Planning for our first Premiership...

[chinggis77]

No secret that we are currently rebuilding for our next assault on the premiership after the failed attempt of Connolly's team.

IMO our premiership window could be one of the following:

• In 2-3 years time before our key position players such as Pavlich, Tarrant, Macpharlin (yes he was crap yesterday but put him back to CHB and he should be okay), Grover (may already be past it) and some key supporting players such as Haselby, Soloman, Headland and Hayden retire (all 28-29). I think we are still 2-3 class players (particularly a in and under player) away from having a team capable of having a crack within this timeframe. Much will depend on this years draft.
• In 4-5 years time when Hill/Suban/Palmer/Ibbo etc are at their peak - however this will require us to find replacements for some of the Key Position posts due to the lack of 22-28 year old players in these positions (excluding hacks such as Murphy, Campbell, Drum, Dodd etc...). This is the big unknown IMO. This years draft (no 17 year olds) and next years particularly will have all the talent sucked out by Gold Coast. Our record on drafting KPP is horrible apart from Pav. We will need some very astute drafting or just pure luck. For this timeframe therefore I think we need to find some class key position players for the backline and particularly the forward line. In addition we will still need some additional class around the middle - particluarly an in and under player.
• If we do not find some class KPP's and another good one or two in-and-under players in the next 2-3 compromised drafts we may need to wait even longer.

The Gold Coast and West Sydney draft concessions are going to make it very hard for us. Our recruiters will need to find some good classy KPP from the middle picks of the draft in all likelihood. If you look at this years draft, Butcher and Scully may be picked up by Melbourne who will tank to get a priority. Beyond Butcher there are not that many great KPP on offer. Maybe a Morabito type player who is similar to Goodes.

The midfielders in the draft is very strong so we should be able to pick up a good in and under midfielder. The real concern are the key position posts.

IMO many clubs will also need to look outside the U18's at players in the 19-22 year age bracket in the WAFL/SANFL/VFL etc. Are there any good KPP in the WAFL in the 19-21 age bracket - someone that has come on a bit late?

How about playing Campbell back and grooming him to take over from Taz? We need some back up down there in case Taz goes down or retires early. Campbell strikes me as someone who would do well back there. He's aggressive and hits the contest hard.

The other hope is that someone like Sibsado or Shephard surprise us and become very good players.

It all higlights that there is still a lot of work to do to get us a team that can compete for a premiership. At the moment I think we may make finals in 2-3 years time but it will take a lot of luck to pinch a premiership.

 

[Lach72]

If we're going to use Pav as a midfielder, Johnson and Headland go forward, Tarrant and McPharlin become the tall defenders and Grover can be the third all until he's past it.
But I thought yesterday, we were also at least serviceable in the guts when Pav was forward in the last quarter.
We won the clearances against a midfield containing Ablett, Corey, Bartel and Selwood and Ling FFS... that's something I never would've dreamed of going into the game

 

[Lach72]

Mitch Duncan would be an all right tallish option, maybe Griffith/ I keep hearing his name about

 

[Chops_a_must]

Grover can be the third all until he's past it.

Too late.

 

[chinggis77]

If we're going to use Pav as a midfielder, Johnson and Headland go forward, Tarrant and McPharlin become the tall defenders and Grover can be the third all until he's past it.
But I thought yesterday, we were also at least serviceable in the guts when Pav was forward in the last quarter.
We won the clearances against a midfield containing Ablett, Corey, Bartel and Selwood and Ling FFS... that's something I never would've dreamed of going into the game

There are a lot of "if's" in that plan.

Grover appears gone. Headland's body is letting him down and may continue to let him down. Mcpharlin has been carp and has been for a while. Agree with Johnson up forward as a roaming CHF and Mcpharlin down CHB if he can regain his mojo. In fact I would like to see Taz at CHB and Mcpharlin at FB. That way Taz can use his big motor and I can really see him being a rebounding defender setting up a lot of attacks from there.

If we can find another good midfielder or two (get rid of Schammer who is more likely to cost us a premiership than bring one) then we can send Pav to FF. Then we may be a chance to pinch a premiership in the next 2-3 years before Pav and co retire.

We really need to be planning to replace these guys though as the crop of KPP's in the 22-28 age bracket are absolute carp. If we can't pinch a premiership in 2-3 years and we don't replace them, we are in for another long wait.

As said before - I think we retain Campbell, send back to WAFL as a backman to groom him for a key back role if Mcpharlin continues to be carp.

