News In the shadow of a final

[tommyk72]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/in-the-shadow-of-a-final-20111203-1ock8.html

THERE’S a fine line between heroism and villainy sometimes. In the case of Hawthorn defender Ryan Schoenmakers’ most recent game of AFL football, about a couple of minutes.

Had the Hawks hung on to a three-point lead in the preliminary final against Collingwood, the post-season talk might have been about his surge out of defence and long bomb into attack to set up what would have been Lance Franklin’s amazing match-winning snap.

Good to hear such positive talk. Hopefully it results in a really big year where shoey moves from being a developing youngster to a to 12 player.

 

[Fastback]

He'll be fine, once he bulks up and is confident in his physical ability he'll be a very good player for us.

 

[WWSD]

Schoenmakers is still only 21. Give him time. Another couple of Pre Seaons and he will be great. CHB will be his position for the next 10 years.

 

[Roddy]

Yep, still very young and inexperienced. Needs to be given more of a go. Playing CHB on big gorillas has gotta be the hardest position on the ground to play. He'll step up in 2012, and if he does, we'll win the flag.

 

[savagelunchbox]

Needs to learn to defend the high ball if he's going to become a '10 year defender'

 

[Roger Rogerson]

That is a good refresher on Schoey's year.

He was a forgotten man for much of the first half of the year and it is a credit to him that he fought into the AFL side and played in 3 finals and he did play some good footy at times.

He is at the 35 game mark which is still very green but it is only upward and onward from here.

Here's hoping he gets through the preseason unscathed.

Super important youngster.

 

[HAWKS HEROES]

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/in-the-shadow-of-a-final-20111203-1ock8.html



Good to hear such positive talk. Hopefully it results in a really big year where shoey moves from being a developing youngster to a to 12 player.

sure is way better then the negative rubbish people have been posting about him

 

[Pessimistic]

I guess it confirms he will stay as a defender, albeit an attacking one

 

[Dewwwww]

The only thing Ryan lacks is experience. Once he gets another 35-45 games under his belt he will be a very solid player. I remember it wasn't too long ago that Tom Murphy was the no1 player copping it from the supporters due to some of his errors. Now with 70plus games under his belt I can't remember the last time Tom lost a one on one contest. I expect Ryan to follow a similar path in 2 years time.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Age 21 is when KPP have break out years. Either they do it at 21 or stagnate and maybe find another gear at age 27.

This is an important year for Ryan - I've got full faith in him.

 

[Rioli magic]

Age 21 is when KPP have break out years. Either they do it at 21 or stagnate and maybe find another gear at age 27.

This is an important year for Ryan - I've got full faith in him.

Can't agree with you here mate, I'm sure it happens but I don't think turning 21 is the difference. Experience, fitness, maturity, team success etc, I'm sure plenty have blossomed at 22/23 whatever, there's nothing to say if Ryan doesn't "break out" this year he's already peaked.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Can't agree with you here mate, I'm sure it happens but I don't think turning 21 is the difference. Experience, fitness, maturity, team success etc, I'm sure plenty have blossomed at 22/23 whatever, there's nothing to say if Ryan doesn't "break out" this year he's already peaked.

Just a theory of mine that players, especially KPP have development bursts at 21 and 27. You don't have to agree with it.

 

[Rioli magic]

Just a theory of mine that players, especially KPP have development bursts at 21 and 27. You don't have to agree with it.

I don't agree with it, what's the basis for a development burst 21 years after you were born but not 22? 27 but not 26? Experience is the biggest factor in development, not when you were born.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

I don't agree with it, what's the basis for a development burst 21 years after you were born but not 22? 27 but not 26? Experience is the biggest factor in development, not when you were born.

Experience + physical maturity. There's a whole bell curve so don't get too caught up on it.

 

[Rioli magic]

Experience + physical maturity. There's a whole bell curve so don't get too caught up on it.

How does this fit in a bell curve? 21 > 24 < 27

 

[Baz_hawk]

Big year going up for Shoey. I'd really like to see Clarko give him some time in the forward line to learn some things from defenders and also see the game through a forwards eyes. I know he was a forward in the juniors but playing on a quality defender I reckon would help him out immensely.

That being said, I think he has shown glimpses of what he can do and it's just a matter of getting his confidence up and learning to use his strength in a contest. He'll be a big improver next year.

 

[J0NNY B]

Interesting read about the intuition you need as a defender. Good to hear AC is backing players to put themselves out there. I don't think shoey will ever become a true negating defender.

 

[eldorado]

I don't think he's at his best trying to outwrestle an opponent.

Sometimes I think he would be better served forgetting his opponent and just backing himself to be first to the ball with a mark or fist, like Stratton tends to do.

 

[Easy Slips Catch]

I don't think he's at his best trying to outwrestle an opponent.

Sometimes I think he would be better served forgetting his opponent and just backing himself to be first to the ball with a mark or fist, like Stratton tends to do.

A bit more confidence and more aggression and he should be right.

 

[Camnstell]

Liked the article, especially how Clarko mentioned mistakes some of the other boys made during the game and even referring to the error Hodgey made in that game late 2008 (trying to switch across half back with his right foot, turnover, goal to cats, game over) but turned it around to make an impact a short time later. Like the message.

Schoe is the gorilla we've all been clamouring for. As LP said he's only 21, ha's staked on a heap of size since coming to the club and is only going to get bigger. I see him filling out to a Daniel Merrett type size physically.

Combine that with his good attitude and backing from the coaching panel and we have a ripper pn our hands. I really believe that.

 

[Brishawk]

How does this fit in a bell curve? 21 > 24 < 27

Two Sigmoidal curves would explain it.

Imagine the steep bit is at about age 21 and then on a second sigmoidal curve attached to the top of this one the steep bit would be age 27.

So 21 not greater than 24 but not the same rate of improvement.

 

[Hawkzzz]

Looking at that final quarter vs the Pies, it's ridiculous to suggest one dropped mark, which resulted in a ball up (and not a direct goal) was the difference.

Shoe was solid and heaps of errors were made in the midfield and kicking to the forward line.

We see now that Hawkins (as shown in the GF) happened to hit probably the best purple patch in his career. Shoe was not the only guy struggling to negate Hawkins.

Considering his stuffed pre season and repeated injuries in 2011, he showed a lot. I'm really hoping he has a great summer and a good run with injuries in 2012. Will be a huge component of our team imho.

 

[Pessimistic]

Hawks failed to ice the game after Buddys goal with less than 4 mins to go

Pies gained the lead with just over 3 mins to go and successfully iced the game after that, playing chip chip around the boundary - ironically what the hawks get canned for doing.

Not much difference between 3 and 4 minutes.

THAT lost us the game


PS We'll need to put a ruckman type on Hawkins

 

[Ram-Man]

Liked the article, especially how Clarko mentioned mistakes some of the other boys made during the game and even referring to the error Hodgey made in that game late 2008 (trying to switch across half back with his right foot, turnover, goal to cats, game over) but turned it around to make an impact a short time later. Like the message.

“I was really pleased with his game. Yes, he made a couple of errors, but I could also point out some errors that Sam Mitchell made and Luke Hodge made and Grant Birchall made that haven’t been highlighted as game-defining, but were just as crucial to us either winning or losing that game of footy.” - Clarkson

 

[whiteTiga2k]

I like Schoey... thought he played well in the Pies game... if not for the few errors. But yeah... he is 21... Next year will be his year! ALWAYS HAWTHORN BABY!!!