be in a few years. If we're lucky enough we'll get to see him grow into that player at the Lions and if not it'll hurt seeing him do it for another club.

 

[carnthemlions]

Your comprehension skills might need a little work.

You can't rule out anything. You cut him some slack. Tom Lynch is the type of forward he aspire to play like, aspire.

What it comes down to is he has played poor-average in his 19 games. If he was 23 and a pick 30 you'd say he could be delisted.

The difference between him and Hipwood is that Hipwood has shown that he has the talent to win a game off his own boot despite being even more raw. At the same time his weaknesses are greater and may end up similar to Jack Watts

What's the point of posting this? For me, the most important thing is that Schache has done enough to get a game on merit almost from day one. He hasn't set the world on fire, but he's done his job, and that's more than you can say of most key forwards his age. You'll say you're just pointing out that he has clear weaknesses and has a lot of work to do, but it's pretty obvious that you're still on that same 'we'll be fine without Schache' tear than you've been on ever since the speculation started around his future. * it's tiresome.

 

[jackess]

What's the point of posting this? For me, the most important thing is that Schache has done enough to get a game on merit almost from day one. He hasn't set the world on fire, but he's done his job, and that's more than you can say of most key forwards his age. You'll say you're just pointing out that he has clear weaknesses and has a lot of work to do, but it's pretty obvious that you're still on that same 'we'll be fine without Schache' tear than you've been on ever since the speculation started around his future. **** it's tiresome.

I don't think he has a clear weakness it's more that he doesn't have a standout attribute. I think we'll be better off keeping him but I also think there's a decent chance that he won't live up to the expectations we had when we drafted him. He'll sit outside the top bracket of key forwards.

I just don't think we need to pay way overs for him.

 

[Haso]

I was pleasantly surprised to see Schache leading up through the centre square and attempting to orchestrate play into the 50. It didn't always pay off but it is clear that he is attempting to play the game in a manner beyond that of a stay at home forward.

I think he is miles beyond a standard young forward prospect. It isn't always falling his way right now and I can only hope that he is resilient enough to not allow it to stifle his development.

 

[acuguy]

I reckon when he took that hanger last year and last night when his big arms when high in the air and snaffled that first grab, he had a standout attribute. Schache has come in and had to deal with Carlisle and Brown (big bodied opponents) and then last night Rance and Astbury. Funny how Weidemann from Melbourne has looked average in the games without Hogan in the team. I can't wait for Schache and Hipwood to have 5 preseasons under their belts, they are going to have some fun at the GABBA!

 

[BRAB]

If Schache was 23 years old his expectations would be different so it's an inherently unfair criticism. KPP's performances are intrinsically tied to their age.

 

[winged1]

I reckon when he took that hanger last year and last night when his big arms when high in the air and snaffled that first grab, he had a standout attribute. Schache has come in and had to deal with Carlisle and Brown (big bodied opponents) and then last night Rance and Astbury. Funny how Weidemann from Melbourne has looked average in the games without Hogan in the team. I can't wait for Schache and Hipwood to have 5 preseasons under their belts, they are going to have some fun at the GABBA!

Even more reason to play Close

 

[Nunez]

AFTER 18 GAMES
Schache - 8.7 disposals, 3.9 marks, 1.0 goals/1.0 behinds
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Lynch (GC) - 10.8, 5.5, 0.89/0.4
Kennedy - 8.3, 4.3, 1.0/0.3
Hawkins - 10.6, 4.6, 1.4/0.8
Cameron - 9.9, 4.8, 1.8/1.0
Franklin - 10.7, 3.8, 1.0/0.7

Hawkins: 25 goals in 19 games of which 16 were wins. He was playing with a premiership team after all. No shocks there.
Lynch: Struggled big time in his first 3 years and broke out with 33 goals in his 4th year. Schache more impressive in his first two than Lynch was by far.
Kennedy: Kicked 18 goals over 29 games - His first two years with Carlton, he managed 11 over 22.
Cameron: Came on super early. He's the exception not the rule.
Buddy: Statistically measures up quite well to Schache.

 

[bungalow_bill]

Hawkins: 25 goals in 19 games of which 16 were wins. He was playing with a premiership team after all. No shocks there.
Lynch: Struggled big time in his first 3 years and broke out with 33 goals in his 4th year. Schache more impressive in his first two than Lynch was by far.
Kennedy: Kicked 18 goals over 29 games - His first two years with Carlton, he managed 11 over 22.
Cameron: Came on super early. He's the exception not the rule.
Buddy: Statistically measures up quite well to Schache.

I think Franklin and Lynch are good bench marks as both early on also played in crap/young teams. Hawks would have been crud in 2005. Ditto Suns for the first few years.

 

[Nunez]

I think Franklin and Lynch are good bench marks as both early on also played in crap/young teams. Hawks would have been crud in 2005. Ditto Suns for the first few years.

Agreed, and if we look at it overall, he is doing better than Lynch and as good as Buddy. I'll take that.

 

[alscotoz2]

I reckon when he took that hanger last year and last night when his big arms when high in the air and snaffled that first grab, he had a standout attribute. Schache has come in and had to deal with Carlisle and Brown (big bodied opponents) and then last night Rance and Astbury. Funny how Weidemann from Melbourne has looked average in the games without Hogan in the team. I can't wait for Schache and Hipwood to have 5 preseasons under their belts, they are going to have some fun at the GABBA!

Hopefully playing for the Lions

 

[SizeMatters]

The thing I dislike about Schache the most is his inability to even try to compete for or shield the ball drop zone. Some posters are coming out and saying those who see these faults are more or less saying he is failed and shouldn't be playing AFL, which is ignorant and completely wrong. He needs more aggression simple as that. You can't measure this from stats... if that's the case then Liam Jones would have been the next Plugger in his first few seasons but he is soft as well.

 

[M Malice]

 

[Royboys44]

In terms of goals/behinds ahead of Lynch,Kennedy,Franklin and not far behind Hawkins and Cameron. Tracking very nicely

This is the smartest post and approach I've heard. Also remember that Schache is playing in a developing team! Not having senior players around him! Time is the key factor and being patient and remaining calm and loyal.

 

[jackess]

This is the smartest post and approach I've heard. Also remember that Schache is playing in a developing team! Not having senior players around him! Time is the key factor and being patient and remaining calm and loyal.

I don't think stats is the best measure. Compare Squizzy and Bontempellis first seasons.

 

[Nunez]

Honestly people expect so much for a second year forward. His contested marking was brilliant last year and he'll work into form as he gets match fitness.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I'm not worried about what the end product will be with Schache but I am a bit disappointed with the lack of hunger. Probably just lacking a bit in confidence after coming back from an injury and no doubt the contract negotiation stuff will be weighing on his mind.

 

[BuntonRules]

I reckon all this talk about Schack lacking hunger is like people used to say Mark Waugh did not care.

 

[Gadzorks]

When you are a young player you don't know how to pace yourself so you play conservatively so you don't run out of legs and embarrass yourself or your team in the last quarter.

Schache will get the aggression, which uses a lot of energy, going when he feels confident his body can make the distance, which will come over this season and next as his body matures.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I reckon all this talk about Schack lacking hunger is like people used to say Mark Waugh did not care.

That could well be right

 

[Caiphus]

I think Schache has a lot of hunger, you don't cover the ground like he does without it.