 

[Lach72]

Campbell would take five weeks to get up to speed...as a back man that's a no no

 

[chinggis77]

Campbell would take five weeks to get up to speed...as a back man that's a no no

Agree. Hence why I said send him back to the WAFL as a backman to groom him for a back role (see post above yours).

 

[Lach72]

Agree. Hence why I said send him back to the WAFL as a backman to groom him for a back role (see post above yours).

I meant speed as in pace...he's as slow as a wet week

 

[chinggis77]

I meant speed as in pace...he's as slow as a wet week

Ah, okay, now I see the sarcasm in your post! "Five weeks to get up to speed" = he has no acceleration. Not 5 weeks to learn to play the position.

 

[Papa Juggs]

Pav and Sandi are the key.

Extraordinary players. The Hawks and Geelong got young players up very quickly and Freo should be able to do the same.

With Palmer back next year the 2010 flag is a possibility. Just gotta put those away wins on the board to make the finals.

 

[Lach72]

Pav and Sandi are the key.

Extraordinary players. The Hawks and Geelong got young players up very quickly and Freo should be able to do the same.

With Palmer back next year the 2010 flag is a possibility. Just gotta put those away wins on the board to make the finals.

I like your thoughts but that is just fantasy land stuff

 

[summerthebat]

The good thing about the 2009 draft, is that Melbourne will not be chasing a KPP player, you would imagine they would pick the best mid available.

You would imagine if West Coast finished below us they wouldn't be selecting a KPP, unless their young midfielders step up in the 2nd half of the year.

Richmond may be the only team that may select the best possible player at that pick, though I think we will finish below them.

This draft is so important for us, we have to get this right.

 

[Lach72]

The good thing about the 2009 draft, is that Melbourne will not be chasing a KPP player, you would imagine they would pick the best mid available.

You would imagine if West Coast finished below us they wouldn't be selecting a KPP, unless their young midfielders step up in the 2nd half of the year.

Richmond may be the only team that may select the best possible player at that pick, though I think we will finish below them.

This draft is so important for us, we have to get this right.

Melbourne will get two top 3 picks.
Scully and Butcher will probably go

 

[chinggis77]

I like your thoughts but that is just fantasy land stuff

I agree. A lot more than that needs to happen if we are to challenge for a premiership in the next 2-3 years.

More dead wood needs to go. More kids need to come in. Another good in-and-under midfielder. Some backup KPP to eventually take over from Taz/Pav/Mcpharlin because Connolly left us with useless KPP's in the 22-28 age bracket. Existing kids need to come on (no guarantee there). Luck on the injury side.

Yes, Sandi/Pav are elite. But we still have a lot of ordinary players who make ordinary decisions and have ordinary skills.

 

[longsuffreosupp]

All things clicking, putting the strongest team on the park, evolving the team with the game plan, getting rid of the crabs - there's no reason why we cant push the top 4 in 2011.

 

[tassie ted]

on the train back to freo after sundays game a bloke was adamant that you don't need big key fowards to win at the mcg. He sai d that those days are gone and footy is not played like that anymore. I strongly disagreed and still think that we could have won yesterday with a decent bg marking ff and only teams with exceptional mid fields consistantly win finals at the g without a couple of big fowards.

 

[longsuffreosupp]

You reckon you need two nice tall forwards and 2 specialist crumbers. You also need some smart team work to isolate them one on one with the defender. In todays football, the flood moves very quick.

 

[Rob]

Keep in mind that there will probably be another decent cull at the end of the year with another 6-8 kids coming in.

I reckon 2012 at the earliest is a realistic ambition. Hopefully have a bunch of kids with 50-100 games under their belts with Pavlich, Hasleby and Tarrant still playing decent footy. Hopefully.

 

[silverscope]

I think next year will be a little better, in terms of win/loss ratio, but we probably wont play finals. But in 2011/12 i would expect us to be playing finals/pushing for that cup!

 

[Dyslexic Emo]

The way I see it, 2010 will look like this

• Adelaide will have a mass cleanout of their older exeperienced players and will slide down the ladder

• Brisbane will continue to rely on J brown to win them matches but since he is so incredibly overrated they will still be crap

• Carlton will continue to sprout the 'they know were coming' but will fail miserably and will try to buy some more players

• Collingwood will still be usless even with the easiest draw in the AFL

• Essendon will run run and run some more but go nowhere

• Geelong who are already on the way down will continue to progressivley get worse and worse
• Hawthorn will still be suffering from the premiership hangover oof 2008
• The Kangaroos will be so poor that they sell their home games, players and their first born kids in an effort to survive, unfortunately they will end up going broke mid seson and have to pull out
• Melbourne will still be tanking to pick up draft picks
• Port will be useless
• Richmond will be useless
• Western Bulldogs will be suffering form the premiership hangover
• the saints will still be useless and will still be smarting from being knocke dout of the finals in straight sets which they wont recover from in the next 20 years
• West Coast will still be tanking and taking it up the arse
• Sydney will continue to be uselss

So that only leaves us to take out the flag, my arguments are bullet proof and irrefutable.

