Nathan Van Berlo - New midfield coach

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Golumless

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Yeah their midfield IS very good when you look at the talent, which makes the under performance even more stark.

To quote from the eagles own board

Well, the million dollar question is 2019/2020 underperformance or was 2018 a year where the Eagles overperformed? I know the talent on paper is good, but one should never trust 'on paper'.

Taking a gander through the 2018 team v opponents differentials, a part of me believes 2018 was very much everything clicking for West Coast, seeing they were averaging 26 more kicks than their opponents, 12 more marks and yet, and an absolutely staggeringly 7 less clangers (which includes 4 less turnovers) a game with on average 231 meters gained. Not even Hawks of 13-15 could claim that seeing they never managed 7 less clangers (usually hovering around the 2-3 mark which is still insane for the amount of kicking they're doing) and they were pulling similar numbers offensively. Defensively, they were ok. Didn't do many of the 1% (losing out on average by 6), and they were on par with their opponents with tackling, and were one of the best components of intercepting marks.

If we do look at 2019, defensively, West Coast improve. They're tackling more regularly than their opponents (on average 3.0 tackles better), and doing more 1%ers. Intercepts though, well they go from top 4 to bottom 4. 2020 sees the tackling drop off, to a bottom 4 side standard, the 1%ers get even better and intercepts remain a bottom 4 side. Offensively is more interesting. 2019 comes down with a thud. Averaging 4 more kicks, 8 more marks and only 0.2 clangers less than their opponents despite being 16th in the league for meters gained. 2020 is slightly better averaging 10 more kicks, 6.5 marks, and the clanger rate is 3.6 less per game than their opponent, though they are still rooted to the bottom 4 in meters gained.

There are a lot of questions with 2018. Was there a premiership hangover? Was NVB as a coach not particularly meshing with a side like West Coast? Did West Coast get worked out (the Weagles Web all but dies in 2019)? Did the acquisition of Tim Kelly, and a few others returning from injury just completely mess up the balance of their midfield (seeing West Coast didn't have Gaff or NicNat for finals)? Just looking at the data it does read like a club that jagged one by everything falling into place. In terms of a summary, It does seem NVB does go alright with defensive side of things, at least, which probably bodes well with having good synergy with Nicks, and offensively was at least picking up from 2019 a bit. We'll never know if keeping Mitchell turns West Coast into a dynasty side, or they regress either.
 

SaltPeter

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You basically suggested that WCE midfield with Mitchell + NVB was good because they won the grand final, Mitchell left and they turned to sh*t = NVB no good.

So using that kind of logic, surely you can put together why Hawthorn was brought up.
Look out .. you've been 'champed' .. :p
 

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1970crow

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well that’s my assumption otherwise I cannot see why he would do this. when we see who WC appoint as mids coach next year we will really see. i was initially against it but given he will know sloane, laird, crouch already maybe it is better than a new guy that needs to build a relationship
If he wants to be a senior coach, a 3-4 year stint helping us would look good on his cv. He could be an outstanding coach, but Neil Craig inspired players aren't looking too good yet. Interestingly, both at clubs that Neil left some of his legacy at. I would prefer all links to Craig be removed, but I'm going in open minded on VB as he's highly intelligent and has been at a well run club and footy dept. But the school of Neil Craig is hard to get past.
 

1970crow

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Sam Mitchell has been midfield coach at the Hawks for the last 2 years....even the Crows midfield has performed better under Mick Godden than the Hawks midfield under Mitchell. Maybe Mitchell isn't the golden boy of midfield coaches?

2020 Crows 16th in clearances, Hawks 17th


2019 Crows 10th in clearances, Hawks 17th

There's a lot more to a midfield than winning clearances.
 

crow2crow

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If he wants to be a senior coach, a 3-4 year stint helping us would look good on his cv. He could be an outstanding coach, but Neil Craig inspired players aren't looking too good yet. Interestingly, both at clubs that Neil left some of his legacy at. I would prefer all links to Craig be removed, but I'm going in open minded on VB as he's highly intelligent and has been at a well run club and footy dept. But the school of Neil Craig is hard to get past.
apparently VBs wife is from adelaide so now I understand it totally 😉
 

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1970crow

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No sh*t Sherlock!

If you care to go back and look at some of the GBU matchreviews Clearances (lack of) was regularly mentioned.
I must have missed the context. You seemed to respond to a claim regarding midfield performance with a stats post solely about clearances. And we know that clearances as a stat sits alongside the other 2 most meaningless stats, hit outs and defender disposal efficiency.

Clearances is a dull stat, it’s about brute force. It does speak to intent at contest. But not much more in terms of evaluating midfield performance.
 

hey shorty

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I must have missed the context. You seemed to respond to a claim regarding midfield performance with a stats post solely about clearances. And we know that clearances as a stat sits alongside the other 2 most meaningless stats, hit outs and defender disposal efficiency.

Clearances is a dull stat, it’s about brute force. It does speak to intent at contest. But not much more in terms of evaluating midfield performance.
Scores from clearances is that stat you want to be good at in the midfield.
 

1970crow

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Scores from clearances is that stat you want to be good at in the midfield.
Even then, clearances are but a small % of a game of football. It's not gridiron, our stoppage blokes don't sit on the bench waiting for a stoppage. There's a sh*t tin of open play that vastly outweighs the stoppage stat. Stoppage stats are for the truely stupid.
 

hey shorty

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Even then, clearances are but a small % of a game of football. It's not gridiron, our stoppage blokes don't sit on the bench waiting for a stoppage. There's a sh*t tin of open play that vastly outweighs the stoppage stat. Stoppage stats are for the truely stupid.
Given the amount of stoppages in a game these days it's a crucial part of the game.
 

Mutineer

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It's not. Pure clearance win/loss stats are largely meaningless.
Winning a clearance gets the ball going the team's way, it's then up to the players forward of the clearance to position themselves to take advantage. You only have to look at Richmond who just look to get the ball moving forward being it a knock on or kicking it off the ground etc as long as it keeps the ball in forward motion.
 

1970crow

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Winning a clearance gets the ball going the team's way, it's then up to the players forward of the clearance to position themselves to take advantage. You only have to look at Richmond who just look to get the ball moving forward being it a knock on or kicking it off the ground etc as long as it keeps the ball in forward motion.
Ground ball gets. Walsh wasn't wrong.
 

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