Word

 

[kp junior]

The way I see it, 2010 will look like this

• Adelaide will have a mass cleanout of their older exeperienced players and will slide down the ladder

• Brisbane will continue to rely on J brown to win them matches but since he is so incredibly overrated they will still be crap

• Carlton will continue to sprout the 'they know were coming' but will fail miserably and will try to buy some more players

• Collingwood will still be usless even with the easiest draw in the AFL

• Essendon will run run and run some more but go nowhere

• Geelong who are already on the way down will continue to progressivley get worse and worse
• Hawthorn will still be suffering from the premiership hangover oof 2008
• The Kangaroos will be so poor that they sell their home games, players and their first born kids in an effort to survive, unfortunately they will end up going broke mid seson and have to pull out
• Melbourne will still be tanking to pick up draft picks
• Port will be useless
• Richmond will be useless
• Western Bulldogs will be suffering form the premiership hangover
• the saints will still be useless and will still be smarting from being knocke dout of the finals in straight sets which they wont recover from in the next 20 years
• West Coast will still be tanking and taking it up the arse
• Sydney will continue to be uselss

So that only leaves us to take out the flag, my arguments are bullet proof and irrefutable.

Word

Well thought out, insightful post.

 

[rgauci]

Ive often thought about this.

Im not sure you can wait for our next crop of talls to come through. By that time Pav and Sandi will probably be ending their career. They are two matchwinners which we have to complement. Sandilands will hit his peak form in the next few years. Ruckman always peak late. He'll be truly unstoppable taking grabs forward and dominating clearances for us.

Tarrant (28)
McPharlin (27)
Sandilands (26)
Johnson (24)
Pavlich (27)

Thats a bloody good spine. Definately premiership potential. We've unearthed some bloody good small players this season. Hill is a superstar and will be amazing next year after his first full preseason. Matt DeBoer i think after another preseason could be that big bodied extractor we've been missing since Cook. With the development of Schammer and Duffield this year we've definately found some depth through the middle. Ibbotson, Palmer, Mayne, Suban, Ballantyne add to the classy smalls on our list.

Im hopeful another bumper draft like last season could see us seriously challenging in 2 seasons time. Even next season if the injury gods smile.

Otherwise we may as well throw out the baby and the bath water. If we need to develop talls again we are 5+ years away. Which is a scary thought.

 

[longsuffreosupp]

Could be the reason why we signed on Murph for a couple - just praying that he'd get some balls.

Johnson going forward has some merit, but it has to be permanent. We have a few players now that can swing down there, but we are still crap in getting some decent scores.

Dont forget about Des too. If the body holds up, I can see him retiring in the forward line.

 

[salim malik]

Depth was the question mark at the beginning of this season and if we copped injuries we would be in trouble.That happened and we are,but there has been a silver lining to the loss of Rhys,Crowley,Mayne etc and that has been the fast tracking of the kids .Coupled with the improvement of Duff and Schammer we go into 2010 with what we lacked 2009 depth.Pick our best 22 for next season with some handy depth players pushing for a spot and we will make the finals.

 

[chinggis77]

The results of our drafting this year will be just as crucial to our chances of a shot at the premiership in 2011-12 as was last years draft.

If the powers that be see that we have a shot in 2011-12 then they will probably go for a gun midfielder with their first pick. Someone who can help to take the load off Pav so Pav can go forward. Pav as a forward with a gun midfield is a potentially premiership winning combination.

If the powers that be see our shot as being a bit after 2011-12 then they may go for a KPP to replace some of the KPP players that will be retiring around 2011-12.

I would think the former is what will happen. First 1-2 picks will be mids with some KPP's down the order. This draft is going to be very strong for midfielders and quite weak for KPP's. The only standout KPP is Butcher and Melbourne will tank so they get him and Scully. There is exceptional depth in the midfield ranks though. If you look at a 2nd tier state like Tassie - they have some potential guns this year who have taken it right up to the 1st tier state midfields. WA has exceptional depth in the midfield also.

I also wonder if we are a chance of nabbing an ex-WA boy such as Moss or someone like a Hogan from Geelong (very highly rated young midfielder who can't get a game because of the midfield strength). Both would be great as they have been in the system for a few years and would be peaking at the right time (2011-12).